Medellin vs Cali - "The Chick Scene"

[maritime04]

dennis i can agree and understand what you are saying.
 
I have to ask with all the first dates, and conversations you have dont you ever get bored of the " introduction" and "getting to know you phase" its like Déjà vu over and over again!
 
I felt like i was having the same conversation over and over again, who i was, why i choose to live in Colombia, where i studied, how school was; relationship with my family, ect...ect..ect..
 
100,000 COP is alot, but i have not been in the "game" for more then 2 1/2 years. I have no doubt things may have changed over the years.
 
Ill be very honest when i was single in Medellin, i spent about 2,000 USD PLUS a month in dating fees, agencys, hookers, movies with girls, dinners, coffee, ect...and then paid normal living expenses.
 
Personally i have a hard time telling the diffrence between a guy who walks into false II, and a guy who walks into American sweethearts, both are paying. at sweethearts its costs you 50,000 COP for a date; and at false dose 150,000 COP for a nut.

[dennislevy]

As I said to Micky when I had coffee with him in Laureles last week...

the geat advantage of so many first dates is I ve gotten to test market my presentation!, more then 200 times!  . I KNOW what works! At least in my dating niche!.

When I talked to a Colombian woman at least during the last year, I knew what I was going to say..always...it was  always the truth.....a little humor...some self deprecation......so I never got bored.....but I could also concentrate on HER....concentrate on what she was saying and more importantly...what she wasnt saying and her body language.

Some posters may not believe me.but 15 minutes into the first date....I could actually say to myself...If I want to make love to this woman ...it will take 2 dates..or 3 dates or even if I liked a woman .....I have no chance with this woman. its one date, over and out...

and some..I could  say after the first smile and hug.. TONIGHT! FIRST DATE!

Its not bragging....I just have had so much experience meeting women from 38 to 50....

My views on using prepagos are well known, I ve never done it....and I ve never spent ANYWHERE NEAR the money you have.....jejejeje!

I LIVED ATE and DATED in Medellin for 1800-2000 a month.

I remember walking into Colombian Angels a few weeks ago...because I had met a happy couple, good American guy and his lady and they had met at the agency.....and I was just curious...and when the agency wrker told me that I was required to  pay transportation for a date both ways....I said politely..... that s a deal killer.

If a woman lived in Bello or Itagui and the date ended at night, of course I would pay for a taxi...and of course, if she spent the night with me....but for a first date, if a woman can t get on a bus and buy a combo for the bus and metro for what?  2100 pesos?

NEXT!

I always took women out nicely but never extravagantly...50,000 pesos was about the normal dinner check....but I don t drink and I trid to find women who didn drink or didnt drink much.....as well.

The last two encounters I had in Medellin...and I had given up my apartment in Veledromo months before...when I went on the road....

I rented a private room with a huge bed  in a very nice hostal for 60,000 pesos....Hostal Global on Cra 35, number 758..we went to dinner at Gastro Bistronomo on the corner of 10th and 35th or Paellas and Parillas cra 9, 43B, number 138............. and both times the dinner check was 50,000 or under...and it was great chow, and romantic atmospheres.

So spening a night wth a woman in Medellin and even renting a nice room and doing it for about 100-120,000 pesos (including taxi fare) is entirely possible.

And I appreciate your honesty!!!!!.....

Dennis

[maritime04]

Theres no point in lying online in a fourm that can only assist and help you deal with dating, marrying and loving forign women.
 
If you like dating and meeting women and having good conversations thats great, theres alot of guys out there whom are sooo shallow they would not know a good thing if it came there way.
 
I totally believe you, and dennis be honest you are bragging, but its ok to bragg now and again.
 
Its polite to pay a ladies way, especially if she comes from a lower "estrato", but if your dating professional older women i can understand how the first red flag is if she tries to squeez 12 mill from you for her ride. its Colombia and money is tight, and 6-12 dollars for her transport to/from is not alot to pay for quality company intresting conversation and eye candy.
 
I made alot of money back then and partied like a rock star, and i think it left my system or maybe i saw the hole at the end of the road, and decided to not miss a good thing. but your right i lived large

[dennislevy]

As Muhammed Ali once said

It aint braggin´if you say that you can do it and then you do it!  jejeje

What i always looked for was motivation.....and pride.....amd what was the woman willing to do to make a possible realtionship happen .....and to start 2100 pesos to get herself to a first date is feasible  even for a woman from Bello or Itagui.

I might also add and this is hearsay that Ive heard .that a couple of agencies in Medllin have a reputation for signing up  beautifu prepagos for free....and then splitting what the men ante up to meet the woman......with her and of course whatever she charges the man is hers....

And if its true, I was NEVER gonna play THAT game.

I ve used agencies before, but only in Bogota and the woman paid fees, up to 200,000 for a one year membership ad NO woman ever propositioned me.....and only ONE tried to hustle me for money.......and  that is s out of about 130 women that I ve  met in Bogota agencies.

[Researcher]

100,000 pesos is way too much - you're overpaying. You can get your pipes cleaned for 20,000 easy. So that $13,0000 is really about $2600 which is probably less than you actually paid on the "free" sex.

     The cost of prostitution in a thread started by Zon...hahaha!!! It's no big surprise!


       Researcher

[Zon]

This site works best when used to gather information about South America (Colombia mostly) and women in South America, their tendencies and characteristics.  Most active members use this place like a social outlet, like old fashionied CB radios.  And, because of this there is a culture here that is disproportionately made up of pensioners, workin men, and marriage agency customers.  So threads drift and seem to always end up on the same location.  That is great for a church congregation, but not so great for an internet discussion board.

(Ironically, most of the North Americans I meet in the Caribbean, Costa Rica, Brazil or Argentian are men with choices and means; the kind of men than can make sh$t happen.   These kind of men are trying to get THE MOST out of life by design ... no relying on dumb luck, or what is avialable in their own back yard.)

Underneath the statements and positions being discussed here now is the concept of "COMPROMISE."   Be careful where this leads, gentlemen.  It is found in many places, not just at the street corners.  To be fair this questions is a part of many relationships, perhaps even your own? 

Last night I meet a friend, a very wealthy guy of 55.  He was with a 32 year old beautiful woman.  They both seemed happy and "together" ... but it is highly unlikely that this attractive women would be so happy with this man if he were not a millionaire. Is there a compromise here?

When I reflect on the many, many good and well meaning relationships between a gringo and a Colombiana (or an American and a Filipino, or an American and a Russian, or Romanian) I know personally, OBVIOSULY there was motivation on the women's part to know and start a nest with a gringo, because of ...  Is there a compromise here?

When I reflect on the dates I had with agency girls ...  they were looking, first off and foremost, for an acceptable bridge to a better life.  OH I am sure they would do there best to "buy into" the deal.  But, is there a compromise here?

Now, there are good old fashion love affairs too ... and I think that is what every man hopes for this ... but, let's be honest, such relationships are few and far between when you are dealing with physical and financial extremes.





 

[dennislevy]

Zon

OK lets have this conversation, because I think I am one of he guys you are referring to. I am a former marriage agency customer, and I am retired but not a persioner and I worked my butt off for a lot of years and I ve owned my own busienss as part of my work career in the US. I was a cedar home dealer, sunroom dealer and a general contractor.

There are men who are way WEALTHIER then ME....but you know I think I ve made a fair amount of s...t happen in Colombia....

How a man sees a woman is up to him. You can put a beautiful dress and jewelry on a poor woman, teach her how to strut....and maybe different men will see the same woman differently.

There are many men who see women as trohpies.....how young is she? How big are her boobs? yadda, yadda, yadda....

And if they want to use  their money to assure the availabilty of a YOUNG and BEAUTIFUL woman. its the oldest deal in recorded history...youth and beauty in return for security. 

But people CHANGE, both men and women change, they change how they think, and how they see their mate.

And one day the WEALTHY man gets tired of his beautiful trophy, becasue she has put on a couple of pounds or maybe she always had a crrappy personality.....

And she s tired of faking it because he couldnt find his way around her pleasure centers with his tongue, two hands and a flashlight.......

And so despite all the money and the nice life style...they split up and go on to better DEALS

iN CONTRAST......I talked with a Colombian couple from Pasto yesterday we were on line at the border checkpoint at Rumichaca waiting to enter the Equador border control building. The line was long, moved slowly and we had a chance to talk.

They had been married 33 years, had two kids, it was obvious that niether had ever been in a fashion magazine...he was a skinny guy, she was dumpy, but she had a terrific smile and after all those years, they were still very happy with each other. Her eyes shone when she looked at ther husband and he was very cariñoso with her.....went and bought her a tinto...brought a big blanket from the car..... so she would stay warm.

Thats reality, that is LOVE....just very good people who probably didn t start off with the proverbial pot to piss in. raised kids and are happy with each other. They probably MAdDE ENOUGH REAL LIFE COMPROMISES...and they have endured.

I think what youre talking about is more of a temporary  business contract......with a negotiation

.





 

.

[Zon]

No, DL; other than using this forum for a social network, you are specifically OUTSIDE the scope of my reference!  You are living life with your eyes wide open.  You are not taking shortcuts.  If you died today, I think you would be happy with your decisions.  On the other hand, I do not see you as a hungry heart guy, trying to find his soulmate buy buying a handful of dates AMYMORE, either.

This place gets very small when any poster takes on a personality and goes off-topic.  Here, especially, the pot calls the kettle black ... all who are reading or posting are wed by a single common interest, regardless of the exact motivation.

Yes, there is a romantic preoccupation HERE that borders on the unrealistic - agency hype finds furtile ground here (I do not care if people use agencies or not)  And, yes there are many active here that are "fans" but either have married years ago, and/or have no intention of travelling.

But, there are shades of compromise in almost every "well-meaning" and not so "well-meaning" relationship that arises from two people originating from two different worlds and economies.  For the debate to create a dividing line between the good and proper versus the wrong ...  is a gross oversimplification; and delusional.

I much prefer to read these pages as a traveller than a wife hunter.  Is it possible to be a whole man, or an eligible partner, in truth, if you write, read, or care about some of the very rudimentary and fundamental social and relationship matters often discussed here?    I think not.

[jb]

Hey Zon,

Yes, there is a romantic preoccupation HERE that borders on the unrealistic -

Curious.
Is it unrealistic to be romantic in your view in general or just in Colombia or International Dating or parts thereof , or because of the methods that folks on this forum choose to meet their sig other....?  Because it seems a lot of posters who have found that special someone seem to speak fondly and lovingly towards their s.o.

Is it possible to be a whole man, or an eligible partner, in truth, if you write, read, or care about some of the very rudimentary and fundamental social and relationship matters often discussed here?    I think not.

I must not understand you.  Are you saying you can't be a quality person/potential partner and care about matters discussed on this board pertaining to relationships?   I must be misunderstanding your above statement.

thanks

[fathertime]

     The cost of prostitution in a thread started by Zon...hahaha!!! It's no big surprise!


       Researcher

Bingo Researcher, if anybody wants to know how much it costs to buy sex with a prostitute I'd hit zonnyboy up and see what kind of input he can give you without charging!  Anybody who wants to know how to make a relationship/marriage work with a younger Latina woman will find more truths being told by those involved in this type of relationship, not from guys like zon who start out  LYING to the ladies by giving them a false age on colombiancupid or whatever site he hangs his hat.  His reference and compass is far far askew! 

Fathertime!

[Tanuki]

Zon-I am not sure I agree with what you are saying.  I get the feeling that you think everyone who is marriage hunting is desperate and I just don't think that applies to everyone.  I am not doing this out of desperation, I do this because I want something different then what I can get here.  And, I think for many (not all) of the woman, international dating is just another option for them too.  Yes, I do agree there are desperate woman but, those are pretty easy to spot.
 
And I also disagree about compromise.  If I am reading you correctly, you make it sound like compromise is a bad thing.  And I say, compromise is an important thing if you want a long and healthy relationship. I have never in my life ever met the perfect woman that meets all my expectations.  Now, I have met five or six women who if you put them all together, meet all my expectations. If your trying to find that one one woman who will meet everything you expect, you might as well try to searching for unicorns.  It ain't going to happen.  You will never find it.

[Micky]

FT -

If you want to argue,  disagree,  debate what Zon posts,  do that.  If you want continue attacking Zon and what a POS he is why don't you start a thread in the flame room.  Maybe you don't feel in your hundred anti Zon posts you have made your point.

Micky

[Micky]

"But, there are shades of compromise in almost every "well-meaning" and not so "well-meaning" relationship that arises from two people originating from two different worlds and economies. For the debate to create a dividing line between the good and proper versus the wrong ... is a gross oversimplification; and delusional." - Zon
　
 
I do think that anyone giving this statement real thought would have to agree with its crux.  All of the built in variables and dynamics of  a cross cultural man/woman relationship is off the charts.
　
 
Micky
 
 

[robert angel]

FT -

If you want to argue,  disagree,  debate what Zon posts,  do that.  If you want continue attacking Zon and what a POS he is why don't you start a thread in the flame room.  Maybe you don't feel in your hundred anti Zon posts you have made your point.

Micky

Well said--it's gotten so old that the motivation is questionable at best. It deserves it's own flame room when the largely onesided attack mode--one that doesn't appear to benefit anyone, sets in. Bad enough to carry a grudge endlessly, but to make 100's of people have to read even a few words of that pap before realizing --'oh here it goes again--the same ole shyt---I'll skip it, this is a drag" just doesn't get it. It is not useful, entertaining for many, I don't think, nor is it interesting. Yea--there's always a few who go to the circus side show, so maybe that's where it belongs-in our case, that's the flame room.

And no, I am NOT saying that debate--even argument, has no place here--actually  it is healthy as long as it doesn't border on infantile. For some, a flame war room does offer entertainment, especially when "Jackass" with Johnny Knox & co reruns aren't on your cable TV network. This place isn't all about Dear Abbyish advice or mamby pamby bull mush, nor is it about trying to expose some perceived dog and after having made your point several times, continuing on doing so in an almost OCD way.

[maritime04]

Wow, where do we go from here, where do we even start, I guess we can start Where the tides and currents take us……………………

If  Egoism is correct and we are all selfish and only motivated in our own self-interest. I can understand  “Zons” point of view in Compromise with regard to the gorgeous 32 year old women marrying the 55 year old scare crow………she compromised her standers and expectations for stability and security and a chance at the western lifestyle This is evident and LOUD, like Zon says
Although I have to ask what is the compromise of the male “ the man of means and choice”, in this relationship? You did not really state and only implied at the end of your post.  Any intelligent business man would have to accept there is no “free launch” in this world, some things have got to give; when physical and financial extremes collided there is no room for “love”; its rare like you say, so rather then even trying, or choosing to look for it we give into our self interest and appease the “inner greed” and choose the route of trophy wife, or the continued existing of the “playboy”.
If that’s the point you were trying to make, I understand but disagree not with the truth that those circumstances can lead to happiness or at least satisfied and content life, but with the fact the world is not so black and white, there is no mathematical solution for “happily ever after “, the wealthy elite can fail or succeed In love or life, separately…..
You cannot just toss out denies romantic notions as nonsense; because they have merit, I would like to think of it as something we should wish for or in the least learn from.
I apologize if I brought your thread off topic, but that’s where the tides take us.

[Researcher]

No, DL; other than using this forum for a social network, you are specifically OUTSIDE the scope of my reference!  You are living life with your eyes wide open.  You are not taking shortcuts.  If you died today, I think you would be happy with your decisions.  On the other hand, I do not see you as a hungry heart guy, trying to find his soulmate buy buying a handful of dates AMYMORE, either.

This place gets very small when any poster takes on a personality and goes off-topic.  Here, especially, the pot calls the kettle black ... all who are reading or posting are wed by a single common interest, regardless of the exact motivation.

Yes, there is a romantic preoccupation HERE that borders on the unrealistic - agency hype finds furtile ground here (I do not care if people use agencies or not)  And, yes there are many active here that are "fans" but either have married years ago, and/or have no intention of travelling.

But, there are shades of compromise in almost every "well-meaning" and not so "well-meaning" relationship that arises from two people originating from two different worlds and economies.  For the debate to create a dividing line between the good and proper versus the wrong ...  is a gross oversimplification; and delusional.

I much prefer to read these pages as a traveller than a wife hunter.  Is it possible to be a whole man, or an eligible partner, in truth, if you write, read, or care about some of the very rudimentary and fundamental social and relationship matters often discussed here?    I think not.

       I swear, could anyone write so many words and say absolutely nothing?...outside a politician that is.Zon, your words are of someone who is lost and finding their way through life.If you were just out of high school it would be normal but at your age it is just sad.I spent my adult life more single than married and had these "epiphanies" that you are having many years ago.

      You spent many years married so I understand your disdaining attitude toward marriage but please stop putting yourself on a pedestal while looking down on those that are here because they are interested in finding a foreign wife....which is, by the way, what this forum is about.If you want to talk about "the chick scene" then fine if you want to ponder life's meaning while looking down your nose at "wife hunters" then you'll probably get called on it.

      As far as Colombia and foreign women go keep on truckin'.You will eventually figure out the basics that most guys figure out within a few trips there.I get a chuckle out of your epiphanies of what to others are elementary basics of life so rock on.It keeps me somewhat entertained anyway.

    Researcher

       

[maritime04]

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/features/fashion/sfl-besame-colombia-fashion-show-20110702-photos,0,7039815.photogallery
 
thought i would share    and make the mood less tense

[maritime04]

Dennis my girl friend would call you "gringo Chchipato", (as would many girls). Its only polite to either pick her up or pay for her transportation, many colombians do this.
 
There is alot of fear from gringos that the "girl" is using them for money or going to take advantage, and i agree.
 
Few years ago i ran into an older gentleman whom was having dinner with his girlfriend (agency) and his translator (GF bestfriend) which cost him 20 Mill an hour....they were waiting for another friend of the "girl friends," but she was running late and would not make it in time, so the girl friend insisted on ordering a "to go" meal for her.......................
 
There is a line between being polite and being abused. its LARGE, BLACK, and you can not miss it

[Zon]

Micky - "anyone giving this statement real thought would have to agree with its crux"

The thread drifted to the issue of "pay for" or "sponsorship" or girl friends of gringos at the Valdez Coffee shop.  Then the moralizing started.  So, I brought up the issue of COMPROMISE to show all of (okay most of) those here are dealing with compromise IN SOME DEGREE.  (some are not aware of this)

Tanuki - The COMPROMISE I am talking about is not the give and take that happens in healthy relationships of all kinds.  I am referring to a deeper, moral compromise ... something that happens when a person acts, behaves, or accepts something that in an uncompromised position, they would not.   Again, this is seen in degrees with girls walking in short skirts in Parque Llares to a "social" sponsored by a marriage agency. 

SINCERE, NORMAL international relationships IMPOSSIBLE?  No!  they are very possible in my view.  One just needs to have there eyes wide open, and negotiate around the gray areas.

Maritime - you are correct, there are COMPROMISES on all sides.  A 60 year old, successfull man with many experiences, may be with a 30 year old very attractive women who has 2 or 3 kids and without an education. In most cases, that is less than ideal. 

But, more to the point is what a person is shooting for - what is your objective?    For some men, the answer is simple and always the same - one marriage; happy ever after.  For others, there views evolve ... open relationships, acceptance of being a bachelor, or just enjoying the endless experience of choosing.  To me, it does not matter what a guy chooses, as long as he knows where he is in the game. 

=======

After being in other countries for several months, I am always surprised with how my initial impressions change over time.  It is very difficult to draw a stable conclusion on a country, city, or person in only 5 - 10 days.   It is VERY difficult to get develop a real world relationship by internet too.  So, my comments / observations are not to take sides, or promote, a particular way.  I am just saying ...

I have noticed a BIG difference between relationships that happen by virtue of a internet site, or agency versus normal introductions and dating.  People from different countries (and economies) that meet through schools, volunteer work, or family introductions seem to be to have far less of "suspicion" than the rest.   

=======

And, I did not mean to say that men who research and use this board are not able to find what they are looking for.  But, in Latin American especially, a man has to be proud and strong and capable.  Not unconfident, and checking with the women for every decision - not a second guesser.  Much of the posts here involve very basic "birds and the bees" stuff.  When do I get my first kiss?  Am I too old?  What if she is not answering my phone call?   ect... That is a red flag on the man's side.

[maritime04]

Zon your last post i can understand. As to the COMPROMISE you speak of, its the nature of the beast, i mean we are travling to a diffrent country with diffrent economy, standards and culture yet "we" stress out when we can not find a women that meets our standards (american standards) like no-kids, educated; willing to transport her self to dates ; professional; 
 

But, more to the point is what a person is shooting for - what is your objective?    For some men, the answer is simple and always the same - one marriage; happy ever after.  For others, there views evolve ... open relationships, acceptance of being a bachelor, or just enjoying the endless experience of choosing.  To me, it does not matter what a guy chooses, as long as he knows where he is in the game. 

I did not have an objective other then having fun and being happy. I can see the mentality of the newer vistors (first timers)
To Colombia and especially Medellin, which is not the "backpacker" or" have fun travel the world "types, these are sucessfull older mature men whom are chasing a dream sold to them in "Playboy" and by "others", these guys think they can buy women, becuase it worked back home;Now they want to upgrade and get more VALUE for the money. but their happiness only lasts as long as the money or the girl chooses to stay. Colombia is too much for those types of men, they are not "alpha males" here, just go to juan valdez and ask how many times they been robbed; drugged or held at gun point, not too mentioned toyed with and cheated on. Colombian women who is invloved with a man for the things that he has is a COLD harted chica, who knows the game and can play it better then anyone.

[fathertime]

       I swear, could anyone write so many words and say absolutely nothing?...outside a politician that is.Zon, your words are of someone who is lost and finding their way through life.If you were just out of high school it would be normal but at your age it is just sad.I spent my adult life more single than married and had these "epiphanies" that you are having many years ago.

      You spent many years married so I understand your disdaining attitude toward marriage but please stop putting yourself on a pedestal while looking down on those that are here because they are interested in finding a foreign wife....which is, by the way, what this forum is about.If you want to talk about "the chick scene" then fine if you want to ponder life's meaning while looking down your nose at "wife hunters" then you'll probably get called on it.

      As far as Colombia and foreign women go keep on truckin'.You will eventually figure out the basics that most guys figure out within a few trips there.I get a chuckle out of your epiphanies of what to others are elementary basics of life so rock on.It keeps me somewhat entertained anyway.

    Researcher

     

I’m afraid I’m going to have to agree with you on this one.  If this were math, we would be talking about 1+1 here…This guy had no ideal that there were sometimes compromises involved with relationships.  DUH, what the hell was he thinking this was Wonderland!!


Fathertime!
   

[fathertime]

Well said--it's gotten so old that the motivation is questionable at best. It deserves it's own flame room when the largely onesided attack mode--one that doesn't appear to benefit anyone, sets in. Bad enough to carry a grudge endlessly, but to make 100's of people have to read even a few words of that pap before realizing --'oh here it goes again--the same ole shyt---I'll skip it, this is a drag" just doesn't get it. It is not useful, entertaining for many, I don't think, nor is it interesting. Yea--there's always a few who go to the circus side show, so maybe that's where it belongs-in our case, that's the flame room.

And no, I am NOT saying that debate--even argument, has no place here--actually  it is healthy as long as it doesn't border on infantile. For some, a flame war room does offer entertainment, especially when "Jackass" with Johnny Knox & co reruns aren't on your cable TV network. This place isn't all about Dear Abbyish advice or mamby pamby bull mush, nor is it about trying to expose some perceived dog and after having made your point several times, continuing on doing so in an almost OCD way.

Oh and robertangel, lets see what your contribution was to this thread with this post…the usual unnecessarily verbose and unrelated to the topic… I’ve never seen a poster dedicate this many posts to complaining, whining, and groaning, about the manner of discourse of other posters.  It makes a person wonder about their motivation. 
my post was brief and relevant in advising posters to think twice before listening to the advise of a gringo that has always bought his women.  A guy that introduces himself to women with lies, and then posts as if he knows something the rest do not. 


Fathertime!

[Zon]

Some active posters think I am a PIG, and run all over anything I say - would not matter if I was Jesus Christ.   

By now you have to understand, you opinions are of NO interest to me.  HIGHLY unlikely we are every going to "bump into each other"  hahaha

If you guys OWNED the site, I would not come.  But, you are only members, just like me. 

I doubt you could say anything to me that you have not already said 1000 time.  I thought about ignoring your posts, but I loose context.   So, how about I change my avatar, and slogan " I am a happy pig.  Screw off "

[Tanuki]

Tanuki - The COMPROMISE I am talking about is not the give and take that happens in healthy relationships of all kinds.  I am referring to a deeper, moral compromise ... something that happens when a person acts, behaves, or accepts something that in an uncompromised position, they would not.   Again, this is seen in degrees with girls walking in short skirts in Parque Llares to a "social" sponsored by a marriage agency. 

Okay.  I am cool with what you are saying.  However, that type of compromise you are talking about happens here in states as well.  Very frequently I might add.  And, I have found, it is not always based on the need for economic improvement. 

[Researcher]

   You are correct Tanuki.Compromise is nothing new in any relationship in any country.Once again zonnyboy is taking something so incredibly simple and philosophised it into a big complicated subject. This is a man that is at the beginning of discovering himself so everything is new and complicated.I wonder sometimes if his rambling posts are just exerpts from his "daily journal" he is surely writing in hopes to sell a novel someday.Maybe it will be entitled "Diary of a Mid-Life crisis".I think if Zon was so interested in self discovery he could learn alot from reading the archives and spare us the nonsense he writes here.

      Johnny Zon Zon is only "ignoring" certain posters because he knows they are correct and he can't dispute anything that has been said.
 
       Researcher