Colombia Round Two: La Costa!

[vallenatoman]

Woody after all this.... i see you married in less than a year

seems like its working out the right way!

[Woody]

El Castillo de San Filipe ... gets a little warm up there, eh?  

Not really, it got really warm in the tunnels where there is no moving air to keep things cool. Up top is was really breezy and nice.  If you notice the pic of me holding my shirt out, my sorts are being pushed up and against my leg by the wind.


BTW, Servibanca ATMs let foreign cards withdraw $780mil with a $5.5mil usage fee. I find that especially handy when paying $150mil/night in cash for an apartment.

[utopiacowboy]

Thanks for the hotel review and the pics, Woody.

El Castillo de San Filipe ... gets a little warm up there, eh? 


The idea of most Colombian women wanting a ticket out to the USA is largely a myth. If they could marry a nice, stable guy with a decent income (Colombian or extranjero), I'll bet 90% would opt to stay in Colombia.

You are exactly right. Every member of my wife's family has a tourist visa to the US. Other than the mandatory trip to Orlando, none of them have the slightest interest in living here. And why would they? It's a country that has seen its best days and is now doomed to a long decline into poverty and despair. Anyone with any sense is better off in the up and coming countries of Asia and South America.

[whitey]

Woody, there should be a restaurant close by you that we always enjoyed that you may want to check out.  Dani probably knows it.

La Olla Cartagenera
Av. San Martín No. 5-100 L-3

It's on the main road that runs along the beach on Boca Grande (opposite side of the street from the ocean).  Lot's of turtle shells on the walls.  The food is a combination of arabic and seafood.  I always have the arab combo - haven't tried the seafood yet.

Buen provecho!

[Alabamaboy!]

Two other awesome restaurants are: El Santisimo and La Cevicheria. They are both in old town. The taxi guys and your girl will probably know where they are.

The pics look great dude! You are sweating like a Mofo though! That is how I was there. I could not stop sweating! And it is not like I am from Antartica or something. I am currently living in one of the hottest cities in the world, but for some reason I sweat my ass off in CTG, BAQ, SM. Maybe it is just all the hot ladies making my blood boil.

[Woody]

Well, that was to be expected sooner or later.....

Today she pissed me off, royally.

I will be light on details here, so forgive me if this sounds more like a teaser than anything.

So, she was supposed to come over this afternoon. Afternoon and her coming over usually means about 3pm. So, I was in a great mood when she calls me at 1pm and tells me that she will be over at 2 or 2:30pm.

Well, at 4:11pm I get a text from her saying she is 10 minutes out and bringing her mother and sister, and she needs money for the taxi.

Well, here is the deal. We have not had any alone time in three or four days and she promised me she would be coming over today for some time to ourselves, no others around. It is not that she said that would happen, she promised, used the word promise and all. Combine that with the part where she was 2+ hours late (showed up at 4:30pm), gave me a 10 minute heads up, I was starving, and needed money for the taxi....yeah, I was livid (I do a decent job of hiding it, she knew I was pissed, just had no idea the level to which I was).

So, after another two hours at the apartment while her mom and sister looked at the apartment and the views(I had explained immediately when they got there that I had not eaten anything all day because I was waiting for Dani to get here and we would go get something to eat...) we went to the mall. At this point I stopped giving a damn, I went straight to the food court and ordered something to eat (chicken quesedilla from Tacos and something, [snip]ing fantastic I might add), didn't bother with a drink, I just wanted some carbohydrates in my system. I wasn't exactly cuddly with Dani the rest of the night either to include keeping a visible distance when her mother and sister are around, I want to make sure they understand what is going on as well since I have a feeling her mother is responsible. (We are normally inseparable)

So, she knows I'm pissed, asks if I want to go back to her apt with her mom and sis, I decline. Drop her off, and now I am in my apartment typing this. I haven't explained things to Dani yet, I am waiting until tomorrow when I won't say anything damaging.


But, lesson learned. If she wants to keep her own time schedule, that is fine. I am done waiting on her. (I have explained to her several times that it is expected that you tell someone when you are going to be late, before you are late.)

Tomorrow I start doing the things I did in Medellin. Walking around, taking pictures, exploring. With or without her(I have a feeling it will be without, since she rarely comes out before 1pm).



I will explain this all to her tomorrow when I am more level headed and less pissed off. I still love her, but the foot is coming down. 

[Jeff S]

Yeah - one of those cultural things about Latin America that drives me nuts. I'd tell her how you feel, and she'll get the hint or should anyway.

[Zon]

what comes fast can go fast too.  I have seen love at first sight.  I have seen lightning hit the same place twice too.  Enjoy your trip thoroughly and expand your possibilities without limiting anything.  These things take months, not weeks, to play out in the best of situations - and there is nothing wrong with that.

[Woody]

Oh, and yes, I could have handled things better today. I know that and have no problem admitting that.

[vallenatoman]

Well, that was to be expected sooner or later.....

Today she pissed me off, royally.

I will be light on details here, so forgive me if this sounds more like a teaser than anything.

So, she was supposed to come over this afternoon. Afternoon and her coming over usually means about 3pm. So, I was in a great mood when she calls me at 1pm and tells me that she will be over at 2 or 2:30pm.

Well, at 4:11pm I get a text from her saying she is 10 minutes out and bringing her mother and sister, and she needs money for the taxi.

Well, here is the deal. We have not had any alone time in three or four days and she promised me she would be coming over today for some time to ourselves, no others around. It is not that she said that would happen, she promised, used the word promise and all. Combine that with the part where she was 2+ hours late (showed up at 4:30pm), gave me a 10 minute heads up, I was starving, and needed money for the taxi....yeah, I was livid (I do a decent job of hiding it, she knew I was pissed, just had no idea the level to which I was).

So, after another two hours at the apartment while her mom and sister looked at the apartment and the views(I had explained immediately when they got there that I had not eaten anything all day because I was waiting for Dani to get here and we would go get something to eat...) we went to the mall. At this point I stopped giving a damn, I went straight to the food court and ordered something to eat (chicken quesedilla from Tacos and something, [snip]ing fantastic I might add), didn't bother with a drink, I just wanted some carbohydrates in my system. I wasn't exactly cuddly with Dani the rest of the night either to include keeping a visible distance when her mother and sister are around, I want to make sure they understand what is going on as well since I have a feeling her mother is responsible. (We are normally inseparable)

So, she knows I'm pissed, asks if I want to go back to her apt with her mom and sis, I decline. Drop her off, and now I am in my apartment typing this. I haven't explained things to Dani yet, I am waiting until tomorrow when I won't say anything damaging.


But, lesson learned. If she wants to keep her own time schedule, that is fine. I am done waiting on her. (I have explained to her several times that it is expected that you tell someone when you are going to be late, before you are late.)

Tomorrow I start doing the things I did in Medellin. Walking around, taking pictures, exploring. With or without her(I have a feeling it will be without, since she rarely comes out before 1pm).



I will explain this all to her tomorrow when I am more level headed and less pissed off. I still love her, but the foot is coming down. 

Woody

Wondering if this is just a kinda thing she didnt have control over or do you really think she was kind of callous about it?

Maybe its MOM and she cant say no (i understand that hahah)

See if she makes it up to you later (i dont mean physically but hey im sure if you guys have been physcical you wouldnt mind).

Make sure tho you TALK about it ... you dont want to leave things like this unexplained.

[vallenatoman]

Oh and remember youre a lucky bastage im sitting here ALONE dreaming of a nice colombiana on my arm

[bcc_1_2]

With English as our first language words such as promise, love, etc carry a lot of meaning. English is not her first language and she's lives on the coast in Colombia so I doubt punctuality is ingrained in her either. Sometimes you've got to just chalk it up to cultural differences and discuss these issues rather than get very worked up over them.

These things will work themselves out.

[robert angel]

I'd be pissed---annoyed too and it's great you didn't throw a knee jerk reaction tantrum, after sitting there, waiting hungry and all.

I'd like to think a promise is a promise (and "a smile is just smile, a kiss is just a kiss--as time goes by--the fundamental things still apply"), but although a lot of people in the USA are big on punctuality, I've heard Colombia is not known for for placing high importance on showing up on time, that it in fact makes the Swiss, so well known for punctuality look like they have atomic clocks in their brains.

I dunno, but as you sort of said, I have some sort of feeling as well, that maybe the Mom's an influencing factor on this occasion and surely in other aspects of the situation between you and this gal overall.

Nobody wants an overly doting, manipulative mother/mother in law, but better to have someone who does respect her Mom & family than some woman, who due to upbringing & circumstances, basically goes it alone, because she hasn't been able to develop or maintain family ties.

I guess those dynamics are something for you to figure out and maybe articulate your feelings and expectations to her, saying while you respect her family--it's supposed to be about you and her, not you and 'them' so much, if that's how you feel..

You're gonna have disagreements, even fights eventually, and this gal sounds pretty good from the outside looking in and not one you want to casually give up on, unless this is the start of a long, sorry, steady pattern.

If you can work this and even bigger things out as they come along, you may find that she's even better than you thought. These might be the best 'tests' you ever take.

We know you're not gonna let any dame walk all over you--not gonna wuss out, but don't (and we know you haven't) show some way over the top machismo stuff that's just not appropriate at this point.

You know how much to turn on and off, Woody--use your brain, balancing it with your heart--lately your hearts been kind of taking more of the lead, it seems. You've got some time and this gal seems like she's worth holding onto for a while, so you can see what all the true colors are hopefully.

I'm sure you can be appropriately macho as seems to be the way things work down there and yet let her know you feel she has 'potential' she needs to live up to, telling how how it is is, not necessarily demanding, without you sounding wimpy or kissing her or her Mom's ass either. I bet a reason why they like you is because you have brains, balls and a heart and usually seem to use them in good proportion--not like most of the locals down that way.

That's just my thoughts anyways. I'd play this out for a while--sounds like you're learning a lot of Spanish and more inside stuff about the culture than almost any guy on just his second trip could possibly hope to and they're pretty decent people so far. Just be yourself and you'll be fine.

[Alabamaboy!]

Those Costenas can drive a guy crazy with being late for things like that. And for bringing along family members when you are thinking more along the lines of "alone time" between the two of you. My fiancee was like that while still living in BAQ and I was really worried about how she would be here in the States. But so far so good. She gets up at 6:15 to make us breakfast, is punctual, much more detail oriented. And although she misses her family, she does not spend excessive time talking to them or chatting online with them.

My point is that I was really pissed like you are now on several occasions during previous trips to BAQ, and was taking some of those things as being bright red flags telling me to get out of the relationship. But I decided to risk it a bit, thinking a lot of that behavior might just be the "Costena Culture". And so far it seems like it was. And those bad habits did not carry over to the States. So I am glad that I did not end the relationship based on those things.

[Dan Las Vegas]

If I were you, i'd explain things again to her what punctuality means to you and then the next time she is late, go out and explore the town without her. You have limited time in colombia so make the most of it. Don't sit around waiting for her to arrive.  I don't know if the coast is so different but in Medellin, I found that most people were more on less on time

Dan LV

[Alabamaboy!]

That is what I did Dan and it did work to a certain extent.

And yes, I think if you ask most people, the Costenas are very different in that regard than the Paisas.

[whitey]

Being more than 15 or so minutes late and not calling or texting is just rude, no matter what the culture.   It only takes a few moments to let someone know that you've been delayed.

Although you have to make some cultural allowances, this is just plain courtesy.  My fiance is from Barranquilla and if she is going to be late for something (which is rare), she always takes the 30 seconds to let me know.  She doesn't like it when other people are late either.  If I'm meeting with my Colombian friends here in London, they are never more than a few minutes late.

I doubt Woody needs this piece of advice, but it's a good opportunity to discuss with Dani calmly and reasonably what your expectations are, why you feel that way, and that you hold yourself to the same standards as you expect from her. 

Bringing the mom along is a little tougher situation.  Dani may not have as much control over that, especially in the first few weeks and months you know each other.  But, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that she at least gives you a heads up if mom is coming along.  You wouldn't want to answer the door wearing just your Batman mask and a smile.   

[jm21-2]

You would think that, but there are probably more wives of our members who would rather stay in their home country than get a ticket to the US, at least most that I've run across and met. It's only the critics without any actual experience who are convinced that all the poor women in the world are willing to drop to their backs for anyone with a fat wallet and K1 visa ap in their back pocket.

Yep. I was going over the immigration process in more detail with my GF this weekend and I mentioned how eventually she could become a USC. Her response: Why would I want that?

I was reading an article about immigration....they looked at how when Puerto Ricans were allowed to just fly up to the US and start working/living there and how the immigration flow worked. After the Puerto Rican GDP per capita (or maybe it was median salary) reached 1/3 of the US immigration dropped to a net zero from basically that point on. Goes to show how people have to be pretty damn poor to want to leave their home country.

[Capstone]

Yep. I was going over the immigration process in more detail with my GF this weekend and I mentioned how eventually she could become a USC. Her response: Why would I want that?

My wife is the same way - she has absolutely no need/desire to become a US citizen. In fact, I really haven't encouraged it at all either because there are way too many advantages for both of us if she remains a Chinese citizen. 

[vallenatoman]

I have a question:

Say a situation like Woody and his girl...wow the first few days seemed dreamy. Made me jealous!

But say somehow his girl (or whoevers girl doesnt have to be woody) somehow ran across this board through a friend or whatever.

Say she read this thread.

Would that affect in anyway how the lady would react/be with/treat/think toward Woody (or whomever it happend to be)

Im just curious...i see people post their pics and altho great for here...would it affect a lady who reads the board who they happen to be dating (or in first stages of).

Would it make a lady go from very attentitve to ... unsure or have doubts if she sees that maybe there are other ladies ?

just curious

[Zon]

"But say somehow his girl (or whoevers girl doesnt have to be woody) somehow ran across this board through a friend or whatever.
Say she read this thread"

It can be a deal breaker - obviously

[Gato4Astrid]

Cali is like that too!  When I first visited Colombia with ACG, my first date was 1 1/2 hour late!  My point is that do they all arrive late for any job interviews?  Everyone should be punctuality to show respects for others!

I flew all the way from England to have my 1st date and she was 1 1/2 hour late !!!  I had another appointment when it was due to clash the same time, but I declined!  I would have had liked to have the other appointment for 1 1/2 hours!

Not only Colombians, but also some other countries too ...

I am always on time or few minutes early
My mother is always late
My grandmother is always early

My grandmother always show respects for others and think of others, while my mother always thinks of herself (typical - not surprised)

[Woody]

"But say somehow his girl (or whoevers girl doesnt have to be woody) somehow ran across this board through a friend or whatever.
Say she read this thread"

It can be a deal breaker - obviously

That it could be. I think that, however, even if my posts were read by her I would be ok. You'll notice how I don't tell every detail of every time we meet. Just the highlights, things you could tell friends.

You can tell a good story and keep to the truth even if you keep the details light.

As for me and Dani. Things are shaken, on both sides. We had a four hour conversation this afternoon. It got pretty emotional and heartfelt. In the end, we both set some boundaries and expectations. I think we are better off now than we were two days ago and we understand each other much better.

Things have cooled considerably, but they needed to cool anyways.

I think we are still on a good track, but either way I am going to enjoy my vacation.


And yes, that means exactly what you think it means. I am back in exploration mode and you can expect tons of pictures to drop in the next few days.

[El Escéptico]

Woody I have seen your situation before and I wish I could say...with good results. The hard facts here translate into one word...respect. If a women respects a relationship or wants to maintain a balance she's not going to do anything thing to upset that balance this quickly in a relationship. The fact she's late is an indication of that lack balance. She is not concerned enough to worry how you might react to being 2 hours late or to disregard her promise,

I'm involved with a Paisa....... for 3 years. Very Classy, family owns a designer garment business, they own 3 taxi's  2 in Medellin and one in Enviagdo. She looks like a High fashion model....in 3 years she was late one time and that time she called. My in-site to Paisas comes from her. Her prospective tells me and what I've learned is that....in Colombia ya gotta dig a lot of coal before you ever find the diamond.

[vallenatoman]

That it could be. I think that, however, even if my posts were read by her I would be ok. You'll notice how I don't tell every detail of every time we meet. Just the highlights, things you could tell friends.

You can tell a good story and keep to the truth even if you keep the details light.

As for me and Dani. Things are shaken, on both sides. We had a four hour conversation this afternoon. It got pretty emotional and heartfelt. In the end, we both set some boundaries and expectations. I think we are better off now than we were two days ago and we understand each other much better.

Things have cooled considerably, but they needed to cool anyways.

I think we are still on a good track, but either way I am going to enjoy my vacation.


And yes, that means exactly what you think it means. I am back in exploration mode and you can expect tons of pictures to drop in the next few days.

Yea i think you are fine. Relationships have to grow and sometimes arguments are part of it . Cant be 100% in the clouds all the time.. tats life.

So i hope things between you guys heat back up positively!

Or if that cant happen  the way you want maybe you will find another option.

But if you really like this girl....id say you have to look past this one thing. If it CONTIUES after she knows it bothers you....then theres a problem. I couldnt say 1 thing should stand in the way of great thing.... but if it continues the yea you have to think about it.