How the heck to handle this?

[HaroldC]

... in response to You don't know where that finger has bee..., posted by Ray on Aug 10, 2003

nt

[Bear]

... in response to How the heck to handle this?, posted by HaroldC on Aug 9, 2003

Money is probably the primary reason that she chose this course in her life.  Many of her actions will not be indicators of how she feels about you but money will be a considerable factor to her family (in most cases).  

I did what Ray suggested.  I just handed over to Honey $4000 upon my arrival.  She made every deal saving me lots and accounted for every penny (er, piso).  I saw I could trust her implicitly and had to insist many times she use it for things because we were on "vacation" and would go back to being concervative when it was over.

But the killer was her family.  Without discussing it with Honey, I discussed money with her father, promising to send her P10000 every month.  I didn't know at that point that the most he had ever made in a month was P4500.  He immediately quit his efforts at finding work and declared his family rich.  Honey not knowing this found out that I was going to put $200/mo in a ATM debit card account for her and she insisted that she would not need that much.  In 11 1/2 months she took the $200 twice and twice took nothing at all, the rest of the time using about $130/mo. with most of that going for the phone ($13) and ISP ($80).  With what allowance she took she paid the rent, electricity, water, food for her whole family, her and her brothers college, books and transportation and expenses required for immigration.  Occasionally giving her parents P1000 for their needs.  We were rewarded with humilating remarks and insults, outcast behavior from the neighbors, yellings and beatings from her family.  Why? Because she didn't give more.

I wanted a wife that was a "stay-at-home-mom", this didn't go over well with her family because they hoped she would send lots of money home so that they could retire off her labors.  Instead I send P2500/mo on a debit card and agreed to pay the college of any siblings that honored my rules about my payi8ng for their college. 1) No illegal activities, 2) above average grades, 3) no quitting once starting, 4) no failed courses, 5) an agreement to help the family as much as Honey is asked once graduated.  Since I made these rules one quit college (after I stop paying for his college) and another decided not to go.  The third will be coming up soon for a decission on nursing school.

If she is hinting at you and your marriage somehow being a benefactor for the family. I think you need a very long discussion before you go. "Pilosopo" is considered a ligitinate excuse (a rude comment meaning "you didn't ask so I didn't tell") in some circles.  You should ask her exactly what her expectations are with money gifts to the family and you should tell her exactly what yours are on money issues.  Honestly, many of the girls are expected to "take" their bf's for all they can get by family and to refuse or fail is considered being a "bad daughter".  So if you spell it out now you will help her be able to say "no" to them should this be part of the pressures they'll apply to her.

Taking gifts is expected, taking everyone out to dinner and having a big party at your expense is expected, Kanos are generous.  I filled the family's house with food for a month for just $25.  Being stupid most likely will make you a target and begin some potential miserable times for you and your honey.

Spell it out and save yourself and your honey some heartache.

Bear and Honey

[HaroldC]

... in response to Re: How the heck to handle this?, posted by Bear on Aug 9, 2003

Thanks, for you input, Bear. And, yeah, I have heard such horror stories (remember yours vaguely). I am glad everything has settled down for you- as you mentioned to Outwest.

My impression is that you may have spread too much around at the git-go. No criticism, just an observation. I am starting out keeping expectations VERY low.

And I don't think, in my case, money is the primary reason she chose this course, all things considered- which I won't go into here. Suffice to say I am confident of it. BUT, of course it is an issue. There are, however, no younger sibs and Dad is way past retirement already. I suspect she is savvy enough we can play good-cop-bad-cop to those who come out of the woodwork with their hands out. Remember the reason for this thread is ME feeling the need to contribute and her giving NO indication that that is acceptable. She has been playing a bread-winner role for a long time already- unlike, I think, with your Honey.

There will be no beatings. At the first hint of that I will make it very clear that there will be no pay, only pay-back.

[capt david]

... in response to Re: How the heck to handle this?, posted by Bear on Aug 9, 2003

....does it cost to send someone to college in the Phils? Era has a young cousin, who chaperoned us, who wants to go to college. Her mother is widowed. I wouldn't mind helping her if We can afford it but I have no idea what it costs. Thanks, capt david.
BTW era goes for her final, I hope, time to the embassy Friday. Pray for us. dp

[Bear]

... in response to Bear, how much...., posted by capt david on Aug 10, 2003

It cost me less than $600/yr including books for Honey.  Might be the school she was in cost less than most.  Her brothers college was costing me P650 each time he took a test which was usually about every other week for a cost of about $300/yr.  Honey was getting a B.S. accountant degree and her brother was going for computer technology.

I am actually so amazed at the cost and quality of the education many receive there I tried to get my daughter to move there and go to school.  For $300/mo she'd have lived like a god and gotten a great education.

Bear and Honey

[outwest77]

... in response to Re: How the heck to handle this?, posted by Bear on Aug 9, 2003

Dang bear , i remember all your stories while you were dating , i forgot how much you went through, my philosophy is , i wont put my gf on "salary" while i am dating her, and i wont put her family on it either once we are married,
Her mom and dad dont need it, both are doing well, thank god, but thanks for your reality check,i sometimes forget,
human nature is what it is. and anyone will take advantage if you let them. well not anyone, but most.

[Bear]

... in response to Re: Re: How the heck to handle this?, posted by outwest77 on Aug 10, 2003

Actually things are doing very well right now on that topic.  Last Cchristmas I sent a letter detailing every penny I spend in a month (converted to pisos) and showed them as where I do make 4 times in a month more than he makes in a year, I spend that living from payday to payday.  Moneys I send them require sacrafice and saving on our part.  It made a difference.  They actually apologized for the hard time they had gave Honey.  She now calls them weekly or chats with them on the computer with a webcam so they ca see "AJ".  MOF thats what she doing as I type.

Bear and Honey

[greg]

... in response to How the heck to handle this?, posted by HaroldC on Aug 9, 2003

The Guy should offer to make up the difference for Her taking an unaffordable pay loss. Givesss her a peace of mind..Won't cost the Guy muuuuuch. Rather have a happy Filipina than her worrying about losing her pay for being with me. Cost of living in RP is CheaaaaaaaaaaP. Lived in the Philippines High on the Hog for Pennies compared to what I would pay here in America. What I'm saying is that I lived there in Comfort with my Mahal and our Son, buut I was reasonable in How I spent my money..Didn't flash it around or try being a big shot. Some Guys can go to RP without living in Comfort, I need Comfort..sooo it can cost extra $$$$$$$'s for comfort living depending onnnn where you choose to stay and how well the Lady can bargin for You.

[HaroldC]

... in response to Hi Harold, posted by greg on Aug 9, 2003

Hmmm. Maybe I was not that clear about the situation. I am the one worrying about her 'losing her pay'. I don't think she will take my money- and I think even offering might be make her very nervous.

She spent over two years chatting up Kanos online and says they usually tucked tail and bailed when they found out she supports her 66 year old diabetic widowed father and has a couple of brothers living at home (fine with me, those cheapskate numbsculls left me a gem- I'm holding back a rant here). She was absolutely flabbergasted when I was not surprised, even expected, that a Filipina might be in such a position. I don't think she quite believes it still. So she is paranoid about her family being a drain on me.

[Ray]

... in response to How the heck to handle this?, posted by HaroldC on Aug 9, 2003

Well Harold, I think fixing a cockfight is probably the easiest way out of your dilemma (LOL).

Seriously, that’s a good idea!  Not offering her any money is the smartest thing you can do. Keeping money out of the equation will make everything else much simpler.

The idea of buying some food is thoughtful, but doesn’t fit well with the traditional Filipino idea of hospitality. Food over there is relatively cheap by our standards, but can be quite expensive to them. They will likely want to impress you with the best they have to offer, so I would keep in mind that it may be costing them a lot to entertain you in their home. You can offer to go shopping with her at the local market (bring a gas mask) and buy the groceries, but don’t force the issue. If she insists on paying, then let her.

Treat her family (all of them) to dinner at a nice restaurant or a movie, but don’t go overboard with the gifts. Bring some small gifts (pasalubong) for the family members but try to keep it simple and inexpensive.  U.S. made souvenir items and candy are great.

If you are planning to spend your entire trip with her, then you may not want to spend all of your time staying at her home. If you are invited to stay with them I would jump at the chance, but you might want to try to limit that to several days. If there is a decent hotel nearby, you might want to stay there for the majority of your stay. The excuse that your frail body is not accustomed to the tropical heat and you need air-conditioning to survive works well. That way, you take some of the pressure off of them to spend all of their money to feed you. If you’re adventurous, politely ask that they serve the regular daily fare for meals while you are there so that you can experience some of the traditional Filipino foods (don’t forget the Tabasco!).

If she will be going to work while you are there, then staying in a hotel for most of your stay may be much more practical. That way you can spend a little time on your own during the day if you want. I wouldn’t insist that she take time off from work while you are there. Let her decide how to handle that issue. Just try to be flexible and go with the flow. If she is working, maybe you can meet for lunch?

Since you sound serious about this lady, I would offer this suggestion. When you arrive, turn over your dollars (hold back a hundred dollar bill for emergencies) to her for safekeeping and let her pay for everything while you are together. That will give you an excellent opportunity to observe her financial management skills firsthand. The worst that could happen is that she disappears with your money, but that would be a cheap lesson learned. She will probably be very careful to save you money, so WHEN YOU LEAVE, you can then insist that she keep some or all of what is leftover. After all, she saved you a lot of money by getting the best exchange rates and bargaining for stuff, so she did you a big favor ;-). Since that was what you budgeted for the trip, you leave with exactly what you planned on. Just make sure you have enough for airport fees, taxis, food, etc on your return trip. Tell her it’s for postage, computer time, or whatever and insist mildly that she take it. That way, you can leave with a clean conscious after eating them out of house & home during your stay and her family can keep their pride intact.

Keep your radar tuned for any requests for money while you are there. You will have the opportunity to learn a lot about her and her family’s views on money by not splurging on them. After all, if they see you as a spendthrift, then they may adjust their future relationship with you accordingly.

Lastly, be sure to have a backup plan on how to spend the rest of your time over there just in case something does go wrong and you need to bail out... :-)

Ray

[HaroldC]

... in response to Simple..., posted by Ray on Aug 9, 2003

Lots of excellent advice- have heard a lot of it from you before. (I know it's partly for the silent majority.)

I know shirtless Filipinos will go into hock to buy a shirt to give a guest the shirt off his back. She's the one insisting she not work- she really wants this one in the bag and I have told her we have to get to know each other in person first, so, OK, Bud, we're going to get to know each other.

I HATE TO OFFER HER MONEY, my gut says DON'T do it (see my reply to Greg) but, yeah, I think when I leave is the best time. Either we will be engaged and I can insist that therefore it is OK for me to contribute (she still won't like it) or we won't- in which case I will be explaining that I got to know her and do not want her- and offering money will look like I am trying to buy my way out (now there's a lose/lose situation- maybe I can stage my own kidnapping).

This just makes me nuts- what are we talking about, $60? I'd rather slash my wrists than think about a little kid going without eating or her Dad going without his insulin.