How the heck to handle this?

[HaroldC]

My one-and-only prospect wants me to come meet her for the first time before next calendar year (and so do I) but she has no more vacation coming until then. She is sanguine about taking time off with no pay ("will manage") but I know her family depends heavily on her income. I know she looks at it as a good long-term investment (among other things- please start another thread, oh paranoid ones).

I am not going to offer her money (unless or until, maybe, we are engaged).

She has told me that food is very expensive (anybody know numbers?) and two of her brothers are supposedly primo cooks, so maybe I could load the place up on the pretense of letting them impress me with their cuisine.

Or give gifts with remarket value.

Or fix a cock fight.

Or lose some cash under the sofa.

I'm thrashing around here- someone else must have dealt with this touchy saving face vs. paying the bills issue.

[Howard]

... in response to How the heck to handle this?, posted by HaroldC on Aug 9, 2003

Harold,

When I visited my fiancee earlier this year, she took 3 weeks off work to spend the time with me  We stayed mostly at her Lolo's Farm and I insitsed on "Helping" with the grocery bills  I already knew how much she made in salary and set that aside until the end of the trip.  It was like pulling teeth to get her to take it, but she finally did when it became obvious to her that I wasn't taking "No" for an answer  Personally, it made me feel a WHOLE lot better. She would have never told me if she was having money trouble, but who can really stand to miss almost a month's wages?

Keep the Faith

H

[HaroldC]

... in response to Similar Situation..., posted by Howard on Aug 13, 2003

Who can stand to miss wages?- Filipinas can, from what I am told.

To me, the important distinction is the "fiance'" part, although Mita didn't think that made much difference. IF we are engaged I'll be on much firmer ground- in my own mind, at least.

I wouldn't be surprised, though, if your girl still has that cash put back!

Maybe I can tell Imelda that it would make Howard feel better ... Nah, never mind.

Thanks guy.

And, man, am I learning about faith.

[Mita]

... in response to How the heck to handle this?, posted by HaroldC on Aug 9, 2003

I think you should go when she will have enough time for you.  It's only a few months wait.  That will solve a lot of your problems.  If you can't wait, a good time to go would be Halloween, Nov. 1 is a big holiday in the Philippines and most offices are going to give extra time-off to their employees.  Christmas Eve thru the New Year is also loaded with holidays like December 30 which is Rizal Day.

Don't offer money unless she's in a bind.  She sounds like me when I met my husband. Be generous with your gifts if you really want to help out. Filipinos are easy and not sensitive about gifts. And when you are there, insist on paying for the bills.  Even I expected that from my now husband. You could also have enough pesos left over at the end of your trip and give it to her since "you won't need pesos in the US" that should be a plausible excuse.

[HaroldC]

... in response to Re: How the heck to handle this?, posted by Mita on Aug 10, 2003

Could you please tell her for me, Mita, that 'It's only a few months wait.'?- just kidding.

And, yeah, early November I think it is, although I don't think she gets more time off- I will ask, though, holidays have not been mentioned- thanks.! I am going to avoid Christmas time because of the travel madness.

My whole dilemma is not wanting to offer money- and I think 'bind' is the normal state of affairs. Ray, apparently, didn't think much of the gifts idea- but what does he know?- thanks again.

When you say 'pay for the bills', I assume you mean courting expenses, not the household bills- I fully intend to do that. And I will make sure there are plenty of 'extra' pesos left over when I leave.

Tell me please, Mita, if your perspective about accepting financial help changed once you were officially engaged.

Bless you, ma'am, for coming to the aid of this befuddled Kano.

[Mita]

... in response to I am grateful for the Filipina perspecti..., posted by HaroldC on Aug 10, 2003

Harold,
Yes, I do mean bills for the trip - Cab fare and all other incidentals.  Ask her, even before your trip, if there are expenses that are related to the trip and insist you pay for it.  My husband did that and I didn't mind.  He was on his vacation after all, why should I pay for it??  LOL!
If she has to put in her 8 hours of work, you can always go and see her for lunch and pick her up after if she doesn't mind that.  You will both get ribbed a lot, it's a very Pinoy thing to tease someone about the courting stage and "love".  We did that, and  yes,his first visit was also timed for the All Soul's Day holidays.  We actually first met face to face on Halloween ;o)  And like your fiancee, I also have a niece who is very close to me.  My husband had to woo her too.  They got along so well they are still chat buddies.  She's about 9.
As for your question, hubby offered his help once when my mother got very sick just before I left for the US.  But for as long as I could hold out, I didn't accept any money from him...it was a pride thing more than anything.  The fact that he offered and was willing to take on some of my burdens was enough - juggling money around was nothing new, but having someone share my burdens certainly was.
You see, that's another Pinoy thing to "make do" so don't worry about her - she's used to it.  "Kung maikli ang kumot, matutong kumukot" we say which means: when the blanket is short, learn to bend your body.  Most Filipinas are like this...but not all.  
After paying all my bills, my savings almost ran out just before he came to pick me up to take back to the US. I was very careful with expenses at that time cause I already resigned from my job and had no income.  I'm sure she'll do the same when her time comes.
The only money I got from him before we were married was related to the visa expenses. Oh and a $100 bet we made which he lost.  He paid up on his next visit and never made a bet with me after that.  

You are 52, she's 35 you say?  17 year difference for you, hubby and I have 18 years between us.  But I swear most times I am the more mature!
 
Enjoy your trip,
Mita

[HaroldC]

... in response to Re: I am grateful for the Filipina persp..., posted by Mita on Aug 10, 2003

How could you be more mature that a sophisticated western man 18 years your senior? Impossible! (Unless he's like Ray and Dave H.- horsing around with an imaginary severed finger while others in class are dealing with the day's lesson.)

And a gambling woman, too. Tsk, tsk.

Seriously, thank you very very much, you make me feel much better.

I guess I'd better get used to Pinay ways- but don't I get to control anything!? Oh, well, the good old days. At least that ability to juggle (or squeeze as my lady says) almost nothing and make it do should come in handy.

Thank you again, Mita. You have surpassed Ray as my favorite P-L'er.

[Mita]

... in response to You must be mistaken, Ma'am ..., posted by HaroldC on Aug 10, 2003

Harold,
I say I'm more mature than my husband because I can walk into a car dealer and walk away without buying a car that I was ONLY thinking of getting.  
hehehe...I'm lucky in gambling but never got the habit -thank goodness.
You will control much when married to a Filipina, don't you worry.  It's only the household that the woman expects to take care of.  You bring home the bacon and still make most of the decisions, as Jeff pointed out.  But listen to your woman, especially the one you have your eye on.  She sounds like an interesting one.  
Hey, Ray is my favorite PL'er!

[HaroldC]

... in response to Re: You must be mistaken, Ma'am ..., posted by Mita on Aug 11, 2003

I thought she'd be happy another Filipina agreed with her
"so don't worry about her - she's used to it... Most Filipinas are like this... Kung maikli ang kumot, matutong kumukot".

Oops.- So why you have to ask another opinion when I already TOLD you!? I thought we already decided. Do you not trust me ...

Mea culpa, Mea culpa. (I should have said your name was George.)

Material for still another thread, I guess. Sigh.

[Mita]

... in response to Interesting? Oh, yes ..., posted by HaroldC on Aug 12, 2003

Jealousy...it can be irrational sometimes but hardly ever violent.
Next time, I'm willing to be called George )

Mita

[Jeff S]

... in response to You must be mistaken, Ma'am ..., posted by HaroldC on Aug 10, 2003

One thing I've discovered in my marriage, and it parallels what I've found in other Asian families, is that the wife is expected to be in control of home and family issues. It's her turf and generally she'll do her darndest to make sure that the home is comfortable, the kids are disciplined, and the husband is taken care of. She'll likely consider you the boss, though, and though you may have veto power, take my advice and use it very sparingly. Expect that you be filled in about almost everything. Conversely, you have the power out of the home. You get complete control of your career, how money is spent and invested, where and when you go on vacation, etc. She'll expect you to keep her fully informed about what's going on, and she'll most likely go along with almost anything unless she really feels strongly, will likewise use her veto power very sparingly.

That's what I find most appealing about Asian wives. They expect men and women to be different - unlike so many AW who consider men and women interchangeable: women in combat, fine, men as stay at home househusbands, fine, women as firemen, why not, men as kindergarten teachers, sure! While there are some cases where these things are possible, sorry, but men aren't  as equipped as women for mothering infants, and women aren't as equipped as men for humping 300 lb unconscious guys down ladders.

Anyway, a trust should develop between you two to each handle his or her job - like members of a team - the quarterback expects the tackle to block the rushing linebacker and the tackle trusts the quarterback to pacc the ball precisely to the split end - neither should have to worry about the other accomplishing their tasks. Contrast this with many American couples where each feels everything should be done 50/50. I don't know about your high school team, but on mine, there was no way, the quarterback could have stopped the linebackers I faced as tackle, and there was no way I could have hit the receivers at full tilt threading between the safetys.

Sometimes I think American women want to be men. Just listening to the trash talking coming out of 20 something girls these days, and the popularity of shows like Sex In the City, makes me shake my head. I think you'll find most Asian women (at least from the old country,) WANT to be women, LIKE to be women, EXPECT men to be men, and yes, expect to be treated as an equal - but OPPOSITE.

- Jeff

[HaroldC]

... in response to A thing about control to Asians..., posted by Jeff S on Aug 11, 2003

I picture myself as the old Silverback sitting there munching and ignoring the ruckus. But when something happens I have to get up, everybody else shuts up and sits down. Hey, it's my fantasy, all right?

[SteveB]

... in response to A thing about control to Asians..., posted by Jeff S on Aug 11, 2003

That was about the best summary I have ever read.  Great job Jeff!

Steveb

[Jay]

... in response to How the heck to handle this?, posted by HaroldC on Aug 9, 2003

Hi Harold,
I don't really have any advice that hasn't been offered already. Just wanted to say "hi" and welcome to PL. I've been lurking the last couple of months. Just ran out of things to say, I guess! ;-)

The fact that your lady is 35 is good. Usually by that time, Filipina's (as most other women), know what they want and are less likely to "play" you, if they are so inclined. Take it slow, don't throw money around, be respectful and you should be ok. Just be careful about giving the "finger" to any Moro's. Do that and you'll have to fight the whole island! LOL!

Take Care,
Jay

[Ray]

... in response to Re: How the heck to handle this?, posted by Jay on Aug 10, 2003

How the hell have you been?

Ray