Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of Faith"

[TomTx]

So you need a topic to dicuss, I have one. How do you cope with helping your lady go through the fears of the "Leap of faith", I am learning, and reading that these ladys are strong. But what I am also learning is they are strong at holding in there fears. So guys what is you take on the ladies and there fears, what do you tell her, does she feel comfortable with your answers?

We are asking them to come to our country on a Leap, you know there scared as ?ell, not knowing you 100%, only seen you a few times, and many letters. Maybe we should dicuss this, I think this will help all that have ladies that are coming here.

So the dicussion is open...

Tom

[RW]

... in response to Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of Faith&q..., posted by TomTx on Dec 5, 2002

Tom,

there are things you CAN help your lady, there are things which you can't - each person has to learn by himself/herself. Sometimes we just need a little push to show us a window of opportunity, sometimes we have to go through full-blown failure to learn a little thing.

I think in this case the best thing you can do is to be yourself - talk about your achievements and failures, dreams and desires so that at least she has a feeling she knows you. Describe her what options she has with moving to USA - for example, many ladies do it, but there is really no need to sell everything including the apartment in Russia/Ukraine, there is no point in "burning" the bridges. Of course, everybody's situation is different, but too many times ladies complain that they have no point of return, but that was their own choice as well and it is not necessary.

But, to be honest, I still think any marriage is a big lottery You can't predict everything, you can not design best fit answer, because later you don't know how life will turn. All you can do is have faith in yourself and hope for the best. There are things which you can learn about each other ONLY spending 3,5, 10 years together. There are lessons which you would have to go through in life no matter where you live and who you live with, which have nothing to do with your spouse, but too many people are eager to blame others for their own mistakes.

Talk to her about other things then driver's license and difference in food. Talk to her about family values, spirits, favourite books, what she wants to do with her life, who she wants to see around in ten years. What is faith for her? Does she have faith in herself? And also remember that as any woman - sometimes she just needs to vent and have somebody to listen to her and assure her, not like she would not have a courage to make a decision.

Sincerely,

Russian Wife

[Del]

... in response to Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of Faith&q..., posted by TomTx on Dec 5, 2002

All too often I see “sweeping generalizations”, and this topic begs for more of the same.

A RW is not a stereotypical woman – they are very individualistic, strong people. Each will have a different (to one degree or another) manner of approaching the vast change that is necessary in their relocation(s).

I suspect that the sheer magnitude of the change in their lives escapes a great many men (some of whom have never before this "escapade" ventured forth beyond the borders of their own country!).

To “visit” their country is very, very different than the adjustments they will face in coming to our country. For one thing, a “visit” is just that – there is a point in time that one will return to their country, and familiar surroundings/lifestyles and this tends to make the “differences” much easier to accept.

The knowledge that at some point one will be able to return to that which is ‘known’, in and of itself makes it difficult, if not impossible to truly understand what these women are facing. Most others often overlook the sheer permanence of the change, and the psychological impact this has.

And, even if she has a decent command of English, when faced with the myriad of accents and jargon she will encounter everyday, her confidence in her abilities is likely to quickly fade.

I suggest that her man must have the patience of a Saint, the wisdom of several Solomon’s, the understanding of a Guru, the self-control of a Yogi and the leadership of a Ghandi.

[KenC]

... in response to My Thoughts......., posted by Del on Dec 6, 2002

Del,
I loved your last line-"I suggest that her man must have the patience of a Saint, the wisdom of several Solomon’s, the understanding of a Guru, the self-control of a Yogi and the leadership of a Ghandi."  Many guys do not understand that the real hard work starts after their RW comes to America.  Before that, it is all romantic and exciting new experiences for both.  Not that the romance and excitement stops (if you choose correctly), but the "practical" side of the relationship now comes into play.
-
I know that most guys think it will be "fun" to open up America to their sweethearts and it is, to a point.  But there is also a flip side to this story.  To have a wife that is totally dependent upon you can be very taxing at times.  Some of the simple things we take for granted will become a time consuming bother i.e. changing a vacuum cleaner bag, balancing a checkbook, recording debit purchases, using a garbage disposal, use of our cleaning products, washing machines & dryers ect ect.  These simple tasks as well as being the ONLY person to lean on or confide in can be quite frustrating at times.  Think about all the people that she relied on in her previous life and YOU have to replace them all.
-
I will say that after 3 1/2 years here, Lena has made quite a transformation, now if I could only get her to record those debits!
KenC

[Patrick]

... in response to Many guys do not understand, posted by KenC on Dec 6, 2002

There was a period of time with my wife also when I felt like both a husband and father.  Until a woman gains sufficient skills in English and gets a driver's license and a car, she can require quite a bit of hand holding in many things we consider trivial.

There was one case of divorce on the Latin board where I think the primary difficulty was the man not being able to handle the load and the lady not making enough effort to become more independent (including learning English).

Something to think about.  Each lady is unique and some will adapt faster than others.

[Ukrainelover]

... in response to Many guys do not understand, posted by KenC on Dec 6, 2002

I do concur with the earlier statements which is right on the mark but have some difficulty relating to the later half of the post.

I have seen similar posts here and elsewhere about the AM trying to make a big issue about the problems related to teaching the RW about changing a vacuum cleaner bag, using washing machine, etc. Such portrayal appears almost like some AM feels that RW are retarded.  To be honest, I find it hard to believe because I think any RW who makes it to US is hand picked and even though they might have deficiencies in English skills, they are reasonably intelligent . The above mentioned tasks takes few minutes to explain; some even self explanatory since these equipments are getting so user friendly. I can only speak about my experience which is different. My wife didn’t have any trouble getting adjusted here.

I remember, incase of my wife, I got her enrolled in the local catholic university for BS in computer science within months of arriving in US. I still remember her first test in English which she got an A grade. She was asking me “Is there something wrong with me. I don’t understand why my fellow American students are getting Bs & Cs” in their own native language”. Within a year she got admitted to a prestigious University where she is now doing her Masters. Her last inter-departmental project, which I believe was with Motorola, her team came first (she was the team leader). She just can’t stand plain stupidity and says it openly. Her professors used to ask her to tone down little bit since she openly confronts her classmates about it when problem arises and it can appear blatantly rude. Nevertheless, they are like her very much. She also makes fun of herself and her country often. She used to tell me in FSU, the kids at school gets teased (unlike here for having a funny name, or being fat or being just different) if you are slow and stupid.

I still laugh when I think about the conversation that occurred few months after she landed in US. When she went to a local store,  the sales agent couldn’t understand what she said. My wife doesn’t have a typical Russian accent even though she does have a strange accent. She tried to repeat her question slowly. The agent still couldn’t understand her. So my wife said, “Are you stupid or trying to act like one”. Instantaneously the agent understood everything and was blushing all over!

She doesn’t like the mechanical stuff like programming VCR or setting the clock. It is not because she is not smart to figure it out but just don’t like gizmos unlike me. If her computer hard drive crashes, I am the one who fixes it for her. So my advise is not to push things they don’t like and encourage things they are capable or good at and one can work as a team.

My understanding is that in the glory days of FSU, education was free and everybody benefitted from it. Boys used to try to excel in college rather than being drafted into Army. Engineers, doctors were dime a dozen in FSU and has no value or prestige bestowed upon them unlike here. Her granny was a gynecologist (made $50 per months!) and both her parents are engineers. I don’t know what is the official figure about the literacy rate for FSU but I believe it is almost 100%. Of course the educational priority is going down the tube after the fall of communism.

[Mike]

... in response to Re: Many guys do not understand, posted by Ukrainelover on Dec 6, 2002

I don’t know what is the official figure about the literacy rate for FSU but I believe it is almost 100%.

My wife showed me a survey and Russia was more or less the same as Americans on the percentages of those that go on to college.

Mike

[KenC]

... in response to Re: Many guys do not understand, posted by Ukrainelover on Dec 6, 2002

Ukielover,
Of course I do not think RW are retarded.  They just don't know what they don't know.  They learn quickly, but you still have the burden to do the teaching.  They also have the option to choose not to learn the things they are not interested in.
KenC

[Pordzhik]

... in response to Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of Faith&q..., posted by TomTx on Dec 5, 2002

Or roll of the dice? I reckon anyone serious about this whole venture just has to have a little of the gambler about him or her, some of us just don't have that, as shown by the guys who have made multiple trips and don't have a wife, and also by the guys here who have returned the lady back to the FSU. Not forgetting those ladies who have gotton cold feet, and those here who are trying to make some kind of science out of this whole thing and never actually get themselves to the FSU.

I was lucky as I was able to make regular and multiple trips to Ukraine for us to get to know each other and had a six month fiance visa for us to get to know each other here before marriage.

I wonder if I (or my wife) would have taken that risk if we had less knowledge about each other?

Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Or as one of our recent posters put it, there comes a time to sh!t or get of the pot.

Good luck to you all.

[TomTx]

... in response to Re: Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of Fai..., posted by Pordzhik on Dec 6, 2002

I agree with you pordzhik that it's hard and you are lucky to be able to make many trips. Using the 6 months of the K1 after interview is a wise choice. I think this is what my lady will do. I even talked to my boss about a 3 month lay-off so I could live there and show her my commitment is just as strong. But it does take a two way street for this to work, and a little money. We have not had out interview and I have been there twice to see her, so I am just want all to talk about threre fears and there ladies fears, it's important.
Tom

[Pordzhik]

... in response to Re: Re: Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of..., posted by TomTx on Dec 6, 2002

Depends on your job and your boss of course and taking care of your at home finances, but the actual cost of a three month stay in Ukraine needn't be that much, just depends on how much roughing it you can take, think about how the Ukrainians do it.

I would've liked to have done this, but my job wouldn't allow. It would've given me much better insight into the Ukrainian mind and caused us less mis-understandings and conflict later on.

I was lucky (compared to you US guys) as the airfares are cheap and flight time from nearby Gatwick is quick (three and a half hours) that and my girls help with finding cheap studio apartments enabled me to visit often for long weekends.

I can't imagine taking that "leap of faith" after just a couple of visits, but then I wasn't in that position.

BTW We are planning for an extended visit of three months in Ukraine this coming summer, with my wife staying the full three months and me taking the first and last month in Ukraine with the middle month I'll have stuff to do here with my job. The first month we'll be staying at her family's dacha (this should be fun )and the last month I'd like to motor-tour some. I'll try to keep a journal for you all.

[Mike]

... in response to Re: Re: Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of..., posted by TomTx on Dec 6, 2002

It takes a looooong time to know each other and nothing comes close until you're actually living together,sure many visits may expose something you didn't see before but it's all a gamble.

Fears and adjustments. I see my wife as a brave woman to come here and to leave everything she's ever known behind for a chance at a better life. She had to adjust on every level possible. She went from feeling highly educated to feeling like she's trapped in a childs mind because of her knowledge of american english and slang. She had to learn how to drive and was always afraid of cars. My wife doesn't see her progress because she is constantly consumed by adjusting, and compairing herself. As a husband all I can do is try to keep her spirits up and point out her accomplishments. One of the hardest things there is to do is the ability to see yourself the way others see you.

My advice hmmm keep-em busy and happy and get started quickly on helping them feel like they're a part of our society, but I don't think I would stop working for long just to be with her. The first thing she may think is you're not a good worker/provider. Heck the sooner you get into your routine the sooner she can see what's going on.  

I've talked with guys that wanted to control everything about their wife and hoped they would end up with a concubine  - - HA HA HA that'll be the day! If they're brave enough to come here they'll have no problems moving on down the road after crossing the Ocean!

Mike -- who felt like rambling this morning

[Pordzhik]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Fears Of Your Lady "Lea..., posted by Mike on Dec 6, 2002

balanced against the chance of a better life, you've hit the nail on the head there! Lets not kid ourselves, that's why these women are involved in this pursuit and if they can find a husband they can love then it's not hard for them to leave everything behind, "everything" being little chance of finding a quality partner in the FSU, half a lifetime of living with parents in little overcrowded apartments in depressing orwellian suburbs and ecking out poor pay with backbreaking work at the dacha. Given that, would you take that leap of faith?

During the early months it seemed more like I had a new daughter to care for than a new wife, I had to advise and guide her every move and explain everything to her. She had to overcome the unforseen things like car-sickness having hardly ever travelled in one before. Then there was the disapointment that her education meant nothing here, after studying for five years to gain a degree in management and tourism she found that she really knows nothing about these subjects as they apply to the real world.

And for the guys that hope to find a concubine they can control, it may seem like that to begin with, but everyday brings a little more independence and adjustment for these women.

[Mike]

... in response to Fears and adjustments, posted by Pordzhik on Dec 6, 2002

My wife spent 7 years in college and her education is also usless here. She has a masters in Phylology (or something like that) It's the study of books and languages but the knowledge of Russian literature is not going to get her much here, her degree also covered English literature but it's mostly British. She's now taking some pre-recs for going into nursing and because of her degree she'll be getting a masters in nursing. I've noticed that this is common for educated RW, that is having a usless degree here. I know one friend of hers was a Doctor in Russia and she doesn't even qualify as a nurse here.

Mike

[KenC]

... in response to Fears Of Your Lady "Leap of Faith&q..., posted by TomTx on Dec 5, 2002

Tom,
I will only talk about my wife and not in general terms.  She didn't really think through all the details in coming to America.  It is only years later that she understands what a huge leap in faith she took back then.  As tough as RW are, they are also very spiritual and emotional.  Lena believes in destiny and that we were meant to be together.  She followed her heart and worried about the details later.  I also agree that the woman is much more at risk then the man in these cases.
KenC