Playboy Magazine...

[UnitedNut]

Current issue of Playboy, featuring the Women of Enron has a story about the Russian prostitution trade proliferating in Los Angeles.  Its the backdrop to a story about a murder that took place in L.A. of a young Russian girl who was attempting to set up her own operation.

Story provides background on how the prostitution rings operate and how the girls get to the states.  Many are smuggled in from Mexico, others come on 3 month Visa's and never return.  (No mention of anyone coming in as a potential bride.)  Situatioin got so bad there that prostitutes were being kidnapped from one madam/pimp and being forced to work for another.  Interesting, but sad, story.

[yoe]

... in response to Playboy Magazine..., posted by UnitedNut on Jul 3, 2002

sex drugs and crime.
Even though people lived not so well under socialism, these thing we Americans like to condemn about the 'new' exploits of these people our government help create. During socialism-literacy rate was nearly 100%, crime, drug addiction,and prositution were not national issues. There was not a welfare state and all people had a place to live and food to eat. But now they are liberated-welcome to the American Way!
Joe

[wsbill]

... in response to this is the beauty of capitalism..., posted by yoe on Jul 3, 2002

Last time I was in Kiev, everyone was sporting a european look (italian shoes and clothing) and driving most european cars.

I didn't see anyone wearing a tank top or a polo shirt and short pants...Doing the American way.

I think if you ask your girl about the old days, she will have a very selective memory.  This after all was her country and way of life.  She isn't going to dis her old way of life and heritage to be able to allow you to point outs what's wrong with her past.

I think you should ask someone else besides you lady.

[yoe]

... in response to Re: American Way...not, posted by wsbill on Jul 4, 2002

n.t

[Ryan]

... in response to Re: American Way...not, posted by wsbill on Jul 4, 2002

n/t

[Ryan]

... in response to this is the beauty of capitalism..., posted by yoe on Jul 3, 2002

After reading MarkInTx, and Philb's responses I can understand a little better were your coming from.  However; to say somehow that we as Americans threw our capitalist society caused the problem and issues that occur in the FSU today is, well, it's just silly and I see no place for it here.  I like to think that the FSU is growing into something great and better, and in turn every country including the U.S.A. can learn from this growth.  It just takes time to achieve goals and learn new things.  Like I said before "What Ever!"   Understand, we can sit around here and talk out of our butts all day long on this subject.  I simply find it appalling that someone that lives in this country would choose to down play their country and so close to day that we celebrate our independence, a freedom that some of us enjoy.  What next?  Are we going to start debating the issue of "Under God," or Flag burning?  

I understand that I can fly off the handle at posts such as these and take a few cheep shots at people.  I do understand that this board is for finding love and if you have your love it's great that you take time to help out a few others.  However; when you post to spew some elitist garbage time and time again it's just, well, it just gets old...
 
 

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Happy Independence day!, posted by Ryan on Jul 4, 2002


I am as staunch a supporter of capitalism and democracy as anyone...

But democracy is not a magic pill. You cannot take it one day and be "cured" the next.

Clearly the USSR disolved for a reason.

Clearly Communism did not "work" in the long run.

However the transition is tricky. You have a lot of people who made quite a lot of money under the old regime, and wielded quite a lot of power -- they didn't just disappear.

They are still around, and some of them are running the same corruptions as before under a new name...

Also realize this... Communism wasn't just spread by a sword. Originally, it was adopted by a people who were eager for it.

I forget who said it, but one of our founding fathers had a quote (at least I think it was a founding father...): "Generally, people get the government they deserve."

The point is that you can't just throw a switch and expect everything to be instantly better...

I think Bosnia proved that pretty conclusively...

[Ryan]

... in response to Happy Independence day!, posted by Ryan on Jul 4, 2002

Great People and nations are forged in the fires of adversity....

John Adams
Second President
http://www.whitehouse.gov/history/presidents/ja2.html

[wsbill]

... in response to One last note............., posted by Ryan on Jul 4, 2002

Russia...I sure don't.

Maybe in Bosnia/Yugoslavia, but most of that is cultures fighting between themselves.

I just see them as another third world country with their hand out.  These two countries are mired in their own red tape and a wet paperbag.

It's going to take a 2 or 3 generations, to purge the oldline thinking and accept the new.

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Re: Do you see much adversity going on i..., posted by wsbill on Jul 4, 2002


I don't know if I don't understand your logic or your typos...

[wsbill]

... in response to this is the beauty of capitalism..., posted by yoe on Jul 3, 2002

I'm sure what's going over in Eastern Europe has been going on far longer than 1991.

It's pretty cheesy to blame ole'USA on their woes.
Their the ones who put up fences to keep their people in like cattle.
No telling how many people were shot in the back running towards freedom.

Imagine being lied to constantly and not being able to speak out.
Or how about, having your business and livelyhood nationalized and property now owned by the state.

Yea, your talking about them good ole' days.  When the KGB came to your door at night and hauled people
off to the Gulag.

[yoe]

... in response to Re: Gee, I always thought there were foo..., posted by wsbill on Jul 3, 2002

there is a little difference than what your news caster says. She and  her family may have been anomolies-next time you write a woman from FSU over 30 just ask how life was then compared to now!
I only talk of things that I experience or what I am told by people I trust!
Joe

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Remember Bill, My wife grew up there......., posted by yoe on Jul 4, 2002

She had a better life before the Soviet collapse.

She says that the reason for that is that she had a government job, which was the place to be under the communist regime.

But when it fell, so did her salary.

Also, she lost all "travel privileges " She used to be able to fly to St. Petersburg, or Moscow (or anywhere in the USSR) for free.

She said that if you own your own business, things are MUCH better for you now.

I think part of the problem is that since people had learned to surive (or thrive) under commnunism, that they have to reorient their way of thinking now.

There is a trade-off, and a learning curve...

[Philb]

... in response to Remember Bill, My wife grew up there......., posted by yoe on Jul 4, 2002

I hav asked Tatyana this same question.  She did not even pause before answering that things were much better before 1991 for her and her family.

Granted,  I think her family may have been better off then many people and they were not subject to any of Stalin's purges etc..

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Playboy Magazine..., posted by UnitedNut on Jul 3, 2002

I wonder how these women are getting three month Visas???