come on Oscar, be honest

[KenC]

Oscar,
I would have emailed this to you but you do not post your address.  Rather than continue snipping with you, I will try and have an open and nonabrasive conversation with you.  
Below you post that you are not a newbie and challenge me to compare the amount of trips to the FSU.  You may not be a newbie to travel to the FSU (which was not the subject) but you ARE a newbie to most aspects of marrying a woman from the FSU.  Two weeks ago you were posting questions regarding the K-1 paperwork.  What has changed to make you an expert on the subject in 14 days?  That you have been able to "assume" that the paperwork you mailed was correct?  There is still a chance that your paperwork can be rejected for some unseen error.
   No amount a research can replace first hand experience.  There are many on this board that have much more experience in marrying a RW than you do.  Take every married guy here.  Take every guy that has had an embassy visa appointment.  There are so many details that you have yet to experience, like AOS interviews and Advanced Parol documentation, that a better approach might be to defer to those that have already traveled down those roads.  There are inconsistencies throughout the INS that you may have to deal with that you may learn about from listening to others with experience.
    You have a long road ahead of you even after your fiancee finally arrives.  Listen to the suggestions made from men here that have gone through the process.  Of course you can pick and choose which ones you will use and which ones to ignore.  But you are in no position to debate the validity of those suggestions until you have the same first hand experience.  I am sure that you are very experienced in many areas, just not this one.  What you don't know, you don't know and no amount of Internet research can rectify that.  I sincerely wish you only the best of luck in the future.  Ease back a little and join the club here.  We aint so bad.
KenC

[Dan]

... in response to come on Oscar, be honest, posted by KenC on Jun 13, 2002

Hard fought series with the Avs was the 'class' of the Stanley Cup this year.

Cheers!

- Dan

[hockeybrain]

... in response to Off-Topic - Congrats on the Wings . . ., posted by Dan on Jun 14, 2002

I was suprised they were able to beat the Avs but the Avs were worn down from the series before the Wings.

[KenC]

... in response to Re: Off-Topic - Congrats on the Wings . ..., posted by hockeybrain on Jun 14, 2002

n/t

[Dan]

... in response to or maybe the Wings were just the better ..., posted by KenC on Jun 14, 2002

And this year, the Wings were the better team - evidence the Stanley Cup and the 7-0 result in Game 7 of the Avs series.

Congrats Wings - GO AVS!!

--smile--

- Dan

[KenC]

... in response to come on Oscar, be honest, posted by KenC on Jun 13, 2002

Oscar,
I have no idea if the letter from the Dad is necessary or not.  But let me give you an example of something that does not usually show up on a website.  When your future bride is issued an Advance Parol, it is supposed to allow her a free pass back into America.  It is a visa or sorts that will cover her until she gets her green card.  My wife, Lena, refused to use it for travel back home.  She had heard horror stories about girls NOT being allowed entry even with this documentation.  I blew it off as more Russian misinformation.  You will learn that any rumor told by a passing babushka will far out weigh anything you get from a website or INS.  LOL.  But that is another story.

Anyway, I posed this question to our immigration attorney.  Let me preface this with saying our attorney was excellent and very well versed with Russia.  She was envolved with a task force from America to help the new Yeltsen administration with immigration into the USA.  I was stunned to find out that there ARE reasons to not allow re-entry into the US even with an AP!  If the immigrant had ever "been out of status" she could be denied re-entry.  How this is enforced or why remains a mystery to me.

You have to understand the magnitude of your descions when it comes to a loved one.  I for one would want to hear ALL the possibilities to insure no mistakes are made.  I am also sure that you would feel terrible if you had passed on some mis-information that kept two loving people from each other any longer than necessary.  I know that is the point Dan is trying to make.  Now you guys play nice.
KenC

[Oscar]

... in response to Re: come on Oscar, be honest, posted by KenC on Jun 14, 2002

Ken,
Actually the warning info on "advanced Paroles" as you mention it, is on some of the websites, including the Doc Steen site..

I just want you to know that I do NOT try to pass on crap info..  I felt with the issue of permission letters, I had more than a few sources to say what I said and I still do stand behind it..  As you might have read from a post of mine below, my girl IS getting a letter, as a hedge, but I do not believe it is necessary, nor will it prevent an ex spouse from creating trouble if her REALLY wants to.

Thanks for the debate as opposed to a name calling contest..  I feel that is what this site was created for..
I will never ding someone for an honest opinion.. It's the personal attacks that have to go..  I don't enjoy reading them about others, getting them myself or giving them.

Oscar

[KenC]

... in response to Re: Re: come on Oscar, be honest, posted by Oscar on Jun 14, 2002

Oscar,
The problem, as I see it, is you cannot opperate in "absolutes" in dealing with this process. You may think you have followed the rules 100% and then some clerk at the embassy, INS or customs throws you a a little known curve ball.  When it comes to the welfare of my family, I want to know all the posibilities no matter how obsure they may be.
    I never doubted your sincerity in trying to pass on reliable information.  I think you are wise to take the extra precaution of getting the letter from the Dad "just in case".  It is much better to be over prepared in this process.
KenC

[Dan]

... in response to Re: Re: come on Oscar, be honest, posted by Oscar on Jun 14, 2002

You insist that your position is correct based on what is written by others. Hmmmm . . .

Oscar, I provided you links that directly counter the position you staked out. These are from people that have very recent experience with the topic.

Doc Steen's site is a good one, however, just as the Doc Steen site has nothing about the Chicken Pox vaccination (vericella, IIRC) requirement for the AOS interview (something I just went through 2 days ago), it is not going to be up-to-the-minute on LOTS of information. And much of that information can be the difference between a relatively simple process and intense aggravation. I can tell you that the requirement for us to return a second time for the AOS stamp is very inconvenient and was nearly a complete catastrophe.

As Ken stated, the problem I have with your posts is the black-and-white nature of them on issues that can cause people serious problems. If you choose to post something that has little potential impact on couples and their processing - and it is 'all-wet' - I am not interested in debating those things with you. When you take on issues of import and are inaccurate or misleading, I feel compelled to respond - for the sake of the readers that will not be able to distinguish the relative merits of your post.

The board and its readership is best served by people who will describe their experiences - some of which are contrasting with others experiences - and that is healthy. It is not well-served (IMO) by those who come onto the board spouting opinion as fact and those who purport to *know* something about important topics affecting others and present misleading or out-of-date 'advice.'

These 2 areas have been my 'hot-buttons' for the time I've been on this board - and I suspect they will remain my hot buttons for the time I choose to continue to participate on this board.

The irony in all of this is that I had nearly stopped posting on P-L due to other time commitments/priorities. It really was your posts that resurrected my energy to spend more time here.

FWIW

- Dan

[Oscar]

... in response to In The Face of Information to the Contra..., posted by Dan on Jun 14, 2002

Dan,

Show me where this information is "out-of-date" and where your information is the "correct" information-  Are you saying that it is "required" to have a permission letter??  

I have said ALL ALONG that an ex could make trouble if he really wanted to, with or without any "letter".  It is not a golden parachute Dan.  What I have said is that "it is no longer REQUIRED" by the people your woman must pass through to bring a child to the USA, not at the passport office, not at the airport in either the US or Ukraine.  So where is the black and white Dan?  My girl is getting a letter Dan but I know that if an ex decides to get nasty, it will not be worth the paper it is written on!  I will let you know if my girl is asked even once for this letter, going from Ukraine to Poland, at the embassy , or in the airport or in the USA, ok??  If she is, then you can give me a hard time.  Those men I have spoken to, not one was asked to produce this letter either.  I suspect (SUSPECT) that the men who have had trouble with this are those where the ex has gotten upset and done something about it, at which point the letter would hardly be much help!
What you say about links to the contrary really doesn't have anything to do with it.  There are many people who go in for a simple operation that hundreds have no problem with, like an appendectomy, yet they happen to have complications.  I am certain there are men who have had problems getting a child out, but a "LETTER" is no longer "REQUIRED".  You may have to hire an attorney, go to great expense, be miserable etc, if an ex gets upset and wants to cause trouble or wants to be "paid off" but the letter is no longer required by the agencies involved from what I have found and the people I have spoken with.
I am sure there are AM out there who had a letter and yet they had complications with getting their girls child here anyway!  It is because an ex husband got upset that things became complicated.  A man there could sign a letter one day and the next, change his mind and contact a judge to quash it!  What I have said is that from a govermental perspective, it is no longer required to have this letter.  And it is not posted on JUST the Doc Steen site, but on many sites now.  You also seem to keep glossing over what I have said about speaking to men who have brought children here without any letter and were never questioned at all, not at Borispol, not in the USA.  And the fact that my girl asked specifically about this at the passport office there and was told it was not needed!  I think this is all enough for me to feel comfortable with what I am saying about this subject.  I'm sorry if you don't like it, or can't accept it, but it is what it is..

[Dan]

... in response to Re: In The Face of Information to the Co..., posted by Oscar on Jun 14, 2002

Del has kindly cited numerous legal sources for you to review.

I have posted links to people with recent experience that counters your claim.

I haven't even bothered to bring in my own personal experiences - or those of the many people with whom I have contact and have counter-experience (first-hand experience, I might add) to your claim.

Yes Oscar, it *is* true that some (maybe many) have successfully brought children over with little or no difficulty or questioning (or need of a letter).

And yes, it is also true that some (maybe many) have, indeed, been required to produce a letter. With an increasing focus on illegal human trafficking - and on increased scrutiny of immigrants to the US post-9/11 - it also seems (based on others posted experiences) that - whereas the authorities in Ukraine and the US have been relatively lax in the past with enforcement on the issue of paternal rights - that is changing.

You are wise to obtain the letter from the father. Why then you so dogmatically insist that the letter is not required - in the face of evidence to the contrary - given the fact that you know absolutely nothing about Ukraine law - considering that you, yourself, are getting the letter - well, it makes so little sense that the only possible explanation is that you want to make a 'fight' over it.

- Dan

[Oscar]

... in response to Lost Cause . . ., posted by Dan on Jun 14, 2002

No, Del was speaking about ILLEGAL ABDUCTIONS which are immaterial here.  It is not illegal in any way if the woman has sole custody.. at least not according to the agencies involved NOW, at this point in time, in the universe as it is currently constituted, as we now know it.  
If it changes in six months, you'll be the first to know, but as it stands now, a letter is not required if these conditions are met.  I will not address THIS issue with you again as it is like spitting into the wind.  You accept what you want, conveniently forget what you don't, are abusive, vengeful and childish in your personal attacks, in my opinion.

So, if you want to pay me my outpaitent rate of $90 per hour, I will be happy to help you with these issues..  But if not, then I am done wasting my time..  I felt what Jack had to say was quite well put and I would have been more than happy to leave it there, but you??  No..  You just can't leave it alone can you Dan?  Well, you will have to go it on your own because I will not waste more of my time, unless you wish to pay my fee..  

As I said earlier, if you must be like this with a total stranger, what must life be like for those who actually live around you that happen to "disagree" with you??  I don't want to think about it..

Best of luck to you and yours and congratulations on your AOS situation..

[LP]

... in response to You can pay my fee Dan or you will have ..., posted by Oscar on Jun 14, 2002

...what a pompous a-hole. $90/hr? lol, thats my tax bill.

Since I'm long finished with this (and settled in with a woman who wouldn't give a fool like you a second glance), there are very few things that could provoke me outta retirement. However, reading your crap of late is one of them.

Your entire story has been a big laugh from day one. Another "pick a chick ASAP" wonder, you haven't a clue as to what your doing and yet you have the cohones to spout off to people in the know. From what I've observed, you *do* attack people first and *are* a mean spirited person. An egomaniac who can't possibly be objective about himself, I would think in your vocation you'd know better. Funny how your type is always the last to find out what weeniers they really are. Say, your last name wouldn't be Myer now would it?

At least I know my faults (obviously I share some of your's) but continually stickin my head up my butt isn't one of them. Best you look in the mirror and heal thyself. Seems your $90/hr edjumacation also prevents you from following simple instructions for the paperwork. There are plenty of guys who've brought children over, myself included. Read the archives Sport, thats what they're there for.

Jeesh, this pick of your's must be one fine piece of work to hook up with the likes of you. I wish her luck, shes gonna need it. One good thing though, you be an inspiration to jerks worldwide who think they have no chance of snagging one of these chicks.

So, hows it feel to have your house blown down? If it'll make you feel better (and I'm sure it will), huff and puff in reply all ya want, I'm  goin back to sleep. The rest of you stay outta trouble.

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Oh please...., posted by LP on Jun 15, 2002


Obscure reference... but in the 70's EST was a philosophy that basically got people into a room and told them how worthless they were.

This somehow made them feel better about themsleves.

And people paid for the privelege!

Seems that as people line up to welcome our board's own "Don Rickles" back, I am thinking about that...

Dunno why...

[LP]

... in response to The Local EST trainer returns..., posted by MarkInTx on Jun 15, 2002

...Because its likely more effective than anything the so called mental health care "professionals" offer. Why is it these guys are usually the least (or most, depending on how one looks at it) "mental" of us all. Oscar would be surprised if he knew how much testing I had to go through during my current and previous careers. In spite of my acidity, they say I'm good to go. Lol, it kinda makes my point about them even more valid.

Look, I'm sure Mr. Myer is a nice enough guy but he was being obnoxiuos to two of the more intelligent people here and needed to be spanked. If you want to spank me for the same crime, be my guest. Me thinks my skin is thicker than your's anyway. I should actually thank you for providing me with the greatest test of willpower I've had in years. You make it difficult, I mean *really* difficult, to avoid telling you something that would rock your world. Lets just say the crew of the Enterprise and you don't share one thing in common. Fwiw, I wish you luck anyway.

APK: Fooled everyone? Hardly. Many of my posts before I moved on contained obvious hints that I was done with the process. In addition, there are people here who knew. Wheres she from? If you mean the FSU girl, shes from the same city as another guy's recent "find". Other than our jaunt to Moscow, I focused solely on this city for two years. I went though a lot of girls there, rejecting all who didn't live up to my standards and leaving them for others who, apparently, have lower ones.

Besides, I'm not one to publish the details of my personal life and frankly, don't understand those who do. Imho, only insecure men with limited or poorly learned relationship experience post fotos of their "trophies" and wax poetic like smitten teenagers. Its enough at times to gag a maggot, no wonder outsiders thinks we're all losers. Even our resident romantic here doesn't resort to that and note that most men don't either. Course, thats just my opinion. (Btw, I hope all is going well for you two.)

DE: Thanks (I think ;-), but I'm not returning. Just happened to sneak a peek and thought I'd make my presence felt. Lol, I'd pass the torch to you but I don't think you have what it takes. (Thats a compliment, btw ;-) I wish you luck as well.

Hello to KenC also. You'll be pleased to know the "theoretically" right thing was done, although I completely disagree with you about the child. Its a package deal and a man's got to take responsbility for his actions when they so deeply effect the lives of others. Continued luck to your wife and you.

So long.