Now this is just me talking. I have read about how dangerous and violent Cali is from some of you guys. Fine, dandy, it has crime here. It has it's problems. So, how do you explain myself. I have been here almost 13 months and the most violent thing I have seen thusfar, is Jim getting his cel phone ripped off. Hell, about the most violent thing I have experienced was me about to kill a guy for feeling up my girlfriend while I was about a foot away. I know one of my friends got her purse stolen by a guy on a moto with a gun. My girlfriend got her cel phone stolen by a couple of guys in car. My buddies' furniture making guy got killed 2 days ago. But, personally, I haven't experienced anything like what some of you guys have described. I am not saying it didn't happen or anything, but how do you explain a Gringo living here and nothing has happened to him? Now granted, I fit in a little better than some of you guys. Some of you are 6ft. 4in. and have blonde hair and a light complexion. I am shorter than that with darker features and hair. But all you gotta do is talk to me and you know I am a Gringo. I have been out and about around Cali. I have been stopped and searched by Police coming back into Cali from my trips and nothing out of the ordinary happened. I have been up to Yanaconas which is basically ELN controlled territory.
I have been here when 3 bombs blew up. The night the pharmacy got wiped out in the South by Ciudad Jardin. I think there were three that night. One in fornt of the pharmacy, one over by UniCentro (the one that got the bus) and the one by 3rd Brigade's gate. I missed the bomb that blew up at Torre de Cali by about a week.
Per capita, Cali is potentially more dangerous than almost any other country in the World, except maybe Israel. Have I gotten lucky all this time? Maybe. But then again, how do you explain Pete, Martin, and Nigel? These guys have been here for years and years and they are in the same spots they were when they came here. They are still running the same establishments they started when they first came here. What I am getting at is, they aren't hard to find and they never were. Nobody has killed them or attempted to.
How many guys have been here and nothing has happened while they were here? I know Bob has been here as much as me and he runs a business and we have both been coming here for around three years and nothing has happened to him. Mikey, Tommy, Dennis, Dan, AJ, Steve, alot of guys I know come here and have fine time with no problems. What about the American teachers who work at the High Schools that have been working here for some years and they have not experienced problems?
Americans come here all the time and nothing happens. Whether they come here for business, vacation, looking for a wife, or living here, MOST do have any problems. I am not saying anyone is wrong. I still say this is one of the most dangerous countries around, right now. But some of you guys make it sound like, "If you go to Colombia, you're going to get robbed or murdered. Period." Who are you guys trying to convince? It all comes down to this. If you believe this country is too dangerous to come to, don't come. All of you can read about as well as anyone. You have read the statement by the FARC about attacking Americans. You all know there has been a "civil war" for over 40 years here. You have all read in some form or fashion, what the capablities of the various rebel groups here have. You have all heard or read about the State Dept. warnings about Colombia. You have all read on this board the homicide rates of Colombia. You have all read about crime stories or close calls from the guys who have posted on this board. You all know various stories and accounts about kidnappings in Colombia. I say, heed it all. Take everything that I wrote about above as gospel until it is proved otherwise. I do. Everything pretty much has some credibility. Everything that comes up on this board or on the news or in the paper is going to be one variation or another of everything I mentioned above and it is not going to change or get better anytime soon. And, the part that I don't understand is, you all know that. So, what is the problem? Either Colombia or Hell, South America is too dangerous to visit for you, or it's not. And, even after all of that, I have survived for over 3 years of coming here on a regular basis and 13 months of living here. And, I am not the only one.
I know, someone is going to jump on me about this post, thinking I meant this post as "I'm brave and you're not. neener, neener!" Not at all. Just give it a rest about how dangerous it is here. I have read this board for years and it's the same thing all the time and yet, you all still come. Including me. You guys are just like me when deciding to come here. You weigh the good the bad and the risk and still decide to come. The day the FARC made their announcement, I saw to Gringos walking in Chìpichape and one down on 6A walking somewhere. Nothing stops us. =) Rememebr this too. MOST Colombians go to school, go to work, live their lives and grow old and never experienced all the violence of Colombia. Sure, they might know someone, but generally, it doesn't happen to them personally.
Ok, well I might write another novel sometime tonight.
Everyone take it easy.
Out........................................
PS: Sorry if this was somewhat disjointed. It was so long, I am sure I lost my train of thought once in awhile in there.

... in response to Re: Reply to Risks Post., posted by colombian on Aug 30, 2002

Sabes ami si no me la vas a montar como a muchos aqui,yo no me meto contigo como tu no te deberias meter conmigo,y en mi pais depende de lo malo que hagas,eso te pasara ati,y dime algunas vez haz ido a colombia?claro que no lo creo,etonces cuando bayas serciorate por ti mismo,nunca e visto que asesienen a nadie solo dicen y habla pero yo creo lo que veo,y lo de ny con colombia es la trizte realidad se parece muchisimo,y te digo que es mi opinion y sabes algo no no quiero quemar mas palabras contigo asi que chao y espero me repetes o tus padres no te enzenaron a respetar ala gente,y ademas esto es un forum de opinion y eso es lo que hago dar mi propia opinion,espero no ofender a nadie a qui,pero este senor no tienen respeto para nadie,solo doy un comentario y me reponde con groseria,osea respeta alas mujeres porque te trepaste en un mal palo.
bueno un beso a todos chao,y que dios los bendiga con carino la:colombiana.

... in response to Reply to Risks Post., posted by Traveller on Aug 29, 2002


Hey Keith,

This is James, how's it going?  The whole topic of violence and crime comes up a lot on the board and it's not likely to ever go away. Crime, the FARC,  these are two topics that will be rehashed over and over again.   I swear everytime this subject comes up, two sides develop, one side says Cali is like any U.S. city and therefore like travelling to any other city.  The proponents of this always point to how dangerous some neighborhood in the Bronks or L.A. is and with this logic they say SEE, Cali's no different than are own country.  Now the other side of this debate seems to think that every gringo who steps off the plane in Cali is going to either be kidnapped by the FARC or shot down in the streets of Cali.  My own opinion is that both arguments are silly and that there's a middle ground that is more honest.  YES Cali is a very dangerous city but NO you are not likely to be shot down on Avenida Sexta.    

As far as my stories they all really happened.  Not one of them was very earth shattering in the moment but over time I was left with the impression that you know this is a little more dangerous than I first thought.  I talked to Peter at his bar one night about a whole list of crazy things I'd seen in a six week time span and he said you know I've been in Cali for years and never seen what you have.  So you're right, a lot of Colombians and expats go about their life and nothing violent ever happens to them.  But being a statistically dangerous city does not mean you personally are going to be killed, violence can be random and you just never know when your number may come up.  The truth is, even living in Cali, it's very unlikely that I would be killed but as you start looking beyond yourself and into family, friends and aquaintences I think the randomness becomes much more predictable.

Anyway the point of my post was not to scare people away.  Cali is a great city in many ways and probably the one place I'm most happy traveling to.  However I think this subject will continue to come up as new guys join the board and so I'm offering a slightly different view.

El Diablo

... in response to LMAO...Where is the Bronks?, posted by Hoda on Aug 30, 2002

Howard,
Ah the Bronks,I mean Bronx.One of the few places in the US as dangerous as Colombia.And such polite people.They had a way of saying f---,sort of spitting it out,that was really unique.I used to buy cars wholesale out of there,Jerome Avenue.My trucker wouldn't go in,someone had to drive them to New Jersey for him.When I got out of the business they were moving the whole operation to Teterboro New Jersey.

Pete

... in response to LMAO...Where is the Bronks?, posted by El Diablo on Aug 30, 2002

Hi guys,
Where have you guys been? Hoda, Oscar says, "Hello." I saw him the other day at the restaurant, Golden Buda.
Hoda, write me that email.