Here is what has happened so far.

[micha1]

... in response to Jeesh, here is some...., posted by LP on Mar 6, 2002

LP, when you do get into politic, you san count on my vote, anywhere, anytime, just let me know the date of the
election ahead of them.

[Del]

... in response to Jeesh, here is some...., posted by LP on Mar 6, 2002

sure am glad to see you've your 'kid gloves' on today!!!

[yoe]

... in response to Jeesh, here is some...., posted by LP on Mar 6, 2002

The problem with this type of mate hunting or 'fishing' is that there is a fantasy element. With women close to home we can easily be the booter or the bootee and can get a mono a mono perspective. The FSU element or any long distance relationship is a Disney land Express paradox. First we are enamered by there imiginary flawlessness and 'love' for us. In contrast we cant trust them due to the imaginary immorality of there culture. It took a while before I actually believed my wife when she said she never had sex for money--------:) But I believe all women get paid for sex some way or the other. But nevertheless, we cannot be objective. Is this bad? Yes and No. We are able to experience a truly 'romantic' sensation that is only comperable to the Sunday night movie on the Women's network. The bad new is-the fantasy ends...........I know there are many men happily married to Russian women-but I think they will admit, the fantasy was one He!! of a thriller. Anyway, LP excuse these behaviors. It is truly love. But I feel that you and I are both aware of the chemical implications of that. More importantly, I feel guys like you and I are just hardened-we call it practical. Foro guys like us RW are even better. They are hard and tempered but have strong feminine qualities-it takes guys like us to deal with this. Others who are emotionally 'gree' in the tree of heartache will do well also. They will just find themselves in a more Mother/yes mam relationship. And, that is OK too. I have to keep my girl in check always or she would truly walk all over me-I think she does it on purpose to keep my teeth sharp-it works...........she is such a smart girl-my wife.
Anyway
Joe

[LP]

... in response to Speaking from experience........, posted by yoe on Mar 6, 2002

....you're starting to scare me yoey, you're makin to much sense these days.

[terry]

... in response to Here is what has happened so far., posted by Philb on Mar 5, 2002


It is time to fish or cut bait. You have to do what you feel good about. May not mean a thing, But if i was in your positions, I would wirte her and tell her how you feel. However something has come up that you both need to get past in order to have the type of  relationship you want with her. Ask her, if she feels you need to maybe think about writing to other ladies. You will find out how she really feels about you.  If she is really not sure of your future intentions, this could give her a way out ,or  to come clean with.  All, that I have read here is good advice. I may be a little different, but I see this as a good opportunity to find out just exactly where you are at in this relationship. I would even give her the oppertunity to come clean on it. I would ask her to help you understand how this man got the picture that was taken while you were there?  You will also learn how honest she will be.  She may have just been keeping th e doors open to see if it works out between you.  She was caught, now she may be sitting there trying to figure out how to hold things togather.  If this is ture, she needs your help.
Give her the opportunity.  Throw her the ball and see how she handles it. Lay all the cards on the table. You know her better than anyone here. You know how you feel about her better than anyone here.  I am pretty direct in the way I handle things. But, I would do it in a way thar makes it easy for her to tell the truth. It can be done.

[KenC]

... in response to Re: Here is what has happened so far., posted by terry on Mar 6, 2002

Terry,
I like your approach a lot.  The idea of leaving her some "wiggle room" is great.  I also agree that this is the point where this relationship will sink or swim.  This is Phil's opportunity to define his relationship with the RW.  Life has a way of forcing firm decsions when they are necessary.
KenC

[terry]

... in response to good post, posted by KenC on Mar 6, 2002

Tahnk You Ken, I even used a Dictionary:)

[chuck12]

... in response to Here is what has happened so far., posted by Philb on Mar 5, 2002

Phil, first of all, these other agencies may have stolen or purchased her picture/address from other agencie(s). That doesn't explain where the other pictures came from, unless there is maybe even a 5th agency which has many photos of her that could have been used. She may be quite unaware of other agencies using her profile. If she is serious about you, ask her to remove the profile from these agencies, but on the flip side if you wish her to restrict her attention only to you, then of course so should you restrict your attention to other RW's.  You could also setup a dummy email account and write her under a ficticious name, her reply (if any) may prove one way or the other as to her sincerity, her removing these profiles would be other proof of her sincerity. You could also contact the agencies yourself and find out how the profile was obtained.  

I would give her the benefit of the doubt until proven wrong, but all this really depends on how serious your intentions are? Among other things, relationships are built on trust and if there is any failings in this area, its just a house of glass. Good luck.

[BarryM]

... in response to What I would recommend......, posted by chuck12 on Mar 6, 2002

He stated that he found her profile on a Russian language singles site that is internal to Russia, not a marriage agency that caters to Western men. It becomes a much different situation because it may mean that she is looking for someone local to have a fling with.

-blm

[Mike]

... in response to Chuck, if you read Philb's earlier posts..., posted by BarryM on Mar 6, 2002

If I was single, and wanting to try to find girls that hundreds of others haven't wrote to from the states one of the first places I would look is in Russian personals. Even if she didn't speak English I would bet she would figure out a way to read it out of curiosity, and there's always a good chance she may speak English.
Mike --- who's too tired to do a spell check

[BrianN]

... in response to Here is what has happened so far., posted by Philb on Mar 5, 2002

With all of the good feedback that has already been posted, I'll try my own, for what it's worth.

A relationship, where marriage is going to be considered, should have some natural components to it.

There are too many mechanical ones here, that seem to be obfuscating the natural parts.  The two trips, the visiting the relatives... the relationship with kid... all of that bs, is just mechanical.

The natural thing, is that this girl shouldn't have to be told to think about and "consider", the future by you.  This girl, if she's really looking forward to having a wonderful new husband (stateside or not), should be drooling with anticipation at the thought.  Either she's REALLY happy with you Phil, or she's just coasting in neutral.  (Maybe she's been hosed over by one too many guys before, such as other men planning to visit that never did.. etc).

But all of that (assumption) is based on what you're saying Phil, as you really craft your words well, so well, that the underlying meaning of them, can be missed.  I mean, who was it that said you talked too much about skiing and not about her?  I mean, you've got enough hidden caveats contained your statements concerning your future (marriage) relationship with this lady that it sounds like you're almost EXPECTING to have to pull the ripcord that you've weaved.

I mean, think about it, if you're unsure, then obviously there's a reason for it - (even without the adverts you found). I wouldn't necessarily call any of this HER FAULT, but rather, if there was a problem, and it was hers, then it would be her level of desire for you, that was creating this whole situation.

The only test, imo, that can be used here, is simply to start limiting communication with her, and then see where it goes.  If she's really in love with you, then she'll definitely be doing some serious thinking, and taking some more agressive action.  If she keeps asking over time what's wrong, then it would be prudent to either avoid the issue, or just tell her that you've got some thinking to do, since it's obvious that "we" have a communications problem - (what relationship doesn't), that is creating doubt about your belief in you two as a long term couple.  That's it.  

If the woman that you want to have in your life is willing to go the extra mile for you ON HER OWN, (as she expected you to do for her), then you'll have a great match made, otherwise, I expect that you'll be heartbroken in the future.

I guess you've done everything you're supposed to do.  Now it's time to see what she does.

Good luck with it.

[LP]

... in response to what a crap fest., posted by BrianN on Mar 5, 2002

... indeed.

lol, I especially liked the "crap fest" part.

[thesearch]

... in response to what a crap fest., posted by BrianN on Mar 5, 2002

that was me who mentioned about skiing in the trip report

not one report of a romantic dinner - and special moments and words shared - did that happen Phlib?

The answer needs to be yes IMHO

[Philb]

... in response to well worded, posted by thesearch on Mar 6, 2002

My post after my last trip was meant to be more of a factual report rather then a discussion of my feelings.

And Yes her and I did have many beautiful moments together.

In regards to my post below about her being cautios in expressing her feelings, I always found this cautiousness to be re-assuring.  She wasn't expressing undying love for me after a week.  She always said that she did not want to mislead me and wanted to be certain before she spoke to me of certain things.  I always looked upon this as a very admirable quality in her.

[thesearch]

... in response to Re: well worded, posted by Philb on Mar 6, 2002

I agree with you totally here. You certainly would not want the opposite.

I got the feeling from reading your post that if Tatyana had been ready - I mean totally ready  that you would have officially proposed on your last visit.

Did I read correctly inbetween the lines on this?