An Apology.... I Stand Corrected

[mdante99]

I would like to modify my post below about myths; those are my experiences; one experience does not prove or disprove anything one way or the other. I think Dan and others are correct there.
A review of the thread clearly shows that the vast majority of AM have spent tens of thousands of dollars and many years in the search and many have gotten nowhere yet. For me to assume that this is a universally quick and inexpensive process is stupidity on my part.
I had no idea that this is the case. I still don't know if the majority is that way or just the vocal majority. Nonetheless, I admit that my experience may not be duplicable.

You tend to judge the rest of the world from your own experiences; many of us have been guilty of that; I certainly am guilty of it here.

I have no apologies for finding a girl who spoke fluent English, was career oriented and had means of her own; my apology is for thinking that everyone else can do it too or even want to.

I received a number of letters privately from this Board, in which people described their harrowing experiences in searching for MOB; one person wrote that he had been to FSU eight times in six years and had spent $50,000; and had not find anyone. Obviously my thinking would appear to be asinine under those circumstances.

The fact remains that for me the process took less than six months, and less than $2,000. For the record in my only trip to Lithuania, I met with four women, all of them very attractive and with good jobs, who spoke fluent Englsh and selected one.

Whether it was a good choice or not, the time will tell; I torally agree that one year does not make a successful marriage; and one experience does not make a rule.

Let us hope for the best... for all us.

Mark

[BarryM]

... in response to An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by mdante99 on Dec 20, 2001

I can't believe it!

Finally some humility from Mark over his faux pas. Keep it up and you will even be considered congenial. Maybe the wife is beginning to crack through the arrogance. A good thing.

-blm

[tim360z]

... in response to An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by mdante99 on Dec 20, 2001

I think thats what you had and it will be difficult for others to do it.  There are plently of par players who have never ever had the luck of a whole in one.  They play a very good game...but no hole in one.  Now,  I know guys who are not as good golfers who...for some unknown lucky reason have shot a hole in one.  I have seen a few.  Now the better players may try to duplicate this on the same hole and with the same address of the ball and everything....but no hole in one.  Theres a little luck or something to that.  These less experienced golfers who hit the shot in 1---will surely never do it again.  No matter how hard they try.  Well,  life can be alot like golf.

[yoe]

... in response to A Hole In One, posted by tim360z on Dec 20, 2001

or was that snow? anyway..........
Joe

[MarkInTx]

... in response to I thought sex was like golf!, posted by yoe on Dec 20, 2001


Yikes,

You thought that???

[tim360z]

... in response to You mean that the fewer the strokes... t..., posted by MarkInTx on Dec 21, 2001

sex.  Thats a little different.

[micha1]

... in response to I thought sex was like golf!, posted by yoe on Dec 20, 2001

simply not played with the same stick.

[thesearch]

... in response to A Hole In One, posted by tim360z on Dec 20, 2001

That hole is harder to hit with dirty balls.

[Stan B]

... in response to A Hole In One, posted by tim360z on Dec 20, 2001

I don't think that there can be a better and simpler explaination of how it works out for us as a group. I went "golfing" over there and got a hole in one on my 2nd swing and I think if I took a 1000 more swings I could never hit a shot like that 1. (Marina was the 2nd girl I met there and we were introduced w/o any prior corespondance.)

[Charles]

... in response to An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by mdante99 on Dec 20, 2001

nt

[thesearch]

... in response to An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by mdante99 on Dec 20, 2001


Mark,

This is what I Mythed:

My myth creation = you are unlucky in the FSU pursuit.

Clearly a myth as things would stand today. How'd I do? ))

Seriously, I think your post was valuable - it was a representation of what you were able to manifest in your life. What is important about your post to me is this.

THE PAST DOES NOT EQUAL THE FUTURE

This is directed at those such as myself that have not been so fortunate. All it takes is one lady - that is it. No one said this would be inexpensive. There will be those that will find a life time of happiness that can not be equated in any dollars and cents and there will be those that think they have succeeded that will go through hell and heartache that also can not be equated in dollars in cents even though the bank account damage will try to prove otherwise. But, you know, that is life.

I remember reading a book about seven self made millionaires. The upshot of all of this was that these individuals had failed more than most people that you might categorize as failures.

One of the things that made these people stand apart from the crowd was that they viewed failure as a learning experience that was merely an incident that only improved their chances of success in the future.

They acknowledged that the fairy tale stories where everything works out perfectly is not the real world. And, perhaps most importantly they did not let failures affect their confidence or attitude, they picked themselves back up and approached life with the same zeal as before the failure.

They knew that the more darts they threw at their target the chances of getting a bullseye increased mathematically.

They knew that they needed to be wise with their finances as one never knew how many darts had to be purchased for any task.

Again, these winners lost more times than losers. They just did not let losing affect their attitude about winning. They did not know the meaning of the word quit.

I think that you now realize that you went to Las Vegas and before checking into your room you put a dollar in the big slot machine with the big handle at the entrance of the hotel - pulled it, turned to see where you check in and all of a sudden bells and whistles go off and a manager comes up to you and asks you what color you would like your Mercedes to be.

I am very happy for you.

I say that, even if one does everything right as you perceive that you did - the result obtained is unpredictable. Then you add the fact that many do not go about this like a business. Yes, you heard me - like a business - the business of finding the right woman. When guys here or trolls say "Geeez finding a wife is not like shopping for an automobile!"  My response is the heck it isn't. There are a tremendous amount of similarities.

To be methodical, meeting multiple women is contrary to what many commonly envision as the correct way to do things. However it is not really contrary to what we do when you really look at it.

It is just at home  multiple women are spread out over time. But with the FSU - there is not the same time/location equation and modification is in order to improve one's odds of success. Of course, if you can move there you solve the problem but, this is not possible for 99.9% involved here.

I personally appreciate this as it was hard for me to approach this so methodically simply because of how I was culturally taught to approach the issue of finding true love.

Me, I have not kept track of how much the FSU adventure has cost me. I do not want to know. However, after failing at the one woman approach, I have learned that I need to change  how I do this even if it is uncomfortable.

The one woman approach did not look like it was failing. I enjoyed this ladies company very much and she experienced the same. However, she had some serious abuse issues that surfaced.

There was a red flag the first time we met. I did not ignore it but it was verified on our second visit. It was a problem that was too big a mountain that would cast a shadow that would make success very uncertain. To bring her home I would have always been on pins and needles wondering when the bomb might go off. I could have picked this lady after meeting 100 women. There is no total protection.

This is not something that you can predict - it is something that you have to find out. It is not cheap to do this sometimes.

But, I had some great trips out of all of this - trips that I would never have taken. And you know, other than the disappointment of it all I would do again. I mean, I got to go to some great places and experienced them with the company of a beautiful woman. I would do it again even though the end result was not what the plan was.

[Jeff S]

... in response to An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by mdante99 on Dec 20, 2001

Well, Mark, I, for one understood what you were saying all along. The concept of "How much will this cost" as one responder said is repugnant, but in addition, it's a silly question. Let's say you were middle aged, newly divorced, knew no single women and wanted to get married to an American women. How long would it take and how much will it cost? WHO KNOWS??? No one can come even close to estimating it. Are you an extremely picky mortgage banker in mid-town Manhattan where a date could easily set you back a couple of C's or you an Amish man in Ohio where the neighbors will set you up with the widow lady and an acceptable date is sitting on the porch swing sipping lemonade and reading from the Bible? How long will it take? As long as it takes. How much will it cost? As much as it costs.

The same holds true for New York as it does for Helena Montana, Moscow Russia, Tokyo Japan, or Cali Columbia. By the way, what are you in a hurry for? Why are you on a budget? What else were you planning to do with your money? Spending a few to a few dozen thousand spread over a half to a few years is witihin the budget of all but the least industrious of Americans. Working a part time job 10 extra hours a week, even at minimum wage will net you over 3 grand in a year. Trust me after you get married you're going to HAVE TO put in an extra 10 hours per week on your wife.

In my own case, I spent two and a half years and three trips to my wife's country. I never kept track of the expenses, because I planned ahead, saved up and just did it. I also had no personal timetable - things worked out as they worked out. I was willing to spend whatever time and money it took over the long haul - and at that time I wasn't raking in the dough so I didn't have to worry about it  - I was just your average engineer living in an apartment in a relatively high cost of living area.

My only comment about the how long and how much debate is that if you're scraping by, living from paycheck to paycheck here in the US, you probably don't have the wherewithall to expand your search overseas. If you're doing OK and are willing to spend some extra effort and money, you can find her. How much is it worth to you?

-- Jeff S.

[mdante99]

... in response to Re: An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by Jeff S on Dec 20, 2001

Even though you are married to an Asian woman; there are many similarities.

Mark

[WilliamF]

... in response to Re: An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by Jeff S on Dec 20, 2001

Jeff - well said. As I stated below, this whole discussion about how much a foreign bride "costs" is distasteful. I did not save my receipts or keep a running tab.

I don't think Mark owes anyone an apology. He simply made the statement: "It cost me all of $2000, including my trip to Lithuania." If some "new guy" can't figure out this is one man's experience, and not some "rule of thumb" then he is a lost cause. As you pointed out, there are far too many variables to offer a meaningful "estimate." Basically, my thinking is that if a guy can't figure out what is and what is not within his financial means using his own common sense and experience he is doomed for failure in any marriage.

[Patrick]

... in response to Re: Re: An Apology.... I Stand Corrected, posted by WilliamF on Dec 20, 2001

I think the problem is that some guys just don't have "common sense."  SOme of them assume things will be the same for them as they are for the next guy, including how interested the ladies will be in him, the costs, and how the marriage will go.  One of the things I see a lot are guys that assume all the ladies are the same.  If someone says "My wife ....." they assume their wife will too.  Perhaps it is a bit of the "buying a car" mentality and some people assume that the women are mass-produced objects.  They aren't and the path to finding love takes many routes, none of which are "correct."

I would agree with the guy who felt that those without financial resources may want to reconsider whether they should even try this.  It generally isn't cheap and someone who can only afford $2,000 would most likely be spending the money only on a foreign vacation. I would have been satisfied myself just with the experiences I had even if I had not found my wife.  But for those who don't enjoy experiencing foreign culture and who's sole interest is in finding a wife, they could be sorely disappointed if they are limited to one trip.  They also risk feeling forced into a quick decision that they might regret later.

Anyone assuming that if they can cut out the agency it'll be low cost is making an erroneous assumption.  In my case, I think I spent somewhere around $500 through various agencies.  The costs of four trips abroad, international phone calls, and other related expenses ran considerably higher and the agency fees turned out to be only a very small part of my overall expenditures.