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Anyone know how the California courts handle child support?   If the wife takes the child to the Philippines and I file for divorce here in California would the amount of child support be based on the cost of living in the Philippines?  Could my wife and I agree on our own amount?  I don't think it is fair to have the father deprived of his child and be expected to pay huge child support to the Philippines.  My wife said she will go and won't ask for support.  I will pay support for the child because I believe I am morally obligated.  I just don't want to spend more than what I think is fair for me. We were married here in California.  My wife wants to return to the Philippines.

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Hi! Can you share Your story? thanks, Peabody

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

PANTHER:

My wife said she will go and won't ask for support

STEPHEN:

It makes no difference what your wife says.  Child support is not something that a parent can waive...it is the child's right.

That means that your wife can put on her Mother Teresa suit and promise you the moon.  But just as soon as she gets what she wants then she can put the screws to you.

Remember....this is divorce.  Don't expect her to be truthful.

ALSO....don't let you kid out of the country if you want to have any part in her life.  Your wife know that it will take your permission to get the child out of the USA.  But once she gets the child out of the state, then she has you where she wants.

I'm a california lawyer.  You better take care.

Stephen

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by Stephen on Nov 19, 2001

:-)

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by Stephen on Nov 19, 2001

I respect your advice.  Should I be seeking a family law attorney or an immigration attorney?  Are there some that specialize in both?  The family law attorney I spoke to today didn't impress me with his knowledge of immigration matters.  How does one go about picking a good lawyer for a situation like this? I agree with what you and others are saying about keeping the baby in the country.

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by Stephen on Nov 19, 2001

Stephen is Right. Do not allow your Daughter to leave the States. Once they are in the Philippines, you may never see her again. My Pinoy Son is here, I would never dream of taking him back to the Philippines, becuz his Mom is still there and she may never allow him to leave again. You need a Lawyer to help you keep your daughter here, also I do not care what others say. But your daughter will not be treat special in RP, whatever money you send to your wife will be used for her family circle, your daughter will just be one of the family, nothing special. For example if her family has a problem and needs money, your wife's going to use your daughter's money. I thank God everyday that my Son is here living a good life. If You want the best for your Child, then you better fight to keep her here.  Mr Peabody

... in response to Re: Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001


of would never dream to take your son back to the Philippines???? because your son's mother is still there. Your son's mother trusted you to bring your son here in the US why don't you do the same to her? I don't think that is fair to his mother.
Me and my daughter stayed in the Philippines for over 3 months vacation and all my family love and treated her special there.

If you want the best for your child, then let him/her grow up with both parents (mother and father) even the parents are divorce/separated let the kid enjoy having both father and mother part of his life.

... in response to Re: Greg what do you mean...?, posted by NoNamePinay on Nov 20, 2001

I filed two Visas for my Son's Mother, she failed both. I do not know if I want to try a 3rd time, she's upset that I made no serious effort to bring her here after my Son's arrival. I would love to take our Son to visit her, but I feel that once he's back there, her family circle would try to keep him there. Your correct that our Son needs both Parents, I would love to take him to visit her, but as I said, theres a possibly that he wouldn't be allowed to leave RP. My Son is doing excellent here, if he was there in the Philippines then his Mother would use the child support for her family and not him. I understand that the Filipinos feel that the child should be with the Mother, thats not the case here in America. The best Parent should take care of the child, and since I can put him first in my life, then I should care for him. He's recieving top medical care, schooling, lotssss of Love. In the Philippines he would just be one of the children in their big family, no special treatment. Btw, I generously send his Mommie an allowance averaging $175 monthly, she does nothing, but she's always broke..Why??? Go figure it out..How can she take good care of my Son on a good allowance when she cannot even take care of her ownself? Read Howards Post about why the child should be in the States, makes sense. Here he's my baby King lol ..Mr Peabody

... in response to Hi! NonamePinay, posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001

You're doing the right thing Greg. You're a smart cookie!

... in response to Re: Greg what do you mean...?, posted by NoNamePinay on Nov 20, 2001

......Because the mother is a nut case and has threatened her own life and the childs. Are you brain dead? Sheesh!

... in response to Why keep the kid??????????.........., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001


do you have any proof that she is really a nut case? you only heard from the other side no evidence...am I a brain dead how about you???

... in response to Re: Why keep the kid??????????.........., posted by NoNamePinay on Nov 20, 2001

Let's see a raise of hands. Who think she is a nut case?

... in response to Take a vote......, posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001


I see only one hand raise 'YOURS' :D

Mars, you seems like you hate the world. I was just asking Greg about his comment to his son's mother and you're the one there so quick to answer my question and accusing me of dead brain? Peace

... in response to Re: Take a vote......, posted by NoNamePinay on Nov 20, 2001

No..I don't hate the world but I do deeply dislike women like Howards wife and Panther's who use good people in their ridiculous pursuit of instant gratification and who knows what else. These type of women need to be dumped and dumped hard and not given any slack. They have no consideration for anyone but themselves. I have been on this board for a few years longer than most. My conclusion? Go to China, Japan or Taiwan if you want an Asian wife. Avoid the Philippines at all costs. Seems like all the women there are trouble. There are exceptions though as many here can attest. It is my personal view, of course. Take it or leave it.

... in response to Re: Re: Take a vote......, posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

...where you are coming from and why you sound so hateful toward these women whom you don't even know.

It's because they are Filipina, right? It is quite obvious from this post of yours. Prejudice is never pretty.

Ray

... in response to Now I think I understand..., posted by Ray on Nov 20, 2001

Look deeper Ray. I gathered what I know of Filipinas from the experts and experienced vets right here at Planet Love. All one needs to do is read all the posts here with all the guys that have problems with Filipinas. Screaming prejudice or labeling someone prejudice is always an easy way out. It saves the person the embarressment of showing everyone how little intelligence he possesses. Good Luck.

... in response to Re: Now I think I understand..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

You may be right about my lack of intelligence, but it doesn't take a genious to see through your obvious dislike for Filipina women.

Good luck to you.

Ray

... in response to Re: Re: Now I think I understand..., posted by Ray on Nov 21, 2001

The difference...I dislike what appears to be their behavior in general so I "prefer" not to be involved with one. Prejudice is an entirely different thing i.e hatred towards an entire race. and you should learn the difference before you start hog calling prejuduce when someone does not share your point of view. What I possess is "preference", not prejudice...and you're right, it shouldn't take a genius to see prejudice...but even you should know the difference between the two.

... in response to The Difference, posted by Mars on Nov 21, 2001

Mars, first let me state that I have never had anything against you personally and I respect your right to express your opinions just like everyone else here, so there’s no need to be insulting. Yes, I do know the difference between preference and prejudice. And no, I don’t call people prejudiced because they don’t share my point of view. If you have been reading my posts for the last 3 years you should know that.

I guess I owe you an explanation for my using the term prejudice, which I do not use lightly. I don’t see you post here very frequently, but I was a little surprised by some of your responses in the recent discussions. I can accept the fact that you may be very opinionated and strongly present your case, and there is nothing wrong with that. But frankly, I found some of your comments quite insulting and somewhat arrogant. While others took a position similar to yours, you were the only one making personal attacks on those with opposing views. Your responses implied that only those that agreed with you were sane (“Another sane voice in the wilderness”), other’s opinions were worthless (“Screw all the rest of the advice here”), you’re better or more intelligent than others (“Are you brain dead?”, “I just am a vocal guy that sees the truth a little clearer than most”), and other insulting remarks (“Sheesh!”), etc. Overall, I would say that your behavior in these discussions was not exactly civil or in line with a rational debate in my opinion.

It’s not so much that those things bothered me unduly, but some of the remarks you made about the women under discussion just made no sense to me and you seemed he11 bent on destroying their reputations. Why so fired up and passionate about someone whom you never met? I just figured that you were being rather harsh on them because of your past experiences with women. But then you jumped on a Filipina poster (NoNamePinay) for no apparent reason, calling her brain dead. It was you next response to her that I found prejudiced against Filipina women. The comments “Avoid the Philippines at all costs” and “Seems like all the women there are trouble” fit the definition of prejudice in my book. I would have no problem if you said something like “I prefer Chinese or Japanese women over Filipinas”, and I would agree that such a statement would be expressing your ‘preference’. But your comments were quite negative, hurtful, and derogatory, hence expressing a ‘prejudice’ against Filipinas in general. But I did not find your comments to be in the realm of bigoted or racist, just prejudicial.

I should stress that it was your ‘comments’ that I found prejudiced. I don’t know you personally and I can’t and won’t label you as a prejudiced person. If that was implied by my remarks, then I apologize, in the interest of keeping the peace here.

All I ask is that we respect each other’s opinions here and debate the issues in a civil manner.

Peace,

Ray

... in response to Re: The Difference, posted by Ray on Nov 21, 2001

Apology Accepted Ray. I apologize to you too. I mean what I say when I post but I am too strong worded at times.

... in response to Re: The Difference, posted by Ray on Nov 21, 2001

.

... in response to Re: The Difference, posted by Ray on Nov 21, 2001


Mr. Ray,
Thank You very much!!! I really appreciate it.
I don't know what Mars problem but I hope He won't take on all Filipinas because of one Filipina is bad
it doesn't mean that all Filipinas are bad. He is the first and only person who called me brain dead. He don't know nothing about me so I don't care.
Actually, my hubby always said to me that I'm smart maybe he only say that because he's my hubby :)).

I like reading all your posts because you always give a great advice and ideas.

NNP

... in response to Re: Re: The Difference, posted by NoNamePinay on Nov 21, 2001

Please noname.... quit trying to milk sympathy. You took my post way out of context. You act as though your ears are virgin to this type of talk but I know that that is nonsense and so do you. CHill out and relax. No offense was meant by the "brain dead" comment. Sometimes things are said like that here in America and nothing is meant by it. If you are living here or you are going to live here soon, you might want to develope a thicker skin. You seem to be the type of person who starts yelling out loud and pointing saying: "Look what he did to me"!!!!!!!! Enuff said. Don't bother posting a response as it won't be read by me.

... in response to Re: Now I think I understand..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

And it also encourages those of whatever group it is, associated with deviant behavior, to play the race (or gender) card to get away with things non-members would not be able to get away with.

- Kevin

... in response to Take a vote......, posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

What is this? Psychiatry by Internet poll? Should we also take a vote to see if she should be executed at sunrise?

Why such a passionate desire to break up all these marriages? Are you on some kind of a mission? Just curious, that’s all.

Ray

... in response to Take a vote......, posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

in case you want to burn her at the stake. You seem to have plenty of lighter fluid.

Dave H.

... in response to I've got some firewood..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

I said Vote. v-o-t-e

... in response to Re: I've got some firewood..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

I vote that you just Chill..Your Posts sound mean spirited. Loosen Up..

... in response to Re: Re: I've got some firewood...Mars, posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001

No mean spirit here....Just 20-20 vision.

... in response to Re: I've got some firewood..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

that you get evaluated...you're nuts!

Dave H.

... in response to I vote..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

At least I didn't lay in the middle of the road like the nut case I was talking about. Sheesh!! Where is your rationality man?

... in response to Re: I vote..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

The lady has a big problem at the moment! Is it perminent, I certainly don't know. I would also like to see the father with the child as long as she is a threat to its safety.

Dave H.

... in response to I agree..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

I agree. Cool Man

... in response to Re: Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001

You said you would never dream of taking your son back to the Philippines because his mom may never allow him to leave again.

I was just curious. Is mom ever going to get to see her son again? I was wondering if you think that would be fair to the mother and your son to keep them apart. Is there a double standard here? Was she a bad mother? Didn’t she let you take him away for the good of her baby? Has she had a change of heart and now wants him back with her? I don’t know, but she sounds like a decent mother.

Not judging you Greg but your post just raised some questions in my mind. Have you made a final decision yet on whether or not to marry his mom?

Ray

... in response to Hey Greg, posted by Ray on Nov 20, 2001

Ray, I love my Son's Mommie. I have tried hard to get her here..This would be her third Visa...The problem isn't my Son's mother, it's her family circle. As I said before, she need to annulment her marriage..I would need to send her a large fund, the problem is that I don't know if she would honestly use it for her situation, becuz her family is having tons of problems, her Parents are asking me for money which of course I refuse to give. She tells them everything, I asked her why?? She feel that if they ask, then she must tell. I feel that my Mahal was a better person when she was working abroad and not around her family. I want my Son's Mother to be with us, but she could make things worst, becuz I feel that she only care about her family and not us. It would cost me thousands of dollars to get her here, and it's a big gamble bringing a Pinay here, you don't know how things will turn out, what happened to other Guys Horror stories can happen to any Guy. Yes, I'm afraid, don't want to be made an additional Fool. I already feel like a Fool for sending large amount of allowance to her when she's doing nothing. Would feel more Foolish to bring a Woman here that would make my life worst. Ray, not all Guys are lucky like You. At this point I don't trust sending a large amount of money to her..so things cannot get started until I send the money. She keep lying to me about what she does with money I send, and since her family having all these problems..Why should she use the large amount to solve her annulment? You know its tempting to use it for her family's problems. If I take my Son for a visit, he may not be allowed to leave RP. Sooo really I don't know what to do. Money's not the issue for me, honesty and trust. Btw, I'm doing an excellent job caring for our Son without any help from her, he's a very happy boy and he loves me very much. Yeah, I hope someday to get us together, but she need to start being honest and truthful about all things. Believe it or not..Most Pinays are habit Liars. Mr Peabody

... in response to Hi Ray, posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001

Greg,

It sounds like you’re doing a great job of raising your little one. You also make a good point about the importance of honesty and trust. Unfortunately, I think dishonesty is an imbedded character trait that will probably never go away. What you see is what you get.

As far as the annulment option, I understand your not wanting to send a lot of money for the legal proceedings because of the trust issue. But since you are sending her a decent allowance anyway, maybe you can give her the chance to annul her marriage without sending any more funds. Maybe you could tell her to find a way to pay for a lawyer with the money she is getting from you now. Let her find a more affordable attorney or save up the money she needs from her allowance to pay for the legal costs. That way she has the option to give her money to her family or use it fix her legal problems. Make it her choice which way she wants to go. I think you said you were sending $175 per month? She could likely live comfortably while saving up a good part of that for the legal costs. Unless she decides to give it away, then it’s her problem, not yours. Might just teach her a healthy respect for money? Just throwing some ideas around Greg. You seem to have a good handle on the situation already.

One other thing Greg. Not ALL Pinays are habitual liars. Trust me on that one.

Good luck,

Ray

... in response to Re: Hi Ray, posted by Ray on Nov 21, 2001

Thank You sooo much both you and dave made me feel better about my situation. I'm going to copy your letter and use it to write gregory's mother a letter explaining that she need to save from her allowance and solve her annulment herself, that would be proof that she's trying to make an effort to do something herself instead of accepting an easy way out. Yes, I have been sending her an average of $175-$200 per month. She told me that she pay church tithes out of her allowance. She said that her Parents need me to send them $200 to help them pay a important bill, of course I refused. My Mahal started telling me lies to try to get that $200 for her Parents, thats when I decided that I could no longer trust her. In fact she was trying to force me to give it to them with different lies. Her birthday card to our Son was almost two months late, she only use her allowance to email me short letters once a week, I'm only guessing that she use her money to take care of her family, becuz she's always broke. Ray, I am telling you that if it wasn't for my Son, I would leave her alone..I just feel frustrated with her lying to me all the time, I can no longer trust her to tell me the truth about anything. I really wanted to try my best to help her solve her annulment and apply for her third Visa, but her dishonesty is making me feel uncomfortable, she thinks nothing of lying, she even openly tell me how she lies to others. My second trip to be with her really didn't work out good, she really changed from the first time I was with her, I think being around her messy family circle changed her, becuz when I first met her she was fresh out of being overseas for six years. Again I thank you and dave for your good advice. Btw, I'm doing fine with our Son without her, if she was here, she would just be an extra burden, I am saying that she would be a burden if she cannot put us first in her life. Your right, it's wrong for me to say negatives about Pinays just becuz of my Mahal. Mr Peabody

... in response to Hey Greg, posted by Ray on Nov 20, 2001

As I recall, Greg had said that she was a very good mother. I hope that they are all able to be togther soon. How about an update on little Greg...I miss hearing about him.

Dave H.

... in response to I also wonder..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

I gave Ray an update on little Peabody on Mag. Ummmm he's doing great had his circumcision on Nov 8th, starts his homecare child development next month December. Dave, I'm changed, he really changed me into a kinder, gentler man lol. He brings Joy and Love to my life, we go lots of places together..I'm now 47, but I feel like a ten year old brat lol..I'm glad that I didn't listen to myself and the board to leave him in RP. His Mother and my family wanted him here, but I had no faith in myself to care for him without his Mommie. I'm glad that I accepted the challenged that was forced on me hehehehehe. You know what??? I find it exciting and fun having a child, of course I wish his Mommie was here with us. I just don't trust sending her thousands of dollars at this point to solve her situation, becuz of her Lying. Yeah, she's a good Pinay, assist Pastor of her Church..but it's her family thats putting alot of pressure on her to Lie. I'm afraid that she would use the funds to solve her situation to help her family, becuz they are in serious need of money. When I feel that she's being honest and truthful, thats when I will send the money. What about You??? I hear nothing about your lovely Mahal..How come she doesn't Post??? Mr Peabody

... in response to DaveH, You got your purple G string on??..., posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001

Hi Greg,

I'm happy to hear that little Peabody is doing great! Circumcision...ouch! 8o( I think the doctor trimmed too much off of me. LOL It is amazing how kids can change you. Marife and I just got back from baby sitting our 12 day old niece. I am spoiling her already. I agree that you shouldn't waste sending large sums of money until it goes for the purpose you intended. Good Luck Mr Mom!

Dave H.

... in response to Kids R Great!, posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

... had a sale on circumcisions - half off!
-- Jeff S.

... in response to Your folks probably went to a Rabbi who ..., posted by Jeff S on Nov 21, 2001

Hi Jeff,

I think you're right. I know my parents had my brother's and my tonsils taken out at the same time because it was much cheaper than doing them separately, at a later time. Maybe 2 for 1. The trouble was, I didn't have a problem with my tonsils. That's what happens when your father is Scottish.

A Jewish friend recently told me the difference between Jews and Scots. She said that Jews are always trying to get a better deal or a bargain. Scots are just plain cheap! I think that is probably true...I remember coming home one day and seeing my Jewish neighbor with a new toupee. My brother and I were cracking up because it looked like he was wearing a bird's nest on his head. There was way too much hair on top. However, we both agreed that it looked much better than the old one, which had been bleached orange from the chlorine in the swimming pool and the sun. When we went into our house, we were shocked to see our dad wearing the neighbor's old "orange" toupee. The trouble was that my dad had black hair and not orange like some Scots. Now he was orange on top and black on the sides. We began to tell our dad that it looked like shiite. Then he proudly told us that it had originally cost several hundred dollars and that he had literally stolen it for $10 from our neighbor. Fearing a beating, we told him it looked great and got the heck out of there in a hurry. We were relieved a year later when he finally got his "money's worth" out of the old toupee and shaved his head completely.

Dave H.

... in response to ROFLM"P"O...or what's left of ..., posted by Dave H on Nov 21, 2001

Have mercy.
This post about the Jews vs. the Scots is just TOO funny.

By the way, this board is fantastic ! I just happened by & took a glance. I recently met a Thai girl & have been off & on daydreaming about her ever since. I can tell she's really into money; so I'm sure I couldn't possibly have a serious relationship with her, much less marry her (I've descended from my middle class background to the 'lower class'-Que lastima!). Still, to know her is to love her, ha, ha. She is physically attractive, of course, but so what, y'know? There is just something about her which makes me want to love her. A cuteness, or sweetness, or something. I really barely know her, but one thing which struck me (it's probably just an East/West culture difference) was that she would try to get me to do something I didn't want to do, & when I passionately told her WHY I didn't want to do it, & that I wasn't GOING to do it; instead of getting mad, like I expected her to do, she smiled & laughed in the cutest way imaginable. How can you resist such a gentle girl? Anyway, I know she wouldn't make a good wife; but just knowing her makes me dream of finding an Asian woman for 'true love'.
(Actually, I was also had casual friendships with 2 Chinese women, and had a female Japanese acquaintance, in the past)

... in response to Kids R Great!, posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

How will I know she's going to use the money for her situation?? She's the elder child of her family and they expect the eldest to take care of the family right?? I no longer trust her with large amount of money, very tempting for her to use it on her family, so I don't know what to do..

... in response to Re: Kids R Great!DaveH, posted by greg on Nov 21, 2001

Hi Greg,

I think Ray had a very good idea. You are sending a good amount of money already. Any additional money will be wasted or used for purposes that it was not intended for. I think that she needs to get her priorities straight. Your priority is straight, little Greg. The ball is in her court now. If she really cares about seeing little Greg and you again, she will save the money for the annulment. It's great to see how much you love, cherish, and care for your son. I was one of the ones thinking that the baby belonged with it's mother. There are not too many dedicated fathers in the world. I was wrong in your case. You are a one-in-a- million father. I think that your Mahal is a good mother. After all, she wanted what was best for him and sent him to you to raise, away from the negative family influences and a difficult life. Now she needs to continue to do her part and come back into your lives. It's always great to hear about little Peabody. Good Luck!

Dave H.

... in response to Hey Greg, posted by Ray on Nov 20, 2001

Sheesh!!!!

... in response to Read the above., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

No problem....go ahead.

... in response to Read the above., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

I read everything here. Where have you been reading?

I was asking Greg some questions about his personal predicament. I don't understand what your problem is Mars.

Ray

... in response to Re: Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001

I agree with what you are saying.  I saw how the money was managed there.  The daughter would be the center of attention at first and then she would be annoying when she cried and needed special attention. You sure are lucky to have your son here but I don't understand why the mother would permit this.  Thanks for your advice.

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by Stephen on Nov 19, 2001

SOmeone who finally knows what he is talking about!!!!!!

LISTEN TO THIS GUY PANTHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

....and let her fight you for them. She does not have the resources to fight you for them. Even free aid to her will run out or her appointed attorney will see how nuts she is and withdraw. If you let that kid go...you will be sorry for the rest of your days. I am glad I took the chance and kept mine. Of course, it all depends on how much you want the kid.

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Panther,
I see further down you state you have consulted with a lawyer, I hope it was one specializing in family law. Too many lawyers know little about this area of the law.

Generally child support is based on the income of the parties, not the cost of living unless you're real rich. The courts may have only a limited amount of leeway regarding the amount. Remember, they don't want her (as the "uninformed foreigner") to accept a bad deal. There are things to bargain for: who gets the tax exemption for the child, you may also be able to get a credit for the travel expenses for you or the child to travel between countries each year. Even if an order is entered, she could refuse to enforce it; but watch out if she changes her mind later.

On the other hand a separation w/o divorce at this time might also have some advantages. It would allow her time to come to her senses. It would certainly allow an informal child support arrangement. Either way when you send money, make sure the payment clearly indicates "Child Support" just in case the matter winds in court.

Letting her and the child go, may be the smart thing in this situation for lots of reasons, as painful as it is.

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by NW Jim on Nov 19, 2001

Keep the kid....dump the wench.

... in response to Again....., posted by Mars on Nov 19, 2001


yeah right,
you call the woman wench, the one who had sacrificed herself to give birth for this baby? Is this baby would be here if not for her mother too???
We do NOT know what really the both sides of this story, all we hear is his side.
I feel so sorry for the baby though I hope they will sit and talk to resolve the problems just for the sake of their baby.

I am a mother too and really hate to see the kid to be separated from a mother or a father.

... in response to Re: yeah right wench..., posted by NoNamePinay on Nov 20, 2001

Wench - Girl or Young woman. Buy a dictionary.

... in response to Re: Re: yeah right wench..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001


1. a young woman
2. a female servant

I have three different dictionaries and all in new edition.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: wench is.........., posted by NoNamePinay on Nov 20, 2001

First entry usually applies NoName.

... in response to Choose #1, posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

Mars,

When is the last time you called your daughter a "wench"?

Dave H.

... in response to You're losing it..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

She isn't a young girl anymore. Hey Dude......let it rest. I'm entitled to my opinion and I'm not a bad guy. Ask Howard.

... in response to Hahaha...., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

Mars,

I know you're not a bad guy. We have both been through similar experiences. I was just venting! My ex returned to a normal life, after she got through her problems. Unfortunately, the guilt of several bad years keeps her away from our kids. I have had to deal with their feelings of abandonment and rejection.

Peace,

Dave H.

... in response to Peace..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

Cool Man....Nice to make your acquaintence. No offense meant from here either.

... in response to Peace..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

Are you from MI? I was raised not far from Howard.

Dave H.

... in response to Same here..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

Yes sir! Southeast Michigan.

... in response to Re: Same here..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

Southcentral MI here. I live in South FL now.

... in response to Close..., posted by Dave H on Nov 20, 2001

"I Got a Gaaaal, In Kalamazoo"

... in response to Nobody in the SW?, posted by Jimbo on Nov 21, 2001

that lives on a hill. She won't do me but her sister will..."  8o)ZZZZZ

... in response to Nobody in the SW?, posted by Jimbo on Nov 21, 2001

I will have him check on your gal. LOL I wonder if Howard and Mars drink Vernor's Ginger Ale?

Dave H.

... in response to Choose #1, posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

....on your perspective too. Choose whatever one you wish.

... in response to Re: Re: yeah right wench..., posted by Mars on Nov 20, 2001

Wench:
1 a : a young woman : GIRL b : a female servant
2 : a lewd woman : PROSTITUTE

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by NW Jim on Nov 19, 2001

Thanks for the tips.  I know the child support is that way here but I hope it is not based on that for sending to a 3rd world foreign country. I will be sending a doctor's wages over there and I'm sure the money will go for other than what it was intended.  When the other sister here was suppose to send money over there for her kids, her dad quit working and was going to stay home.  This stopped when the sister wasn't regular on her payments.  With good old reliable me however the whole family will be able to take an early retirement.

... in response to Re: Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Keep the kid. You will empower yourself and your child. Let your child go and you are those nut cases emotional and finacial puppet. Do you really want to live like that in the middle of life?

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

If what you say is true about her saying she would harm the baby and you either has a witness of a tape recordingof that then here's what you should consider.

Call the "Childrens proective service" and let them come in and take custody of the child, then you can deal with her and maybe send her back alone.

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by Bubba on Nov 19, 2001

They will investigate it too. Go to a cop shop and get yourself outfitted with some eavesdropping devices or one of those hidden cams. Yeah man....Better they have the kid than her. You will stand a better chance of custody with that type of evidence.

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

P~

Your lawyer just gave you some good advice!  THINK about what you are talking about doing.  You know what's going on with me,  but let me say one thing for sure... If we had been blessed with a child already, Ayesa would've gone home A-L-O-N-E!

I will plead ignorance, because it suits me lately.  I don't know your situation, but speaking for myself, my wife would have to pry my child out of my cold, dead arms!  If she wants a divorce, fine.  If she wants support, fine as well.  I can even understand where you might think a child might be better off with their mother in a single parent situation, although I don't a agree. (Again, I don't know you personal situation) But to let your wife take you child to be raised in a foreign country? Are you CRAZY?  If you piss her off, you may never, ever see your child again.  EVER!  She could move to one of the millions of nooks or crannies in the Philippines--Mine's lost in MANILA!--and you would never be able to find her.  Don't count on your in-laws for support or honesty, they may be fine people, but that are HER family.  All they might view you as is someone who is trying to take their grandchild away!

IMHO, a child belongs in the best possible enviroment that gives them every possible advantage.  Sure, the Phillippines have charm, but it IS a 3rd world country.

Just think about it dude.  I don't mean to be harsh, but I just have trouble believing you'd give up your kid that easily.

Good luck

H

... in response to Are you crazy?, posted by Howard on Nov 19, 2001

Your the voice of wisdom. I'm now 100% positive for getting my Son out of RP. You know what??? Filipinos in the Philippines would disagree with your Post, they feel that the child should be with the Mommie no matter what. They continue to give my Son's Mother a hard time for letting him come here without her. But people in the States said that we did the right thang.

... in response to Thank You Howard, posted by greg on Nov 20, 2001

n/t

... in response to Are you crazy?, posted by Howard on Nov 19, 2001

Thanks.  I appreciate your frankness.  I have been on an emotional and mental roller coaster the past days (you  probably are familiar with that).  One of the factors I have to deal with is the wife's manipulative nature.  This is what I was offered:  "Let us go to the Philippines or I will give you a costly divorce."  "Let us go to the Philippines or I will make your life miserable" (she called the police).  "If you don't let us go to the Philippines we will go to a shelter."  She has threatened to kill herself and the baby.  She said "If something bad happens to me something bad happens to the baby."  I think of the woman who killed her babies.  If something happened to my baby I don't know if I could ever forgive myself.  This is what is wrong with this marriage: extreme mood changes.  The wife is an excellent, caring and loving mother to the baby.  Better than any mother I have ever seen.  She goes from this to mentioning killing the baby. The wife has walked out on me in the middle of the night.  One time I followed her and she went and layed down in the middle of the street.  I pulled her up and saved her life as a car was coming.  One time she took a knife and tried to stab herself. Everything is good for days and all of a sudden it goes bad. I sit down with her relatives and we discuss this and they say it is a communication problem or focus on what led to these extreme acts:  "You went and ate by yourself and then you went onto the computer"  "She says you didn't attend to the baby in church (not true) and didn't hold the door open for her" they give moral equivalency to my rudeness or selfishness to dangerous and irresponsible actions.  On top of this there is the irresponsible sister who is always around and whom I believe is a bad influence (she was mad the police didn't do anything and said to call them back).  This sister and her ex-husband sent their children, who lived in this country for years, back to the family in the Philippines. The parents both have live-in lovers here. The support money promised to the family in the Philippines is often late or missed. I know if I let the baby go back I may never see her again.  I told the wife originally I would fight to keep the baby here and would lose everything to do so (house and retirement fund).  I just don't know how to resolve this problem. Maybe things will cool off in a few days.

... in response to Re: Are you crazy?, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

n/t

... in response to Re: Are you crazy?, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

I've been there like that Dude....It was hell!!!! Luckily I won full absolute custody and now the ex is nothing but a very bad memory. My daughter and son? Straight A+ students and famous in our community for their musical and artistic ability. My heart goes out to you Man.

... in response to Re: Re: Are you crazy?, posted by Mars on Nov 19, 2001

Get them in your custody by any means possible and let her fight you for them. In the mean time, have your attorney obtain her mental health and hospital records. As nasty as this sounds you must discredit her reputation as a mother. It is either her feelings or your childrens future. Good Luck!

... in response to Re: Are you crazy?, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Panther,

I am no expert, other than I was once married to a woman similar to the description of your wife. Your wife sounds as if she is in desperate need of psychiatric help. I won't try to make a diagnosis, but several conditions come to mind. Post partum depression is quite common after childbirth. Manic depressive illness is characterized by extreme mood swings. I would recommend seeking a psychiatrist. The hard part is finding her in a state where she will accept help. When my ex sought professional help, both her GP and OB/GYN drew blood, found nothing, and told her to rest. I missed my window of opportunity to get her to a psychiatrist and on medication. Fortunately, she realized that the kids were better off with me. Good Luck!

Dave H.

... in response to She needs help!, posted by Dave H on Nov 19, 2001

Thanks for sharing Dave.  I was thinking post partum depression also.  I shared with my ex-wife and she thinks my present wife is bi-polar. My ex's husband thinks my wife is obsessive compulsive (this is frustrating to me) and said mood swings are common in this condition.  My wife told me her sister and mother also take off in the night and the mother did it recently.  I think other than this we would be better off if we were away from the sister here and some of these "friends".  The sister called before this happened and I could sense trouble brewing.  The wife has mentioned wanting to get away from the sister and friends before but then her mood changes and then they are the good ones and I am the enemy.  This happens so fast.  When we talk again I will focus on the daughter and suggest a professional counselor.  It may not work but I think this situation is not impossible to fix. However these "friends" and sister may have my wife so stirred up it may be too late.  I'll just have to see what happens when we communicate next.

... in response to Re: She needs help!, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

"It may not work but I think this situation is not impossible to fix."  It is a real strength that you have this outlook in spite of all the difficulties that you have faced.

As far as the varying diagnosis, you can go look at the DSM IV (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders) at the local Barnes and Noble in the psychology section.  This is the book that is published by the American Psychiatric Association and is used as a reference for classification of mental illness.  If you have insurance, but your wife's condition is not specific, she may fall under a variety of different diagnosis for billing purposes.  Although it might be important for treatment, or legal action, I would encourage you to focus more on your wife's need for help, rather than determining her condition.  Find a professional that will do that as part of her treatment.

This is a difficult situation, and I hope for a good outcome for you and your family.  If that is not possible, I hope you will have the wisdom to choose the least damaging (long term) of your bad options.

... in response to You seem to have a good attitude., posted by HappyIdiot on Nov 20, 2001

Thanks for sharing. This has been an emotional and mental roller coaster.  I orginally planned to never let the baby live in the Philippines but later I came close to giving up and almost decided to let her go. Thanks to the input from the many posters here and on MA, the baby going to live in the Philippines is no longer an option.  This difficult situation will have to be resolved in the USA, the baby's home. I agree about focusing on the wife's need for help and if we get past that stage we should have counseling so I can correct the behaviors which annoy her.  Whatever happens the baby should remain in this country.

... in response to Re: She needs help!, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Dude...

I had no idea!  As long as you haven't done anything that your wife can hold against you, you will be alright in the end.  You have got to get you daughter away from your wife.

Post Partum this... Manic that...  Dude, no offense... your wife is a loon and she is dangerous to your daughter.  Do you want you daughter to grow up and do to a man what your wife is doing to you?

Dude... Call Social Services.  Get Restraining Order.  Do what you have to do, but tell an authority who has the power to help you.  Oh... and the next time your wife wants to nap in traffic?  As long as you're holding the baby... LET HER!

What IS it with women lately!!! Grrrrrrrr...

H

... in response to I'm with Bubba and Mars!, posted by Howard on Nov 19, 2001

You are the authority and the only one that can save your helpless child. No one will care more than you. You are the only one that can stand betwen your child and a thrown away life. Stand up and fight for your childs future. Take your child and save a life and "D*MN THE TORPEDOES"! MAn...I wish I could be in your shoes for five minutes....I 'd have that kid in my possession in a flash!!

... in response to Re: She needs help!, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Hi Panther,

Many times there is more than one condition present...bi-polar, OCD, SAD, ADHD/ADD, etc. It takes a professional to diagnose. Some medications help a variety of conditions.

My ex was much worse when she hung around her cousin, who I suspect has the same condition. The cousin drove her crazy, but somehow they couldn't stay apart. Fortunately for my ex, they spend little time together now.

I know several other bi-polar (manic-depressive) people. Three are doing very well on medication, after living very troubled lives for years. It is very frustrating. Sometimes they appear so rational (especially with doctors) and try to convince you that the problem is with you.

Dave H.

... in response to Re: She needs help!, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

I feel like a broken record....For Gods sake Man.....get out of the siituation....and take your kids with you!!!! You don't stand a chance with a bunch of tiger sharks like that. Do you want your kids to be goofy like that? For Gods sake ..escape while you can. Sheesh!

Peace

... in response to The whole lot of them are nuts!, posted by Mars on Nov 19, 2001

"Do you want your kids to be goofy like that?"

She may already be.  It sounds like an inherited condition (passed down to the females in the family).  What do you want to bet symptoms will start showing up in his daughter in a few years?  Fortunately there are a wide variety of meds today that can keep a bi-polar person in a mostly even keel.

... in response to Too late..., posted by Bob S. on Nov 20, 2001

and serves no purpose.  The daughters grew up observing the mother's behavior and when they experienced mood changes they emaulated the mother's examples.  I think it's more nuture than nature and if my daughter is not exposed to these behaviors she will not react that way if she has a mood swing.  It may be a cultural phenomomen (like tampo) as one of the posters on another sight said his filipina wife used to walk out on him in the middle of the night when they were first married.

... in response to Too late..., posted by Bob S. on Nov 20, 2001

More than likely, you are correct. I hope not though, for the kids sake.

... in response to Re: Are you crazy?, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Wow, panther. Sounds like she needs serious psychiatric help. My sister-in-law used to have horrible mood swings, planted plenty of seeds of discontent (jealosy, I think) and when my wife was friendly with her, we ended up in some pretty bad fights, but never physical and never to the extreme of anyone mentioning killing themselves or anyone else. Finally my wife realized what was happening, realized she didn't want to jeopardize our marriage, so quit paying attention to her sister. Life has been wonderful since. Best of luck to you in what sounds like a nearly impossible situation. By all means CYA as best you can.
-- Jeff S.

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Panther, May I ask the age of your wife?
Also have you considered marriage counselling? How old is the child?
Would be sad to see you separated from your child by such a far distance.
Good Luck to you!
Taliman

... in response to Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by Taliman on Nov 19, 2001

Thanks Taliman.  My wife is in her mid 20s and I am in my early 50s.  The baby is less than 6 months old. We have been counselled by a priest twice and both her families talked to both of us.  She is being influenced now by an unstable irresponsible relative who dumped her own kids, who lived here for years, on her family in the Philippines while she stays here and parties. It is very sad to have my marriage end and to have the child so far away. I think the best thing to do in this no win situation is to let my unhappy wife return to the Philippines to be with her family (although I question how that is going to work out) rather than have her do something stupid over here and harm herself and the baby.

... in response to Re: Re: Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Well if that is the case and U decide to let them BOTH go hope you can find a way
to insure that any support U send would be used for the Baby and not for other things.
Sorry to hear about this.  Hope things work out for U and the baby.
Regards
Taliman

... in response to Child support to the Philippines, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

You really need to sit down and talk to a family law attorney. What you need is solid legal advice.

Ray

... in response to Re: Child support, posted by Ray on Nov 19, 2001

......Had I listened to my attorney 100% back during the "war", I wouldn't have my kids with me today. Just take your kid....the cops aren't going to come and take him away from you....you are the kids Dad. If she did call the cops, just provoke her subtly in front of them so she wigs out. They will haul her away for you. Child custody is a dirty biz but some Dad's take massive action.

... in response to Re: Child support, posted by Ray on Nov 19, 2001

but I forgot to ask this question.  I was more concerned about wife calling police on me, going to a shelter, taking the baby out of the country.  I called the INS also. The INS said the airlines won't let the baby leave without my permission. The only way I can keep the baby here according to the lawyer is to file in court for custody of the baby and he said this will be messy. I think if the baby has to be with one parent only it should be with the mother so I will let them return to the Philippines after we have a divorce agreement worked out.  The lawyer said I need to think this over for a couple of weeks.  I was just wondering if anyone else is in this situation or knows of someone who is and how it is working out.

... in response to Talked to attorney, posted by panther on Nov 19, 2001

Panther......I say this with utmost respect for you so please do not think what I say is insultive. You need to get rid of that notion that the kid is better off with their mother. My ex (American Indian) and her family were exactly like your wife and her family in behavior. I wouldn't and didn't trust her with an inch of my life regarding any type of divorce agreement and you shouldn't trust your soon to be ex either. You cannot negotiate with individuals or people who do not share your value system. They understand your values all too well and will use your honorable values and to their utmost advantage. They play by a different set of rules than you and the rules they use change frequently. They know the rules you play by and values you hold dear.... and theirs are incomprehensible to you and/or you are repulsed by the ones you do understand. Keep your kid in America Man.....He/She will thank you in the years to come. Did you ever stop to think what could happen if your ex re-marries and all of a sudden, your  child has an abusive step father who likes to whoop on the proverbial red headed step child? Or the guy could be, God forbid, a pedophile. Could you live with yourself if that happened to your helpless child? Think it over before you let that kid go.....

... in response to Re: Talked to attorney, posted by Mars on Nov 19, 2001

Thanks Mars for all your input. Your mentioning of the abusive step father puts a new slant on this I didn't consider.  If my daugher was in the Philippines and this happened I would not be there to protect her.  Plus I don't like the sister's children that were dumped on the family over there and my daughter would be infuenced by them.  I have to fight this.  The divorce agreement can be enforced here in California but if I let my daughter go to the Philippines it won't be worth the paper it is written on.  My daughter must stay here.  My wife and her family there will have to accept that. I still hold hope for what others are saying about medications and counseling. My wife is an excellent mother and if her mood swings can be controlled and she can get away from her sister here things can be OK.  She is really bonded to this baby and I think it would destroy her and hurt the baby to have them separated.  I don't like that advice today that I got from the lawyer pertaining to the only way to stop the baby from leaving the country is to gain custody.  I think I can get restraining orders or have this as part of the settlement. I agree: the baby must stay in California.

... in response to I agree: she must stay in USA, posted by panther on Nov 20, 2001

Cool Panther but that attorney is absolutley correct. I would heed his advice. I wish you the best and I hope everything turns out well for your baby girl.