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Ok.  Now everyone please don't all get mad at me at once, all right?  I have been dating a filipina woman for 1 1/2 years now and I haven't actually met her in person yet.  We talk weekly and write regularly.  I have fallen in love with this woman and she claims she loves me too.  I plan on going over to the Phils to see her this summer.  She has been hinting that perhaps we should marry then.  My question is this:  How true is the rumor that women from the Philippines only want to marry men in the U.S. to get nationalized, then leave them high and dry?  How do you tell if this is the case?

To listen to my co-workers, it is a VERY commonplace thing, and they warn me not to fall for it.  My argument is that if she wanted to marry her way to the states, she sure is a patient con-artist, it'll be more than two years when and IF I marry her in July.  Anybody out there got any helpful suggestions?  BTW, she never asks me for money, so that's not a motivation, either.

Please help,
The Sunwolf.

... in response to Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

Sorry Sunwolf,

Just my opinion, but I feel that too many of these women use men like yourself for that passport to freedom.  Even though your girl doesn't ask for money now doesn't mean she won't be too shy to spend it when you put that ring on her hand.  

Your question also gives me the impression that you think she is only been in corespondence with you alone.  Your probably wrong, she's doing as much "shopping around" as you if not more than you.  Basically it'll come down to a first come first serve basis. If your the first to come to the Philippines and put a ring on her finger, you'll be the first to get her, but if another guy gets there first, than he'll be the winner.

The following is a website address I think you should check out and carefully read...

http://www.snookys-video.com/Cortland-Sharon.htm

The first point I have to make if you read the site is that this filipina woman who meets her american "pen-pal" for the first time immediately wants to go off with him to a hotel/resort he had reservations to.  If you know the Filipino culture at all, it would be of poor taste for any woman to willingly go off with any man (as an unmarried couple).  That to me signals she is eager to have her pen-pal like her.

Secondly,  the story of this couple describes their get away and states that this girl didn't want to go out to the clubs or bars.  She tells him that she's a homebody.  I feel that she didn't want to go out so she wouldn't look like a whore.  If she really like this man, going out wouldn't be such a problem.

Please understand, not all Filipina women that are doing correspondence are looking for that free ticket to America, but too many of them have a misconception that once they get to America, all of their economic problems are over. The last time I was in the Philippines, I had so many people asking me to find them a pen-pal in hopes of finding a friend and maybe a husband, then they always proceed to tell me how great America is since it's so "easy" to get a hi-paying job and how every American has a car and a nice house. It's all very fustrating and no matter what you tell them, they will still believe you are rich and so are all your friends.

The easiest way to test if she's really interested would be: go visit her, hang out and enjoy the Philippines for a couple of weeks, then tell her how much you really love her and the Philippines and how much you want you would like to spend the rest of your life married to her living in the Philippines. Yes this sounds dumb, maybe even time consuming and somewhat expensive, but I've known someone who actually did this in Bohol and once he told his "MOB" this, she went thru the roof, yelling and screaming about how he was supposed to bring her to American. Needless to say they where shortly divorced.

... in response to Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

It is an all too common practice, or at least, idea, in the illogic of an impoverished Filipina desperate to help herself and her family escape the bottemless pit of Philippine poverty.

Most don't know this has almost no chance of success.  An INS acquaintence has told me that more than 90% of foreign wives trying to claim a green card after ditching their unwanted husband will be rejected and sent back to the home country.  But she may have already taken hubby for a lot of bucks.  So it's still a successful venture.

The Philippines are full of wonderful and honest young women who want to marry for the right reasons and you can find and marry one of them --- IF YOU DO YOUR HOMEWORK WELL AND NEVER, NEVER, LET YOUR HEART AND "LITTLE HEAD" DO YOUR THNKING FOR YOU.  There are no guarentees, but success can be had, as it has for many thousands already.

First thing, it's not a good practice to fall in love before meeting her, and knowing a lot about her.

Look at her family.  Is a conservative, close knit, caring family.  If yes, then the daughter will probably have the right frame of mind and values.  Do they keep their daughter near at hand, watch her, chaperone her, forbid her to go around by herself or go to other cities or abroud without proper chaperones?  Do they forbid boyfriends and demand that suitors meet with the parents and always go around with chaperones?  If yes, then you are probably looking at the very traditional kind of girl that you want and can trust.  Gee, that's kind of what I'd look at in an American girl too .... hmmmm....

Most Filipinas will be married in their twenties and good ones will not have had many "boyfriends" or suitors and will have kept their virginity for their husbands.  Do I live in the Victorina past -- No!  I, and YOU, must Judge your prospective Filipina wife by HER FILIPINO Standards!  Filipinas who go bad, and therefore, will be bad to you, have violated and abandoned their OWN CULTURAL STANDARDS.  You have to judge them that way, not by American standards.

So, while I could feel trust for an AW who has had many boyfriends and whose virginity was a distant memory, BECAUSE American cultural standards are very different, I would NEVER feel trust in a Filipina who had done the same.

They know, and feel, that they have cast their lot with the devil, and once that is done, can she, she feels inside, ever really do any worse?  

The best thing for you, to be perfectly blunt and honest, is to be her FIRST of everything with a girl from a solid and conservative family.  If you are her first flowers, box of candy, birthday present, kiss, boyfriend, lover, husband, EVERYTHING, you stand a very, very good chance that she will LOVE, ADORE, BE DEVOTED and RESPECTUL of you FOREVER and Ever .... And NEVER, EVER, EVER leave you so long as you are faithful and decent to her.  And, again, to be honest, she might even stay with you if you aren't faithful and wonderful always.  That's how most Filipinas are.  

You job is to find her,,,, and avoid the bad ones.

Basically, be honest with yourself about what you are looking for and be very diligent in getting to know EVERYTHING about her.  

There's a billion shades of grey and I have'nt the time just now to say all I could on this subject.  

Paulv

... in response to Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

There are many there with ulterior motives, but there are also many that are very sincere. Due to recent traumatic events in my life, I no longer believe you can REALLY get to know someone in a long distance relationship. 6 months ago I did. If both parties are sincere and honest, it can and does work. But if one has ulterior motives, you probably won't be able to tell until it is too late. It is just too easy to hide the truth when you only spend a week or two together and then communicate only in emails and phone conversations. I'd recommend you take your trip, but make no marriage plans. Get to know her as well as your vacation will permit. If afterword you both still feel the same way, then consider marriage, at a later date. If it is really destined to work, it will be stronger for the wait. Good luck, whatever you do. Larry.

... in response to Re: Filapina rumors, posted by shadow on Jan 9, 2002

I'm saddened to hear that you no longer believe in 'love at first write'(as it were), Shadow.  I too, am disillusioned, disenfranchised, bitter and cynical from my previous encounters with the opposite sex.  That was why I decided to try the Philippines.  The thing that appealed to me about the filapinas was that the fact that here in the US it is VERY (I mean V - E - R - Y) hard to find a woman who wants to commit to ANY kind of real relationship.  Unless of course, you look like Leonardo De Crappio and/or are rich like him, yet there seem to be many lonely women in the Phils that want nothing more than a loving husband who cares for their family and will take care of them.  So I figured "sign me up on the dotted line!".  Rather unfortunately there seems to be a great deal of chicanery involved in many of these relationships.  As you say, 'ulterior motives'.

I have saved my pennies for nearly two years (by the time I go) for this one chance at getting it right, and I may not make it over there again for another 2, so I have to settle this in the week I have with her.  I figure that once she finds out that I am not intending to marry her right there and then, she'll do one of two things.  She'll either be patient and just go with it, or she'll try to get me to father a child while I am down there thereby trapping me in the old, time-honored tradition of forcing the marriage.  Then I will know.  A bad trick to play on my love, I know, but I really need to know if she is as good a girl as she claims to be.  She is supposedly a devout catholic, so we'll see.

I thank you for the concern and advice, know that I have taken it to heart.  I hope that things work out better for you in the future, and I wish you only the best of luck.  please take care.

President of Sergeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band,
The Sunwolf

... in response to Re: Re: Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

If it takes you two years to save for a trip to the PI, perhaps you should take a closer look at your budget for supporting a wife and two children.  Also, I have seen and heard of many (Asian and AW) that once used to the "exciting life" have a hard time with a domestic life.  If you didn't allow her the "fun times" she may become very bored or antagonistic about the situation.

... in response to Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

They're all looking for a submissive little sex/housework slave.  That's the other end of the stereotype.  I think the truth is that you can find both the bad American and the bad Filipina, but I think the majority on both sides are good people.

One other poster made a comment about expessing desire to marry before meeting.  I would agree that that's not a good thing to do.  Both my wife (Latin) and I were hesitant to commit and took our time, even after meeting.  Go slow, be as sure as you can be, and go visit!  Corresponding for over a year is too long.  I think you've got to meet within a few months of starting things or both of you could be wasting time.  Until you've spent time together in person, you never know if there's any chemisty.  You can also learn much more about her when you see her with family and friends.

... in response to American rumors, posted by Patrick on Jan 9, 2002

Okay.  Here's the thing; I am an everyday common garden-variety working man and I really can't afford to just jump a plane to the Phils anytime.  It's taken 2 years to save up enough to go see her this one time, so the financial aspect is a BIG factor.  It might take me another year or two to go back again.  So a lot is hinging on this one meeting.  I'm sorry I didn't explain it before, but I was so busy asking the question that I forgot to include my own situation.  Again I apologize.  I know that lack of money to get back to the Phils is NOT a good reason to rush into anything and trust me, I am not planning to.  But I really need to get a read on her before I leave the country (Phillipines) or I'll probably have to just say goodbye permanently.  I am afraid I do not have the luxury of time.

Please don't take this the wrong way (I'm a NICE wolf, honest), but who exactly do you mean by "they"?  I don't need a slave, Patrick, I need a partner.  My last g/f was a puerto-rican woman, but she was right here in the states so I know what it is like to have a latin partner.  You are a lucky man.  My true love is a filapina, though, I just know it.  I just don't know if I have met her yet or not.  Thank you for your kind help.  Best of wishes to you both.  :-)

Howling at the moon,
The Sunwolf

... in response to Clarification (everyone read, I omitted ..., posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

Try explaining to her your situation of Penny pitching to save for your trip, what more tell her exactly what you're tell us about your $$$$$$ problem. The best thing is to be Open and Honest about everything, keep in mind that Pinays think that all Americans are Wealthy. Take your time, don't rush into any Marriage, like they say meet her Family, Friends and see how she act around them. Don't pick just anyone, be sure to pick the right one. Mostly do your homework of learning as much as possible about the Filipino culture, Philippines, Family, etc...Continue to post with your questions and concerns. Welcome to Planet-Love.. BTW, I was a Green Horn, and gave the first Pen Pal I met in the Philippines a Baby, so now I'm stuck paying child support averaging  $300 bucks a month(no amount of $$$'s is too much for my Son), so be Careful and Wise. Ask Ask and Ask her all kind questions, no matter how upsetting the questions may be. It's better Safe than Sorry. BTW, I wish Planet-Love was available to Me before I took that trip to the Philippines. Oh, just becuz she's speaking well of herself doesn't mean it's true, of course she's not going tell you anything bad about herself. Have you heard anything bad? Only good things??? As I said, ASk Ask and Ask her questions, no matter how upset she gets, if she really love you it doesn't bother her, but make it clear that she can also ask you anything.  greg

... in response to Re: Clarification (everyone read, I omit..., posted by greg on Jan 9, 2002

Sorry to detract from the whole topic of this thing, but are you paying child support to a child being raised in the Philippines? If you are, do you realize that you are probably supporting her whole extended family and probably her current boyfriend? $300 currently comes to 15,000P, that is more than alot of Filipino's make in a year.

... in response to Clarification (everyone read, I omitted ..., posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

have a good time and plan your escape route before you go.  A good relationship is worth the wait.  Don't lock yourself into anything unless YOU feel really good about it.

... in response to Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

I would never marry anyone that would want to marry me without meeting and getting to know me.  To do otherwise indicates that they have another motive.

... in response to Re: Filapina rumors, posted by curt on Jan 9, 2002

Neither would I, Curt.  The main reason for my going over there is to see if we are compatible, regardless of what SHE thinks I am going over there for.  It just seems more and more like this is going to be a wasted trip.  Well, maybe I can locate an honest girl while I am there if things don't work out between my baby and me.  Read my reply to Kevin and Bear for more info about my suspicions.  Thanks for the opinion, you're cool like that.  :-)

The ever vigilant,
Sunwolf

... in response to Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

I can feel your anxiety.  I hate to say it, but if a scam going to take place, it is strategically employed.  Such a strategy can be protracted in terms of 5+ years from the first letter to the devastating divorce.  It's sad to say that this has happened so often, the credibility of the MOB process as a dating vehicle has been all but ruined.

I've just started a long-distance relationship with someone whom I'd like to beleive is truly sincere.  Ample time will help reveal the truth. Yes, I'm divorced to a Filipina MOB.  Yes, it nearly ruined/impaired me emotionally and financially, and even health-wise.  I look back now, and say to myself that my ex deserves to eat crow for the rest of her life.  I hear that she's not so happy anyway.  Why should she be?  I haven't given up in my persuit of happiness.  Hopefully, I know too much about this sort of stuff now.  If anybody is going to try to f*** with me, I hope I can scare them off long before anybody can gain an edge against me.

We face two things.  1) The risk of being mercilessly swindled, and 2) Ridicule on the home front for persuing fulfillment of our desires.  I'm very careful with whom I talk about my newfound courtship with.  I've lost respect from family members and some friends because of my persuits.  Well, I'd prefer to be single the rest of my life than force myself on somebody that such folks deemed acceptable but I couldn't feel in love with.  But I think there is something better out there than to live the rest of my life alone, or settle for a woman that I wasn't capable of loving.  Everybody has their preferences.

I've endured harsh criticism at work because of my preferences for Filipina women.  Well, that's what I'm attracted to and it's really nobody else's business what my preferences are.  I've been called a fool.  When my last relationship didn't work out, my friend's wife told me that I got what I deserved (especially years ago she arranged American blind dates, but there was no attraction on my part).  I seldom speak to her now.

One of my brothers once told me that if I ever married another Filipina, he'd lose all respect for me.  That stabbed me on the inside.  When I reflect on such a statement, I realize that I'm happier single with no kids, than being him, married with kids, and having a pushy, bossy and demanding wife.  When I think of that, it's got to be very hard to be in my brother's shoes regardless about what he thinks of my persuit of Filipina women.

At work there is a Filipina lady, I'm friends with.  She told me to be careful about golddiggers, etc., but there are some good women to be found in the Philippines too.  She also told me not to listen to people that vehemently discourage me.

Well, I wish you the best of luck.  If something seriously becomes questionable, don't dismiss it before it's too late.  This ugly proposition happened in my last relationship.  It wasn't easy, but it sure was better that it happened before we were married and not after.

God bless you in your persuit of happiness.

- Kevin

... in response to Filapina rumors, posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

The only way you will every truely know is to marry her and find out.  Honestly you stand a better chance of divorcing an AW that the Filipina but it still happens.  Sounds you that believe that she is sencere and I believe you know your own heart so go for it.

I just married 9 days ago and I am sure it will all work out fine.

Bear

... in response to Re: Filapina rumors, posted by Bear on Jan 9, 2002

Thank you both for your unique views of what's going on.  Obviously the details I gave weren't very detailed at all and there are many other factors that I did not mention.  One of these is that she already has 2 kids (3 and 5) which I think might make her think twice about finding another man to accept them into his home after her leaving me.  That's one point for her.  On the other hand, she has gone to Japan and back twice in the time I have known her.  She has changed address 7 or 8 times, also.  This bodes ill.  I am, at the moment, waiting on a letter from her explaining how she can claim to be so poor, and yet fly back and forth to Japan AND afford a cell phone!  The reason she goes to Japan for 6 months at a time is because she can make more money working there than she'll ever make in the Philippines.  Or so she says.  Have either of you two ever heard of such a thing?

My dilemma lies in the fact that she seems so dam(n)ably sincere.  She has a very soft voice, never gets mad at me no matter what I ask her, and she even makes a point of asking about how my cat is.  She has asked me if I am ready to take care of her for the rest of our lives.  She seems very serious about this whole thing.  However, I have one problem - I never asked her to marry me and she's already assuming it is going to happen.  People who rush into things worry me.  Especially when it's someone who said she wanted to take it slow when I first wrote to her.  Still, I am entranced.

The primary reason for me taking the trip to the Phils is to meet her in person and spend some quality time with her to see if we truly are compatible.  I am not going there to get married.  This is going to sound odd, but I want to see if she tries to get me to father a kid while I'm there.  I hope not, but when she finds out that we're not getting married there and then, who knows?

I truly hope that she's the person I have grown to love - a gentle, loving filapina who has had a hard hand of cards dealt her, not a scheming, devious vixen just looking for a ticket to the home of the free.  I hope to ferret out the truth even if it breaks my heart.

I was curious as to whether or not there really were people out there who had been used in the way I have been warned about, because I didn't know of anyone.  Thanks Kevin for the heads-up, I promise I will be VERY careful from now on.  Bless you, too.

I'd like to thank the Bear, too.  Your insights have led me to have a little more faith that there really ARE some good women out there.  I wish you and your new bride the best.  Feel free to make more comments in light of the new facts I have given you, I'll be checking back on this message for a couple of days.  I'm going to post the question about filapinas working in Japan on the main message board so everyone can get a look at it.  Please take care, gentlemen and thanks from the bottom of my heart.

The Sunwolf.

... in response to Thanks Kevin and Bear/ More info about i..., posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

I have some friends in a burb just outside of Davao.  Paul and Emm.  Emm was being trained to be a Japanesse "entertainer" when she became sick and missed her trip to Japan.  It was shortly after that that she married Paul and admits if she hadn't she might have met and married a Japanesse man.  While I was in davao at City Hall I asked a lot of questions.  One was "I bet a lot of Americans come in here to get marriage liscense?".  The response was, "2-3/Wk but more than 50% of the liscenses go to Japanesse men".

I know numerous Filipinas there now and some Filipinos that work in Korea, Japan and Suadi Arabia countries.  Filipinos are one of the most "farmed" out laborers in the world and their government taxes them for it too.  I hear more than 5 million workers work out of the country.

As for whether or not the Filipina wil be a good wife or honorable in her intent again I say listen to your heart.  There is a very good chance that she doesn't love you yet but might be the best thing that could ever happen to you and would easily fall in love with you after meeting and/or marrying.  I think too many people expect to be madly in love when they meet the right girl but I have yet to meet too many people that understand what that is.  I know I love Marissa and I know beyond a shadow of doubt that she loves me but I know it because I prayed about it.  It was confirmed over and over to both me and her.

As for cost - I think that too is way over concerened by many.  I have about $7.5K in my whole relationship and that includes 1st class airfare and a free spending wedding/honeymoon.  You can fly to the Phils for $650 roundtrip.  Now it is possible she thinks that you will provide her with security but just make it clear to her that you have meager means.  If she really loves you she'll do the same as Marissa did - say she will work also.

One last note that I intend to bring up in a future trip report.  In the city of Davao the women out number the men easily 5 to 1.  The men who do not have careers by 35 y.o. are worthless to the women as providers and at best can only babysit, drink and whore around.  Bringing a women to the US with children will be extremely difficult if not impossible - make sure you check that out.  There are virgins over there that would treat you like "gold pressed latinum" to quote the Feringi of Start Trek fame.  I bet every guy on this board can give you at least 5 names and addresses of Filipinas looking for husbands and confirm that "introductions from another Fil-Am couple" are the best and most dependable of meetings.

I think it important to note that in my 3 weeks in P.I.s I did not meet a single divorced woman.  And anytime some problem camme up between a man and a woman everyone including the women blame the woman.  These women want a man and a family and will do anything they can to make it work - I think a lot more than most of us would.  I experienced this personaly when i made a stupid PDA that I saw as harmless here in the states.  Everyone there blamed Marissa instead of me and I had to spend days traveling around assuming the blame as I should have.  Don't automatically asume that they are not sincere because in most cases I would say you are completely wrong.

Lastly ask hard questions.  Try to trip them up.  Ask them to do it to you.  Then answer your own questions for them.  And pray.  Marissa and I prayed every chance we got and fasted several times when there were serious problems.  To quote the song, "We are the champions" because we won.

Bear

... in response to OCW's, posted by Bear on Jan 9, 2002

:)

... in response to Thanks Kevin and Bear/ More info about i..., posted by Sunwolf on Jan 9, 2002

If her working outside Phils. is a fact, than that can also explain how she has money. My fiance works in Cebu for about $100 a month 40hrs a week. She could do contract work, like her Aunt in Taiwan and make $1000 a month doing the same thing. Contract work in other countries is common.