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Howdy y'all.

I was just wondering exactly how and when y'all discuss money and finacial support of your Filipina wife's (or girlfriend's or asawa's) family in the Philippines. (Of course, now it is your family as well) How does one bring up the topic of money?

Certainly, someone has to live in the real world. In my opinion, of which I'm entitled, it's just not realistic to expect someone to take care of me and pay all of my bills and buy what I want and for me never to work again. (It's kind of like my viewpoint of Tampo-to me, tampo is removing oneself from the family, but that's my opinion, and opinion's are like elbows, everyone has two-and I'm not married to a Filipina, so I ain't experienced tampo-lol.)

And since the subject has come up again in regard to Peter's wife, I thought that I would ask the folks here what y'all think, and when y'all discuss money, and what kind of guidelines.

I remember reading Bear's advice of "tell her a few of the stories of how friends and family members tried to get women to cheat their husbands/bf's and how they were good, honourable women by refusing. If you are not strong, she might give in to her loving family's 'pity me' requests. I promise you she will respect you for being strong and giving her guidelines so that she can honestly tell everyone her husband has given her strict instructions."

I also remember, (I think it was Bear too-yes, I've searched the archives, I just don't have it handy at present), talking about setting up 4-5 simple rules for providing college support for relatives, such as making above average grades and no illegal activities.

According to Bob Lingerfelt, in his "ASAWA Guide to Fil-West Relationships", page 161, the number 1 source of problems for Fil-West marriages involves sending money to the Philippines.  So, I hope that y'all don't mind me bringing up this issue again.

Here's a question Bob asks his readers, "Also, her family may or may not request funds in addition to what you would normally send. If so, do you send it always, never, or upon condition?"

On page 165 of Bob's ASAWA guide, he stresses that "Family is everything to Filipinas". According to Bob, most husbands supply a "regular, monthly allowance sent via wire or bank transfer. You may also be expected to pay for medical bills, school tuition, uniforms, food, transportation, and even housing."

So, honestly, what do y'all think? I read here about someone who explained to his new family how much things cost here in the US. He converted it to pesos for his new family in the Philippines. Sounds like a good idea to me.

I'm just wondering, since this appears to cause conflict in Fil-West marriages, do y'all discuss money before marriage?

In my opinion, if a wife works, the money is not hers. Just like the money a husband earns is not his. To me, it's family money. And the family is the husband and wife.

I also read in the archives about someone who determined what his wife would have made working in Manila, and what amount she could have sent back to the province, and that was the amount that they sent loved ones back in the Philippines.

I apologize for rambling to y'all. I guess I mainly want to know how and when to politely discuss the issue of money and financial support of relatives in the Philippines.

If I'm ever to be married to a Filipina lady, I'm not too sure how I would handle the idea of her suddenly being "Ate" to everyone, even family she didn't know she had.

Thank y'all for taking the time to read my post. Good day!

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

Thanks y'all!

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

I have given my thought on how I would handle the money affairs in another thread.  I pay all my bills business and personal with my business checking account using internet banking.  It takes me 15 min a week and I see no reason to give that responsibility to my wife.  She will have an ATM as a debit card.  I will see what budget is reasonable for the month and transfer it over.  It will be a training tool for more future responsibility.  Trust but verifies is always the prudent thing to do.  If my wife goes over the budget we agreed on all she has to do is ask me for more if the situation arises.  Most of the time I would think that she would be budget minded and have money left over.  She has indicated that she would like to work, if she does it could go into that account and used for helping her parents or visiting the PI.  
This is all theory and speculation on my part.  None of this has been tested by me yet.  I am sure I will adjust to the situations as they arise.  I want a simple system using ATM cards; she can't bounce a check or write the wrong name on a check.  I have trouble balancing the checkbook myself and the ATM is just like a savings account again a good training aid.  ATM card never needs to be balanced, what you got is what you got.  
Setting rules without her understanding why can also be a problem.  Eventually any wife would understand what's going on.  It is how to handle her in the meantime that I am concerned about.  

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

Beat them to the punch and ask THEM for money. Tell them that after all, you're taking their daughter off their hands and whine a little about how expensive their daughter is to feed and clothe. That should end the money debate quickly.

- Jeff

... in response to You guys have it all wrong..., posted by Jeff S on Oct 9, 2003

Jeff,

I'll have to remember THAT one :P  You know someone here will be able to use that eventually. What I wouldn't give to be a fly on that day!  LOL

Too Funny

Keep the Faith

H

... in response to You guys have it all wrong..., posted by Jeff S on Oct 9, 2003

Sounds like the start of a debate LOL

Good thing your not serious

How expensive to feed and clothe the daughter?

Oh please!!!

Some of us had to go 7000 miles to find someone to put up with us Hehhehehehe.

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

Before I came here I talk to my sisters and brothers not to make me a milking cow.I even say this to my mom.I tell them that theres no way I work here for them.They all understand me.My family wants me to be all happy here and not worry about them.My family is very much supportive on me.Raquel

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Febtember on Oct 8, 2003

Sounds good Raquel,
My question is what would you advise when a serious problem comes up back in the PI?   About the house thing and widening of the highway.  I have decided to wait till I visit and then if I see an unreasonable hardship I can help at that time.

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

[This message has been edited by Ray]

Hi Matt,

It isn’t that important exactly how and when you discuss money matters with your future mate, but you should definitely have some in-depth discussions BEFORE you marry her. It is extremely important that both of you come to a mutual agreement on how you will handle money in the family and how you will help (or not help) her family back home. The exact details aren’t so important early in a relationship, but there should be a consensus on the major points. While you are corresponding with a prospective mate, try to feel out her ideas on money in the family and make sure that she understands your views on the topic as well. DO NOT ever accept the standard non-confrontational response “it’s up to you”! Make her tell you what she thinks and if she won’t discuss money, sex, children, work, and other important topics, then dump her early because you’ll probably never reach a decent level of communication in your relationship.

On the issue of “family money”, I fully agree with you, Stephen, and Dr. Laura. Once you start down that “yours and mine are separate” road, there is no going back without a big fight. Having a job and keeping your pay separate to do with as you darn well please seems to be a popular belief in the Philippines. Some guys are comfortable with that arrangement, but I have seen more Fil-Am marriages in serious trouble over that single issue! In my case, I put my wife on all of my bank accounts the first week she arrived and reminded her periodically that ALL income is family money and major expenditures should be mutually agreed upon. She has no problems at all depositing her paychecks into our joint account. Set a limit that determines at what dollar level a purchase will require mutual consent. If either one disagrees after talking it out, then DON’T buy it.

The subject of sending money home to her family is probably the next most common cause of marital problems in these relationships. Yes, most ladies will want to send money home, so work out an agreement early BEFORE you officially tie the knot. I agree with Nathan that you should do what YOU are comfortable with and don’t be concerned about the other guys who tell you that if you send too much, you will only screw thing up for the next guy. It’s YOUR money and you can do whatever you want with it if it’s legal! However, I would try to keep it within reason.

Whatever you do, DO NOT make any promises on sending a pre-determined amount. Also, I recommend against sending a monthly remittance. Why? Because once they come to expect that monthly remittance, they become your dependent for life. Like in Bear’s case, they are more likely to kick back and quit trying. They will be looking forward to that deposit every month just like a government pension check and their lives will be disrupted if they check isn’t there. If you ever get laid off or money gets tight and you can’t send anything for a while, they may not be prepared to deal with that. It is common over there to borrow against those future checks and they can really get in over their heads if not careful.

What worked for us was to set up a separate savings account, or PI fund. If someone back home needs medical treatment, gets wiped out in a typhoon or flood, or needs help with any problems, we have a separate fund to deal with those emergencies when they arise. If the fund gets to a point where we can afford it, then it’s used for vacation trips back to the Phils. If your financial situation is firm, you may want to just send a little now and then unexpectedly to surprise them, but be VERY careful that you don’t get into a situation where come to rely on that monthly check.

If you do end up with a pesky relative who is always calling with a sob story and asking for help, I found the best ways to deal with it without causing a lot of hurt feelings is to either to completely ignore them or make excuses why you can’t help at this time and then ignore them. I found that it is not useful to chastise them or give them a lecture on financial responsibility because they don’t want to hear it and will probably ignore it anyway. They will soon get the hint and stop asking for a handout. Try to let your wife deal with the family, but if she really has a hard time saying no, then don’t be afraid to step in and take control.

We also make a point of not revealing details of our financial situation to everyone back home. We don’t discuss details of our salaries or our monthly bills with other family members simply because it’s a private matter and it’s none of their business! Believe me, if you tell one relative how much you make in a month, the whole country will likely know :-).

You can do whatever works for you and your spouse, but do discuss all this stuff up front before you marry.

One tip for the guys just starting out in this game. Find out what you can about her family situation early. How many brothers and sisters? Dad or mom working? How many brothers unemployed? Does she support the other family members regularly? The poorer they are, the more you will feel that you must help. If you can, don’t get involved with a lady if most of her family is unemployed or has trouble with the law.

Ray

... in response to Money Topics, posted by Ray on Oct 8, 2003

Posted by Ray on 10/08/2003
In Reply to: How do y'all deal with money and Filipinas posted by Matt on 10/07/2003:
ALL income is family money and major expenditures should be mutually agreed upon.
As long as the mutual agreement is yours RAY LOL
Does this go along with “don’t trust her with birth controls use a condom”?
It will be a long day in Hell before I put anyone else on my bank account.
She will still have her ATM card and I will set an allowance for shopping and buying stuff.  Trust but verify, she can buy anything on her own for us from that account...  That gives her more freedom and a feeling of contribution if she is working.  
If she works I will let her get her own savings account and she can send back any amount she wants from it.   Maricel originally wanted to work on a cruise ship and her utmost goal was to send money back home to help her Parents.  Having a joint account would not satisfy that unfinished business.  
When we attended the marriage seminar in Cebu it was a long boring day.  All of the instructors were women.  Guess what they advocated about money affairs?  
Joint accounts as soon as you’re married!  
What do rich movie stars do when the woman has more money than the man?
Right, what’s hers is hers, separate accounts.
Now when the poorer partner helps with the business success with sweat equity I would agree on the joint accounts, but is should be earned.   Not just given what you have worked your whole  life for.  
I would also agree that when neither partner has assets and they built a business together the wealth should be shared.  
I have a problem in trusting a partner who does not have my years of experience and has to learn at my expense.  
I would rather have a heated debate than “I am sorry honey, I didn’t know.”
I know some of you will not agree with this but build your own bed, then lay in it.  Everything is ok, till “things go wrong”.  We hope that day never comes but that song about “it is crying time again “has had many guys singing.  Yes she took all the money out of the account, what should I do?

The guys married to Filipinas here in Daytona do not send regular amounts back to the families in the PI.  If they want to help they will send some money once in a while.  I agree that is the best advice and I will follow suit.
My $0.02

... in response to Money Topics, posted by Ray on Oct 8, 2003

RAY:

We also make a point of not revealing details of our financial situation to everyone back home. We don’t discuss details of our salaries or our monthly bills with other family members simply because it’s a private matter and it’s none of their business!

STEPHEN:

I agree with you...it's your business, not theirs.

But also....how in the world can they understand it if you make more money in one month than they do in a couple of years.  It will simply confirm their view that you are rich.  The difference in standard of living is too much for them to comprehend.

... in response to Re: Money Topics, posted by Stephen on Oct 9, 2003

I can truly say that my wife if ask about my financial affairs could say, "I don't know nothing, so don't ask me nothing".

... in response to Re: Money Topics, posted by Stephen on Oct 9, 2003

Hi Stephen,

I'm with you and Ray on this! No matter what you tell people living in  the Philippines, they have no comprehension of the cost of living in the US. Sometimes my wife still doesn't want to buy something here because it is so much cheaper in the Philippines. I tell her to pretend it is in pesos and have to insist on buying it. We saw a 6 foot piece of Philippine bamboo selling for $7.99 at Michael's...she couldn't believe it!!!

Dave H.

... in response to Money Topics, posted by Ray on Oct 8, 2003

Hey Ray,

We have never been expected by my wife's family to send money on a regular basis (perhaps by long lost relatives). LOL We have a reserve fund for emergencies, special occasions or situations and things we just want to do. Her family's attitude is that they got along fine before, so why change. My mother-in-law is awesome! She can stretch a dollar better than anyone I know...my wife is second (her mother has had more practice). ;o))) I have more money now than when I was single and neither one of us is working.

Dave H.

... in response to I Agree 110% , posted by Dave H on Oct 8, 2003

DAVE:

I have more money now than when I was single and neither one of us is working.

STEPHEN:

I agree.  Tess has her own bank account, and she's not on mine.  But she makes all the deposits and makes out the checks.  She pushes the check book over to me and just says "sign one more".

I've got more money than ever before because she does good on handling the money.

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

My biggest mistake was seeing the poverty level and assuming that I needed to do something before discussing it with Honey.  I told my in-laws that I would send her P10,000/month until she came here.  Later I found out that that was P5500 more than my in-laws earned in a month.  They thought they'd just hit the jackpot.  Her father stopped working and everyone became abusive to Honey when she didn't pass out the money.  But Honey said she didn't need that much so I put it in a Debit Account and she took what she needed.  In almost 12 months she took $200 twice and none at all twice, the rest of the time just over $100.  With this she paid all her families bills including rent, food, electricity and water, her and her brothers college and their transporation.  She usually ate away from home since her family had become so demanding.  I literally had to make her buy new shoes, an umbrella, a mattress for the bed and some clothes and go to the doctor when she was sick.  She wouldn't spend a penny unless I okayed it which at times was somewhat annoying.  Her family became so abusive I made her move out which made her feel like she was a bad daughter.

She did not want me to help her brother in college and once again I didn't listen.  He was not responsible and didn't appreciate the assistance, MOF he told her that it was due him and even when we quit paying he expected to still get to go at no effort on him.  My rules were simple...
break no laws
make above average grades
pass all courses the 1st time
quit and its over
expect to help the family as much as honey when he graduated.
...He then proceeded to steal a cell phone, flunk courses, had what was equivalent to a "D" average and wanted to quit for a sememster.  We told him would not help anymore.  Honey's 2nd younger brother saw what had occured and made no effort at all to go to college.  Honey's sister still wants to go though and I'll be glad to help under the above conditions.

With all the money issues and the abuse Honey had received she no longer had a good relationship with her family and this is not a good thing for Filipinas.  So I decided at Christmas time to send a letter and detail how much I made and all of our expenses.  I also pointed out that yes I spent a lot when i was there I saved my OT and borrowed to afford the trip in an effort to give Honey a very nice wedding and honeymoon.  Not because I was rich and wasteful with my income.  This worked unbelieveably well, they sent a letter apologizing for how they had acted.
Honey and I send P2500/mo.  I know that this is used for extras and pays the monthly bill on an entertainment center.  They have not asked for more although I might give if I saw it was nescessary.  I no longer think they would ask for something that was not absolutely necessary.
I think if I had discussed it better with my Honey before her family or listened to her advice where it concerns her family none of this would have happened.  But alls well that ends well.

Bear and Honey

... in response to Family or burdens, posted by Bear on Oct 8, 2003

Good thread, I believe you have repeated it from before and I have used that information already, thanks.

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

[This message has been edited by Nathan]

   When it comes to money and your filipina, do what you are comfortable doing. Work out an agreement with your wife and stick to it. Most men do not spend enough time in the Philippines to learn the culture and learn how to use the situations that arise to one's advantage. The role of a patron  is not entirely bad. Extended family members may rarely question your choices and give you substantial deference.
   We have contributed substantially to my wife's family
and continue to do so, but then again, to a large degree I have made them my family too, and it shows in how they treat me. We are in the process of buying my wife's mother a modest house. It was my idea, and I simply wanted her to have it. She went looking at my suggestion only. After all, when we are there with our 3 year old daughter, I wanted her to have a bigger place to host us. In addition, I have taken the responsibility of educating my wife's younger half-sister and little half-brother(private schools), and I wanted them out of the neighborhood they were growing up in, as it had been going downhill for several years.
   It all ends up being a matter of personal preference. Do what you think is right, it's YOUR pocketbook after all.
   Compared to all the gold digging and general fiancial screwing I took with American women, it is ALL a bargain.

My $.02 worth...

Nathan

... in response to it's a bargain..., posted by Nathan on Oct 8, 2003

After reading your thread I feel guilty not helping with my wife's parents house sooner.  But something tells me to wait till the house is finished before I step in and help.  Meanwhile I will feel like a heel but I think it is the best in the long run.  
I am expecting to help bring my wife's two sisters to school also in the future.  I won't mind doing that.

... in response to Re: it's a bargain..., posted by Peter Lee on Oct 9, 2003

[This message has been edited by Nathan]

   Like I said, it's YOUR money, so you can decide.
I was trying to point out that there is another perspective on all of this. Any of my wife's immediate family that is of school age know that they can go to college on a full scholarship offer from me, however, they also know that if they screw up or think they can just sit back and let me support them, well, in that case I will not do jack for them. I only want to provide opportunity
that they have to match with hard work, and I expect my terms to be met or else.

Nathan

... in response to it's a bargain..., posted by Nathan on Oct 8, 2003

asdf

... in response to How do y'all deal with money and Filipin..., posted by Matt on Oct 7, 2003

Some people say "My wife works and that's her money to do with as she pleases."  I say, "GARBAGE".  It's family money.  And if one partner works and sends most of her check to the philippines then it's bound to cause friction in the family here in the USA.

I hear of some ladies who work and send $500 per month back to the phils.  That's crap also.  That's like winning the lottery here.  If they can get all that money then they can just sit on their butt and sleep their life away.  You're hurting them.

I also hear of men who send their fience in the Philippines hundreds of dollars per month until they get to America.  That's stupid.  I never sent Tess spending money.  For example, I covered her extra expenses in preparing to travel here and in the submission of papers.  Also, her brother died suddenly and I send $400 extra so she could go home to be with her family.  I firmly believe that if you send big bucks to her to get her used to living in high class style.....JUST WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WHEN SHE GETS TO AMERICA and she has to control her spending.  I think you're creating your own problems by sending the gal a lot of money.

Tess and I send her folks $60 per month....no more.  We help her folks, but we don't try and inflate their lifestyle.  We also send Tess' neice to nurses college.  She's doing well, and I don't mind that.  But at this time I'm not going to send other's in the family to college.  

One more thing.....We're not going to try and get her family to move to America.  They are Philippino and that's good enough.  (Perhaps the niece can come to America after nursing college, but that's her business.  She will support herself.)

Notice...this is just my opinion.  I'm rather a cheap person.  

Stephen

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Stephen on Oct 7, 2003

Your being Wise.

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Stephen on Oct 7, 2003

We don't send boxes to the Phils.

Tess returns home yearly and whille there she will take family to the mall and purchases clothes they want.

That saves the high shipping charges....and lets them have a gift they really want.  It's fun for her to take them shopping.

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Stephen on Oct 7, 2003

The average American family spends $60 a month on pizza.

It just burns me up that while I'm sitting here working my butt off I can just picture those lazy in-laws lounging around eating pizza that we paid for- and laughing like they always do!

I say if they want pizza, let them get a job and buy it themselves, 'cause they're not getting any more of mine! Anybody can work who really wants to.

That's it, Honey. I'm putting my foot down. The free ride is over! Who's laughing now, huh?

And don't give me none of that tampon stuff about it, either.

They are Philippino and that's good enough.

Honey?

... in response to Right on, Men, I'm with you all the way!, posted by HaroldC on Oct 8, 2003

:-)

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Stephen on Oct 7, 2003

N/T

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Stephen on Oct 7, 2003

When are we tax payers going to wake up and realize we are hurting the poor here also.  They are depending on us instead of themselves.  This has been a paid advertisment of a worn out taxpayer.

Steveb

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Stephen on Oct 7, 2003

nt

... in response to Re: How do y'all deal with money and Fil..., posted by Stephen on Oct 7, 2003

:o)