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I read all manner of posts on this board about what Japanese women are after and what they expect, the vast majority of which are absolute nonsense. Japan has 140 million people, half the population of the United States. Among them, like in any other large society, you will find all classes of people from polite society to tatooed, pierced drug dealers. There are debutante princesses and burakumin (the untouchable class, considered unfit to marry perhaps because one of their ancestors worked as a butcher or shoemaker.)

Because of the very strong US military presence in Japan over the past 55 years, there are probably more Japanese/American marriages than from nearly any other nation in Asia - though of late, I suspect the PI is surpassing Japan in new marriages. Think Japanese only marry upper class businessmen? Sit in the US Embassy in Tokyo for a few hours on any business day and you'll go away thinking otherwise. Plenty of young sailors and soldiers are in their with their new Japanese sweeties registering their marriages. Think they only like blonde/blue men? Think again. In fact if you're African American, you probably have a better chance in Japan than anywhere else in Asia. There's a strong interest in American black culture in Japan. Think they don't like Americans? Wrong again. Since WWII, American people, culture, and trends have been of primary interest in Jaapn. Though MacArthur was instrumental in defeating Japan, he was also the main, driving force in saving the Japanese culture in the late 40s. Japanese love America, Americans, American fashion, music, movies, culture, and anything else American.

Japan's economic bubble burst in about 1990 because of some horrible banking practices and governmental bailouts of some major businesses that should have been allowed to be put out of their misery. Their propserous years were only a decade long, the 80s - so the concept that they're all rich is nonsense. They're a VERY thrifty people in general and even when the cash was flowing, most chose to save their earnings rather than to blow it on stuff, like Americans seem to love to. Spiritual and emotional issues take a far more important place in modern Japanese women's lives and dreams than do materialistic hopes.

Well, there's the big language problem. Nope, yet another misconception. Japanese are some of the most educated people in the world and English is manditory subject in school. Don't get me wrong, not all Japanese are fluent, but I never met one who couldn't speak some, but more importantly, could read the language fairly well. Grammar and written English seem to take precidence over conversation in their schools.

I'm not saying a Japanese wife is for everyone - nor am I saying it's an easy thing to do. To meet and marry a Japanese lady, you need to have an interest in Japanese culture, history, langiuage, food, etc. Japanese women are neither compliant or subserviant - they're likely quite strong and intelligent - but, like nearly all Asian women, understand that men and women are different, and understand how the husband and wife work together as a team, I think the most basic of the misunderstandings of modern American men and women. I was very lucky to have marryied a lovely intelligent lady, and even though she came from a well-to-do background,  more interested in the happiness of her family, than in gaining material possessions. She's very thrifty, not interested in fancy cars, cruises, expensive jewlery, or other visible signs of wealth. Of course, I consider her one-of-a-kind, but that doesn't mean that others can't just as easily find the same level of happiness I managed to.

But as I mentioned in an earlier post, many of people's concerns of having a foreign wife, like supporting her family, getting a visa, sponsoring her family, long flights, expensive phone calls, adapting to modern society, internet access, teaching her to manage money, drive, use an ATM, whatever - become non-issues with a Japanese lady. When we were dating, I went twice to Japan to visit her, and she came to California twice to visit me, so we were able to spend over 13 weeks together over a period of two and a half years before we were married. We got to know each other far better than many who pursue this course.

As for the professions of the Japanese/American couples I know, Let's see there are three engineers, one framing contractor, two teachers, a wedding photographer, an aircraft mechanic, a factory floor supervisor, a merchant seaman, a couple of retired military, a lawyer, and a resturaunt owner (his wife waits tables,) and a performance auto parts salesman. It's not exactly a who's who of executives.

Just a quick reality check for the ongoing comments about how Japanese women are only a muse for the wealthy.

- Jeff

... in response to Japanese Women and American Men, posted by Jeff S on Sep 3, 2003

You'll let out our little secret!  We already got enough Cannuks, Brits, Yanks, and Aussies playing Charisma-Man here.  Don't encourage them!

Let's face it.  While Japanese women are the most perfect women in the world due to that mix of East and West cultures, Japan itself makes courtship problematic at best due to being so tourist un-friendly.  Without insider connections or some language skill, prices for English-only tourists are through the roof, easily 5 times what a Phils traveler can expect to pay for similar services.

Due to my teaching position, I know a number of women from their early 20s to their early 40s who would like to find a good man to marry.  Some are plain with fun personalities, some are major hotties and as shallow as a sidewalk puddle.  But they are still hoping to find something better than the local abusive, philandering, chain-smoking, drunken, boring, couch potatoes they're accustomed to.  American men's main advantage is a reputation for being helpful and supportive around the house.  (Though to remain competative, Japanese men have started spreading the rumor that American men are much more abusive in the privacy of their home.  Watch out for that.)  But if you've got nothing better in terms of character or personality to offer a Japanese woman than what she kind find locally, it may take you a looong time to find your soulmate here.  But not impossible.  Jeff is right about the visa section of the U.S. embassy.  You see a wide variety of people come through there.  No matter how loud, obnoxious, low class, and vulgar you are, you can find a compatible match here if you can manage to stay long enough.

... in response to Shhhh.... Jeff,, posted by Bob S on Sep 4, 2003

[This message has been edited by don2222]

Hi Bob,
 I live in the Phils, and the local men here do the same thing.  I am constantly hearing crazy stories about foreigners, especially Americans. Actually, most Filipinos call all foreigners Americans. This is some of the crazy stuff the local men tell the Filipinas:

"The American will take the Filipina to America and kill her for insurance money."

"The American will sell the Filipina to his friends."

"The American may have a bigger *****, but the Filipinos is much stronger." I hear talk about that all the time !!!

All sorts of stories about Americans being abusive, but almost every day I read in the Filipino paper about some Filipino cutting off the head of his wife or her lover, or about some Filipino father raping his daughter, and they never talk about that.

"Every Filipina with a foreigner is a prostitute."  I understand enough Visayan to know when a woman I am with is being insulted, and it is very common for a Filipino man to call the woman I am with a prostitute in Visayan.
They will typically mutter it under their breathe as we walk by, but it has been shouted at us by men driving by.
A lot of the local men say some really nasty things to Filipinas with foreigners, but as soon as their daughter wants to marry a foreigner they turn all sweet and polite to the foreigner because they want that money from America.
They never say anything to me, but I do understand many of the bad words in Visayan that they say to the women.

"The American will take the Filipina to America to work as a prostitute."

"That if a Filipina has a relationship with a foreigner she will then be "physically unfit" to later be with a Filipino."

There are more crazy things I hear, but this is all i can remember for now.

Don

... in response to What the Filipino men say ....., posted by don2222 on Sep 4, 2003

"The American may have a bigger *****, but..."

Yeah, I heard the same here.  Americans are bigger but Japanese are harder or some such.   Whatever.  Japanese women are also told that if a man is sufficiently aroused and healthy, he will orgasm quickly after just a few seconds of minimal effort, and a happy woman should hope for a man who finishes quickly.

This place has a large "pink" industry to serve the native male population, but birth control pills for women were just recently legalized.  Is it any wonder the women have a fascination with foreign men?

... in response to What the Filipino men say ....., posted by don2222 on Sep 4, 2003

American men are big ... but soft, while Japanese men are always hard. Yeah, right - they sure have an international reputation for being studs.

- Jeff

... in response to I heard that in Japan too ...., posted by Jeff S on Sep 4, 2003

[This message has been edited by Dave H]

Hi Jeff,

A California engineer while in Japan for some meetings and a few rounds of golf, arrived in Tokyo a day earlier than expected. Feeling lonely that evening, he employed the services of a beautiful young Japanese girl to be his companion for the evening. Although the Japanese girl spoke very little English and the businessman spoke no Japanese, their passion roared, and in the heat of the moment she began yelling "Gama Su!, Gama Su!". Hearing this, the Californian knew he had pleased his female Japanese friend and soon afterwards went to sleep.

The next day while playing golf with his Japanese engineering colleagues, one of his Japanese partners holed his shot from 170 yards away! Everyone went crazy and began yelling excitedly in Japanese. Wanting to impress his friends, the Californian joined in and began yelling "Gama Su! Gama Su!".

Suddenly everyone became quiet. After a moment of silence, one of the Japanese turned to him and asked: "Wrong hole? What do you mean wrong hole?"

Dave H. :o)))

... in response to What I Heard..., posted by Dave H on Sep 4, 2003

Japanese people have sex the least among countries and territories surveyed, the results of a global survey on sexual attitudes and behavior showed Tuesday. The study, which polled 18,500 people aged 16 to 55 in 28 countries and territories, found Japanese make love only 36 times a year.  (Wow! bummer :(

Americans make love more than any other nation at an average of 124 times a year, followed by Greeks at 117 times, South Africans and Croatians both at 116 times, and New Zealanders at 115 times. The survey was conducted by SSL International PLC, the manufacturer of Durex condoms. (Kyodo News)

Maybe that's why all the kinky sex

Hum

... in response to Japanese getting it least says global su..., posted by Humabdos on Sep 4, 2003

N/T

... in response to Then I'd Better Slow Down! LOL (n/t), posted by Dave H on Sep 4, 2003

.

... in response to What I Heard..., posted by Dave H on Sep 4, 2003


Hi Dave,
you made me laugh so hard after reading your post, that was funny *lol*

... in response to What I Heard..., posted by Dave H on Sep 4, 2003


Help!!! I'm out of breath. :)))))

... in response to What I Heard..., posted by Dave H on Sep 4, 2003

Will you please warn me before posting something like this? My monitor is soaked from the spit-out coke!  Too funny!

... in response to Ahahaha Kuya Dabe!, posted by Carr on Sep 4, 2003

Hi C,

It just reminded me so much of Jeff...Califonia engineer in Japan. LOL

Kuya Dabe

... in response to Shhhh.... Jeff,, posted by Bob S on Sep 4, 2003

Coming back next month? I hear the aerospace companies are hiring again, Northrup Grumman in El Segundo is advertising heavily. You might want to check with elcolombiano on the Latin board (Alan). If you want me to send you the Sunday classifieds or anything, just let me know.

- Jeff

... in response to Hey Bob..., posted by Jeff S on Sep 4, 2003

Thanks.  I already might have an interview lined up with Boeing again on the military side.  Going direct at El Segundo isn't a bad option either if things don't pan out at Boeing (I'd prefer to settle back in Orange County when I bring Akiko over).  I don't relish the idea of Lockheed up in Palmdale.  While I like the warm weather, the high desert is not my idea of a place for a love nest.
;-)

... in response to Returning Plans, posted by Bob S on Sep 5, 2003

Just think of how romantic it'll be sitting out at night watching the lizards scale the sagebrush. And just think of the culture! You're only 30 minutes or so from the Roy Rogers museum in Victorville.

Sorry, couldn't resist. Anyway, If I can do anything for you, just let me know.

- Jeff

... in response to Japanese Women and American Men, posted by Jeff S on Sep 3, 2003

Thank you for one of the better posts I have read on this bord. I Hope that more people will concider looking for a wife in Asia and not just in PI. I have been to Japan 10 times and loved ever single miniute I spent there. The Japanese people are a wonderfull race and the women are Beautifull.
GregF

... in response to Japanese Women and American Men, posted by Jeff S on Sep 3, 2003

i agree100%,been there twice over the last 10 years just never met the one and only
tneal

... in response to Japanese Women and American Men, posted by Jeff S on Sep 3, 2003

Jeff

How  have  you  and  Mariko  been  lately?

Thanks for the nice informative post.

Well things between myself and Otgoo (the Mongolian girl)  have  disintigrated to  a  dead end.  By  the  last  phone call  I  made  to  her  I  could only  understand  30 %  of  what  she  was  saying.  It  turns  out  as  best  as I can  figure  out  that her American  teacher 20  years  her  senior  got her pregnant.  And though  she  doesn't  love  him  she  has  to  decide to  accept  his offer  of marriage  or  not.   She  lamented to  me  that  she  felt  like  a  really  stupid woman  that  she  messed up her  chances  with  me, and  that  she  dreamed  that  we  would  have  met  and  married  by  Christmas.   I  have  written  her  back  once  or  twice  but  the  reality  is  this  situation  was  a  little  bit  more  than  I  could chew off.  Mongolia, and  a  family on the  way  that  wasn't  mine, was  maybe  a little  bit  too  far  off  the  beaten path  I  think.

On  a  happier  note ---  Through  the  same  Dating  service  Asianeuro.com  I  met  a 30 year old Christian  Japanese woman named  Yukako.  She  is  an  IT  engineer (still  not  exactly  sure  what  that is)  between  Jobs and  just  started  attending more  computer  classes  this  week. She  lives in  Tokyo -- formerly  lived  in Nagoya  and  is originally from  Gifu  Prefecture.   I'm  not  falling  head  over  heels  with  her  and  she  is  being  cautious  and  hasn't brought  up any romantic  notions either  just  decent pen pals.  Yet,  she  still  is  writing  with  me  regularly and  she  gave  me  her  phone  number voluntarily.  

I was  supposed to call her this morning for the first time but  she  sent  me  an  e-mail that  she  had  an  errand  to  do  with  a  friend in the evening  instead, before I  was  to  call her and  that  she  was  tired from   school.  I  e-mailed  no  problem  and  we  will  try  for  tomorrow morning / evening  for  her  instead  and  she  agreed.  Her  written  English  is  quite good  but  she  has  cautioned  me that  her spoken English and listening  skills  are  not  so  good so  we  will  have  to go  slow.

She has  told me  that after  her  computer  course ends in  December, she  might  go to  Australia  to  live  for  a  few  months.  She  is  well traveled having  already  visited  Boston, Chicago, Hawaii, France, England, Spain, Italy, Fiji, Australia, Hong Kong, and  the Philippines.  I  told  her  good  go  for  it !   Whether she  is  in  Australia  or  Tokyo  what  is the  difference. She is not here either way.  And I wouldn't  mind  visiting  Australia, If I  had  some  money  ha ha ha.  How does the  saying  go? ---- If  you  love  someone  set  them  free  and  if  they  truly want  to  they will come  back  to  you.    She said she has to figure out where to go with her life.  --  I  feel  the  same  challenge for  my  life  arising  very  soon too,   truth  be  told -- my  days  at this  job  are numbered.  

Well according to my Chinese Horoscope book which I  tend  to  believe  more  than  the  Zodiac,  I  am  a snake  and  she  is  an  Ox  and  that is  a  very  good  match  ha ha   and  she  is an aquarius (? - what  month is  that)  and  I  am a taurus  so I  don't  know  how  I  am  standing  there.  Well  after  hanging out in the wind a  couple of times recently.  I am just taking this one casually and relaxed and apparently so is  she.  If  anything  is  meant  to  be  then it  will happen or  not  --- right?

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Last  week  had  the opportunity to  recipricate  the  kindness that one  of  my  pen pals showed me  when I  visited Kyoto in February.   Kaori  and  her  aunt  and  uncle  were visiting the LA, Palm Springs  and  Vegas for  a  week.  So  I  met  them at LAX  and  I  took  them  to  their  hotel  in  Century  City.  Kaori  mentioned  she  wanted  to  visit  Venice Beach  and Santa Monica so  that  is  where  we  went to.  I  had  a  great  time  with  them  and I  felt very  at home  with  them.  I  was  able  to  practice  some  of  my  poor  Japanese and I  could  even  evesdrop a little  bit  and  understand  what  they  were saying  a little bit.  

We  ate  dinner  at a pizza place  in Santa Monica on  the  third street Promenade (a  word  that  Kaori  had  trouble  pronouncing)  There  were  a  few  left overs  which  they  gave  to  me.  Then  arose  a  social  dilema -- There are  a  fair  amount  of  homeless on  this  street whether  capable  to  work  or  not  who  knows?  a normally dressed and  looking guy  in  his  early  twenties  actually  asked  me  for  my  boxed pizza  left overs. Normally I  would  have  given  it  to  him  but  since  the  Uncle  paid  for  the  meal  I  thought  it  would  be  bad  form to  give it  to  this guy.  It was  an  interesting  situation.

I  had  a  great  time  with  them  and it  reminded  me  how  at home  with  them and  Japanese culture  I  felt  and  to  Keep  my  eye  on  the  Prize.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Jeff

Can you  tell  me  more  about  the  Burakumin --- (the untouchable class, considered unfit to marry perhaps because one of their ancestors worked as a butcher or shoemaker.)

I have read about this group of  people in my Culture Shock book  but the  book  advised not  to  bring  this  topic  up in  conversation  as it  was  considered  bad  form to  mention them.   I  suppose I  would  equate them  to  the  Gypsies of  Europe  but  why  the  social  stigma?  I  read  that  it  was  considered  better  for  the  Japanese to  marry  foreigners (Koreans, Chinese etc)  than  to  marry  into  this  group.  It  is  rather  puzzling.

Take  care

Windmill Boy

... in response to another update ....  Blah blah  blah.  ...., posted by Windmill Boy on Sep 3, 2003

Sorry to hear about Otgoo, she was a real cutie and you seemed pretty taken with her. Such is life, though, in many countries. People seem to have far fewer choices than they do here about the direction their life takes.

Mari-chan is doing great. A number of her friends have visited from Japan this summer and she's come to the conclusion that she has it pretty good in comparison to the middle aged nonsense they seem to be going through. It's been a really busy summer but not with anything significant. I'm looking forward to slowing down a bit this fall. We'd planned to go to Japan this spring, but put it off til next - probably May whan the sakura (cherry blossoms) are in bloom. BTW, I am also a snake and Mariko, an ox (Zodiac wise.) It's a good combination.

BTW, IT means Information Technology - you know, computers, An IT Engineer sets up and maintains networks, manages databases, etc. I'm no expert but there are some IT guys on this board that I'm sure will fill you in, in more depth.

I really don't know much about burakumin - just what I've heard from my wife. In her family, they also consider flower vendors (I don't get that one,) and entertainers also not suitable to associate with. I completely understand the prejuidice against actor types, like Jeannine Garafalo, Sean Penn, and Susan Sarandon, but I assume that does not include karaoke singers, because just as soon as one of her relatives gets three or more drinks in them, they grab the microphone and start belting out "Deez ritter town brues, are merting away..."

Anyway here's a couple links that might help:
http://www.uncc.edu/~medomoto/3209/minorities/buraku.html
http://jbe.gold.ac.uk/7/alldritt001.html

- Jeff

... in response to Re: another update ....  Blah blah  blah..., posted by Jeff S on Sep 3, 2003

Thanks Jeff,

You got me ROFLMMFAOCUMGDLSAPIMSADPAMFN!!! The Filipinos were all trying to get this Kano to sing karaoke...it didn't happen. Instead of San Miguel beer and Tanduhay Rhum, they should have tried plying me with single-malt Scotch. ;o)))

I am a Cock in the the Chinese zodiac...which can't be all bad. LOL

Dave H.

... in response to "Deez ritter town brues", posted by Dave H on Sep 4, 2003

I am a rooster to and guess what? My Brazilian is a rabbit the absolute opposite. I figure since it is a Chinese zodiac it doesn't apply to us. You know what Rabbits like to do :)~

... in response to "Deez ritter town brues", posted by Dave H on Sep 4, 2003

Think he moved to Taiwan and opened a fireworks business?

http://engrish.com/detail.php?imagename=thundercrap.jpg

- Jeff

... in response to Hey, Dave - whatever happened to Kevin?, posted by Jeff S on Sep 4, 2003

Hi Jeff,

I think you found him! I hope he doesn't blow himself up. ;o)))

Dave H.

... in response to Re: another update ....  Blah blah  blah..., posted by Jeff S on Sep 3, 2003

Jeff

Thanks  for  the  links --  interesting  articles  that  shed  a little  more  light  on the  Burakumin,  but it  still  is  a  puzzling  concept.  yes I agree  that the  Kareoke singers should be  discriminated  against too  ha ha ha  but  that  would  be a losing  fight  from  the get go right?

Windmill Boy

... in response to Japanese Women and American Men, posted by Jeff S on Sep 3, 2003

Very good points Jeff!

I've known dozens of Navy guys married to Japanese ladies and I just don't understand this belief that Japanese women will only consider marrying a wealthy foreigner, unless things have changed drastically in the last 20 years since I've been there. Sailors are about as far from "wealthy" as you can get (ROFL).

Those Japanese women didn't marry an American man for money and they certainly didn't marry for a green card. Gee, do you think it possibly could hsve been for love?

Thanks for clearing that up,

Ray