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I noticed that AFA has a new name or front agency called Dating Depot.
Is this true? If so, may I warn any newbies that they are very
slick but deceitful in their performance etc. Smiling faces don't alsways tell the truth. Do not work with these folks.

... in response to Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A scam agency, posted by fishtiger on Jan 14, 2004

hey fishtiger,

For your information another name AFA uses is firstdream.net

Do you have any positive or negative experience in working with AFA or Dating Depot?

... in response to Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A scam agency, posted by fishtiger on Jan 14, 2004

Probably, but considering I met my scammer ...uh, wife ...through LHC Lugansk --  now defunct a few years due to government intervention -- and all she/we ever paid was a few hryvnia per e-mail, I'd say anything is possible.

... in response to Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A scam agency, posted by fishtiger on Jan 14, 2004

I did meet my fiancee from the AFA website. I also purchased a few other addresses from them. All of them responded and seemed nice. I only met Sveta who is now my fiancee. We had good and bad experience with them.

Sveta was on another site for about a year before I wrote her. She then went to this local AFA afiliate in Dnepropetrovsk because she heard it was better from friends. When she showed up on the new profiles I wrote her right away. She was not that strong in English so I wrote her using AFA's translation service. I just have to say it was slow and expensive. I actually thought she was not interested since she took so long to respond since I already pre-paid everything. I paid a deposit of $100 and it was $15 each way for a standard one page letter translated and forwarded to her so it was $30 for roundtrip. Even after I paid the deposit AFA would not forward me her first letter saying I did not pay. So that added about a week and a few phone calls before they realized I did pay so they held my letter hostage. Now I am not condemming them as that could have been an honest mistake. I sent one more letter and even then it took 2 weeks by email so I started looking elsewhere. I then found First Dream and it was $10 roundtrip (I forget exactly but it was close to $10) and they hand delivered the letters to her and I got an answer from her all in less then a week. AFA might have decent service normally but I felt their forwarding service was terrible for the price.

The part we had most of the problem with was when Sveta asked to be removed from AFA. To make a long story short it took about 6 months and many phone calls and email later to get her removed. Also during this time the local AFA afiliate would send the letter they had on file from Sveta to any men that wrote her. This was after Sveta asked to be removed many times. When she ended up on a scam site their answer to us was that they removed her but it was some girl who worked there never deleted her. Yeah right, they were just making more money by selling her address as much as they could.

The only way she was finally removed was after many phone calls by me to Arizona and emails from her to Arizona as well. We actually talked to a lady from AFA that helped us and got her removed from all their sites... The local Dnepro affiliate was the bigest problem but if AFA is in association with them they also should take the blame as well.

So I am happy I met Sveta through this site so there are real women there and good ones. But overall I felt their service is not so good and expensive but I'd still buy addresses from them.

Z

P.S. About 3 months after she was PERMANTLY removed from AFA, they called her to invite her to the socials for the next group of men coming to town.... So even after all that they still had her as available in their books... They again blamed it on a lady that works in the office...

... in response to Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A scam agency, posted by fishtiger on Jan 14, 2004

The problem of elusive, or even dishonest marriage agencies in the FSU is growing rapidly.

As the owner (American) of a new, small agency (no, it's not a plug, but write me if you like.) I can speak of the difficulty and temptation of the agency owners here. Most "business" men here have no concept of honesty. You can argue about the reasons for this all you like, but it doesn't change things. The price of doing business in the FSU is not cheap, communications and technology are expensive here, people do what they can to make a buck, if they can get it from a lonely foriegner then all the better.

In Ukraine there maybe 5 honest agencies, where we know the women and check their identity.

Do the managers of a large agency with 5000+ ladies know any of them, or check to see if they are even real? Of course not. Photos and profiles are sold all the time. Everyday I get an offer from someone here, asking to sell me profiles of "beautiful, sincere, single" women. They always want to keep the email address, always. The better to extort money later. They place countless women on the free sites, like Match Doctor, promising the women a good result. So the women here, at least in the south of Ukraine, are becoming increasingly hesitant to place with an agency. If they go with a good agency, they don't get enough letters, if it is a free site they get too many crazy letters. They have no realistic ideas about life other than what they know. Everyone still believes that money still grows on trees and there are millions of wealthy men for each one of them.

The best advice is to do business with an agency where you can talk to the management. If the agency is unwilling to give you the womans telephone or address, don't deal with them, they are not honest. Place ads in the local papers and let the women contact you, it's not expensive. Use the personal services to get a good match for yourself. And line up a few women in an area to visit, always have a backup plan.

Don't let lovely Natasha turn out to be 250 pound, chain smoking, smoked fish eating Yuri.

... in response to Another opinion, posted by AJoe on Jan 15, 2004

Good Thoughts...

... in response to Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A scam agency, posted by fishtiger on Jan 14, 2004

I've found AFA has many covers, it's a business.

Where have you been...

How many people do you know actually met anyone using AFA?
nuff said.

For those who have met their other half via AFA.

Lets hear from ya.

... in response to Re:  Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A scam ag..., posted by wsbill on Jan 14, 2004

are these posts for real ?

there are no black helicoptors over your house!!!

and covers? they arnt fronts or covers? it is a conglomorate business
a company operating many affiliates under and umbrella?

AFA of course does not have *5 bajillion woman*
in its own agency.
nor could they possibly police these profiles well.
they are in thier "database"
not from thier "agency"

they are a conglomorate agency that
gets its profiles from hundreds and hundreds of small agencies and affiliates
it is thier business "model"

its style may be good or bad for you.. who knows

and of course some of the smaller agencies arent legit or have women that arnt legit..or profiles that arnt legit..

but also a good many of the successes you see the girl may have been listed on AFA even if the guy said i met her thru "joeschmoes local" agency

shear numbers wise they probably have the most wedded couples i would guess.

to say you dont know anyone that has met someone from AFA and had success is a bit weird ,
as far more than you know probably did and dont even know it!
My wife was listed with europeon connections  and AFA.
since she had regitered at a local marraige agency
did she know this ?
nope!!  and niether did I.

after we started dating i saw her on AFA site and then in a EC catalog..
the small agencies sell the profiles toi the conglomorates , this shouldnt be a shock to anyone.
its more exposer for the woman, and better exposer for the small agency ,and gives the conglomorate a huge data base.

before I met my wife I  contacted
about 12 women from AFA.. and ultimately met about 10 of them in ukraine

all where legit,,and sincere
except one being what i would call a social dater.
but a real person no doubt!

on top of that another 8 or so i met in kharkov thru a small agency- where also listed on AFA.

f you research much to find decent small agency woman,
odds are very high they are also  listed with one of the big conglomerates , they may or may not know it depenig on letters coming into them.

Anastasia EC AFA etc.

bottom line if you see someone of interest on AFA ,
i wouldnt be scared to use them to contact her.

if i was really seriuos going to that particular city -
i would look at the agencies in her home city and she WILL quite likely be listed with one of them,it isnt rocket science or a conspiracy ;)

so you have one vote from a happily married guy that did not meet his wife thru AFA, but easily could have since i was a "member",she had a profile there,
and I had addresses left to buy on my account lol

even have wedding pics if ya want ;)

for the guy in st pete-
that sounds more like a city problem??
as i have heard more than a fair share of similsr stories from girls in that city???
happy couples as well,
but seems an inordinate amount  of "good time girls"
??

AFA business model isnt how i would approach this with 20/20 hindsight.,.but its not a bad company, always gave good customer service ,
and i met plenty of really sweet girls thru thier AFA contact info.

I cannot say the same for some of the other big name conglomorates i had info from.

**shrugs**

... in response to Re: Re:  Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A sca..., posted by AJ277 on Jan 14, 2004

Does AFA get their profiles from other sites, or do they license re-sellers?  I always thought they had a re-seller plan and that's why so many sites had their ladies on them.

There's many other sites (apart from AFA) that were all registered to the same guy.  SOmething like 30-40 at last count.

You're right.  There's nothing inherantly dishonest in the way they do business.  SOme guys just forget that it's a business that's suppose to make money

... in response to Re: Re: Re:  Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A..., posted by Patrick on Jan 14, 2004

hmm Patrick - to be honest i am not sure.

i have talked to john adams-AFA-  before --

He told me the structure but it was two or three years ago and with too many concusions have lost that info ..LOL

to my best recollection it was a bit of both?
they collectively have many websites with the same database but different "name"
like ashland ioil selling 10w40 under 5 different labels?
it reeally is nothing dishonest.just mareketing the sanme product to different venues and demographics?

and i believe they get the majorirty of profiles from smallert agencies and affiliates..
as i knew that many small independent agencies do list thier woman also with AFA.

of course AFA has thier own offices and ladies in several cities...as well.

my main point was of the two small independent agencies
i know in ukraine as being very reputable...
almost aklkl thierr ladies are "also" listed o nAFA ..and you could ciontact the girls in either way?

also of several i contacted on my owwn thru AFAS,, thety existed and a high percentage were not only correct addresses and phone numbers- they were still available and most had NEVER met a western man or some had never even recieved a letter.
th edata base is indeed huge.. and thers a lot of girls never get a nbote ,muich less anyonme following up and visiting..

in the real world the girls are MUCH more likely to be "lead on" by a keyboard romeo,that never visits or intends to ,
than a guy going thru AFA has of being scammed on an $4 address or contact info.

so i found the original post- (not wsbills) -
quite misleading.
( i replied to the wrong part of the thread actually)

... in response to Re: Re: Re:  Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A..., posted by Patrick on Jan 14, 2004

there is nothing wrong with that.  If there is a demand,  be the supplier.  ec101.  Personally,  I think an ethical agency should help with transportation,  interperters,  lodging and make the initial introduction.  Then,  guys,  you are on your own.  There shouldn't be much confusion in this process.  They can't hold your hand when you get married and you are on your own.  You pay for a simple service--an intro.  Thens ya takes your chances.

... in response to Re:  Is AFA  Now Dating Depot? A scam ag..., posted by wsbill on Jan 14, 2004

I've also seen AFA using many different names and URLs, but they all go back to the same AFA.  

I don't know of anyone who has met anyone through AFA, but I am also curious to know of any successes or failures using this service.  I just used their service for some MOB contacts and I hope I didn't make a big mistake.

... in response to AFA, posted by johnnydudeman on Jan 14, 2004

I used AFA before I went to St.Pete in 2002, just to have some contacts when I got there. I had printed out some profiles. When I got to St.Pete, I went to thier office  and they set up some dates for me.They called the girls I was interested in and set up 2 dates for me. 1 was the very same afternoon. I made arrangments to meet this girl in front of my hotel.We met and we decided to go to a cafe and get to know each other better, and on the way she said she needed to buy some gum and went into a little store while I waited outside. Not 1 minute later she came back out with her "Long lost friend who she had not seen in months" and promptly told me that they were going shopping.I thought o.k, so were going shopping, and with that they turned and started walking away, nver looking back at me.It took me 2 minutes before I realized she had set up an out to get out.All this in the very first day I arrived in St.Pete to find my other half!  
    Not to be discouraged, I met the other girl the next day, had dinner and some good conversation, had 1 more date with her before I went home.We emailed each other and talked on the phone a few times.She ended up getting married to some guy from Norway.
      So my expirence is some of these girls are at least real bodies.Take it for what it is worth.Dont be fooled by AFA because they are from USA, though. Money is thier top motivation, and with the large data base that they have, it must be impossible for them to screen every girl.Raenman

... in response to Re: AFA, posted by raenman on Jan 14, 2004

"Dont be fooled by AFA because they are from USA, though. Money is thier top motivation."

Isn't profit the primary motivation for the vast majority of businesses?  I've always wondered why men in this expect something different from an agency.  They're businesses, they make money.  That's why they're in business.

... in response to Who's trying to fool men?, posted by Patrick on Jan 15, 2004

Your right Patrick- Businesses are in Busines to make money- I have been properly chastised.However, the point I was trying to make is not all Agencies care whether or not you make a connection,all they care about is the bottom line.And the bigger the Agency, the bigger the machine.I do know of one agency that I have used in the past(this is not a plug), A Volga Girl, that is run by a gentleman named Craig Rich, who I believe cares whether or not you have some success. I have used his agency to write some pretty nice girls.Any questions that I have had in the past were not only answerd by e-mail, but by him in person calling ME from his home. I purchased about 10 addresses from him.3 girls did not respond back and he promptly returned my money. I believe(and this only my opinion) that he truly cares about you and wants you to have success.Maybe this is because he has a RW, and wants everyone know the happiness he has found with his RW.I am sure that he likes to profitable, but dont beleive that is his driving force.
  I manage 3 restaraunts, and although I like to pay my bills, money is not the only reason I do this kind of work-I LOVE IT- otherwise who would want all the stress and B.S, and the odd 70 hour workweeks that I have?I too am in Business to make money, but there has to be some personal satisfaction.

... in response to Re: AFA, posted by raenman on Jan 14, 2004

I hope I was not taken out of context. I was just relating my exp. with AFA. I never said that they were a bad company,or that they were full of scammers, just the luck I had with it's girls in St.Pete.
   And yes, using girls from smaller agencys in the that area is nothing new nor is this a bad thing. I attended a tour w/ Europeon connections in 2000 and met some really serious(and not so serious)and sweet girls at thier socials that were from smaller agencies. I just did'nt meet the "one".
  As for a city with "Good Time Girls", St.Pete does have it's share, as I guess alot of the Larger cities in the FSU has, that is why I am now coresponding and meeting with a girl from "smalltown" city of Mariupole, Ukraine.
                  Raenman