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I must have missed the creation of that one.  Anyone care to fill me in?

... in response to "POB"???, posted by Patrick on Dec 18, 2002

Shouldn't this be POP??

... in response to "POB"???, posted by Patrick on Dec 18, 2002

nt

... in response to "POB"???, posted by Patrick on Dec 18, 2002

...The POB is the one of the greatest powers in the universe. It occurs primarily in the male species (lol, except in certain cases, I won't even go there), simultaneously affecting the brain, heart and reproductive system in various ways. Cognitive fucntions and reasoning seem to be most deeply affected.  Oddly enough, the female is the known carrier.

History is rife with examples of it's pull. Wars fought, Kingdoms fallen, countries conquered and civilizations altered because of it. Presidents, world leaders and common men alike succumb to it like helpless babies, altering their behavior in ways that defy explanation and boggle the mind. Princess Grace, Cleopatra, Helen Of Troy, Nefertiti, countless others had it and used it to their advantage. Even Monica Lewinski posesses it. (Although in Monica's case I'm completely confused.)

It's difficult to define and can encompass many attributes of it's female carrier. It can be as soft as a summer's sunset or as potent as a charging rhino. There is little defense and once it envelops you there is no escape. I personally classify it more a poison than a medical affliction and there exists no known antidote. Like many things it can be pleasant or it can drive the inflicted to madness. Treatment can be painful and often the only relief is, amazingly, a different carrier. Be afraid, be very afraid.

It's another example of God's sense of humor. Similar to composing us of 90% water then covering 4/5ths of the planet with stuff we can't drink. Similar to making us different colors, then choosing predominently black or white. There are dozens of examples of His humor all around us, The POB is simply another.

Ya gotta admit, He can be a pretty funny Guy at times.

... in response to The Power....., posted by LP on Dec 18, 2002

Sad but true...one of the many things that makes life interesting and exciting!

... in response to The Power....., posted by LP on Dec 18, 2002

I call him,  General Cornpone jr.
What is good, for the Cornpone family, is good for the USA.
The offshore banks are doing great and the dollar has started to dive.  

... in response to The Power....., posted by LP on Dec 18, 2002

POB???  LP.  Wwwweeellll,  not quite so much the physical power which the organ possesses---but more our genetic pre-disposal to endowing it with such power.  Such desire.  Lust & impregnation.  It is after all, the prime mechanism which has allowed the human species to proliferate so fecundly.

If men were not so hot for the POB...many of us would not be here.  Nor would our distant ancestors.

... in response to The Power....., posted by LP on Dec 18, 2002

And so can you LP, good post.

But you know something, it's really not the POB for me, because if sex is all I wanted, it wouldn't be too hard to go down to the casino's here and prey on girls who are here for a couple days, girls who are married and girls with boyfriends who they left behind at home are easy prey for a quick night. Las Vegas after all is party town, let your hair down, do anything and it's ok, nobody will know type of town, having sex is not that difficult here.

It was never the POB for me, but rather I need companionship, friendship, etc. After these things sex becomes appealing to me, but sex just for sex isn't all that appealing to me, just as I couldn't have sex with a girl without kissing her, (prostitute) nor can I have sex without being attracted to the personality of the girl.

So the POB isn't really what motivates me, but maybe the POB also encompasses the need for woman in general?

Yeah God can be a funny guy at times, but right now I’m too sick to laugh LP.

David

... in response to Re: The Power....., posted by John LV on Dec 18, 2002

...POB isn't just sex, it's everything. It can be only sexual desire but more often than not it's far more complex than that.

You've still got me all wrong. There is nothing inherently evil about FSU women, or any women for that matter. Yes, people in general suck, but thats lumping them all together. It's really the circumstances that decide how a guy should proceed in any given situation. This pursuit requires no special handling, but it's handling many of the men involved don't bother to follow. They choose instead to roll the dice a little more than I would. True, it's always gonna be a crap shoot but a guy can always do things to increase his odds. Most don't and neither did you. In addition you fail to consider your part in all this. And believe me, there is no doubt in my mind your personality had a part. Forgive me for treating your genius in such a lowly manner but allow me to explain.

There are only two possibilities: 1) You exhibit the same personality traits in person as you do on this board. 2) You don't. That leaves you being either a better person in the flesh or worse. I think it's safe to say if you're personality is as here, the failure of your marriage was not all her fault. What she did *after* she left is not the same as what drove her to do it. Cause and effect are not the same. Take some responsibility eh? To place all the blame on Natasha or all FSU women is faulty logic. The MOB game obviously shows that the circumstances surrounding it are such that success requires an approach you (and many it seems) do not bother to adopt. Of this group, those that didn't end up in your boat got lucky, thats all.

Amazingly, at least to me, this game isn't all that difficult. It all comes down to a little experience with, and some analysis of, the situation. Your objective is to find a decent women among those wishing to exploit you in various ways and levels. As an MOB guy you basically fall into one of two groups:

A) A social misfit with limited experience and perhaps some bad experiences under your belt to sour you on the local talent.

B) A normal guy with enough perspective to believe something in this pursuit is valuable enough to make it worth all the trouble. It's this "trouble" that Group "A" guys want to circumvent, thats what often gets them in the end. It got you Davey, it's simply common sense. Remember, everyone here predicited the demise of your marriage long before it happened. Everyone but you. Maybe you need to look very closely at that point.

So, if you fall into "A" you've got bigger problems than these girls will solve. Nevertheless, you can make a go of it if you use your head. But thats often more difficult for "A" guys to do and that puts them farther behind group "B". Both groups need to do something very simple. They need to treat these realtions as normal, albeit the long distance. It's as simple as that. No different than dating the local talent except it takes more time. During the intial phase you blow off the ones who don't measure up. How do you know? Jeez, it's pretty simple as long as you listen to the Little Man inside. When you find one who has promise you develop it by time spent together and be prepared to walk away if needed. I spent almost 1 year before I selected a woman and 1 year developing it Anyone who hasn't the patience or money to devote to this both before and *after* selecting one shouldn't come crying when it explodes. If it takes you a few years of visiting a bunch of women and having no luck, thats the way it goes. That time does not count!

The "there is no right way to do this, do what works for you" comments are hysterical. There *is* a right and wrong way to do it, or at least enormously different ways to manage the risk. And doing anything right takes time and effort. You didn't bother to put that time and effort in *before* you married, you choose to cheat and try to put it in after. Coupled with your personality, me thinks you were doomed from the git go.

As you point out, some of these chicks are bad apples and the economic situation over there adds to the mix. Hell, many variables add to the equation. So what?? It only means a guy must do what ever it takes to address those variables. More variables mean a more complex solution must  be formulated. Why is that so difficult to understand? Why is it so difficult for many men to immplement? You know why. And the others who rushed it know also. You wanna play Russian Roulette with your heart, thats fine. You're the one rollin the dice, the one takin the chance. But don't whine when it goes sour, don't blame the participants, the system, or anyone else if you didn't listen to the Little Man we all have living inside of us. As I've said before, the Little Man knows all. He's the only voice thats capable of being heard above the POB and like many, you choose to ignore him. That and failing to simply examine this entire endeavor as a problem to be solved in a manner that would not tax even a "genius" as yourself.

As Mike says, you're pretty bent right now. Your attitude is understandable, even if very flawed. But don't blame everyone else, it's you who went about this the way you saw fit. The way you knew inside wasn't quite right to begin with. I'd bet this "jealous loser's" next paycheck on it.

My preaching is not meant to inform anyone of the pitfalls involved, they already know them. You knew them also. And it's not meant to demean the participants, including the women. It's simply meant to make them think about treating this no differently than a myriad of other problems in life they routinely have *more* than enough smarts to solve. If I gave the vast majority of MOB guys some other problem, even a more complex one, and suggested they apply the same methology and logic many use in solving this one, they would think I was a total idiot.

And ya know what? They'd be right.

... in response to You don't listen Davey....., posted by LP on Dec 18, 2002

LP,
You otta teach the class "MOB game", how to play it and not it play you.  LOL.  I'd like to emphisise the time necessarily spent *after* you meet "the one."  Most of what is posted here is on how to weed through the websites, run ads and just how many RW you must interview before making a selection.  Too little is said about the development of the reltionship after finding a woman and before marrying her.  Many foolishly think that because they had superior "interview" skills that the game is won upon selecting the prize contestant at their "casting call."  I say B.S.  That is when the real challenge begins.  Thank God that processing a K-1 does take as long as it does, because if it weren't for that time, I swear most guys wouldn't know anything about their wives.
KenC

... in response to Another good one, posted by KenC on Dec 19, 2002

mentioned this a long time ago.  How true.  Many here are trying to reach the "holy grail" of K-1 and marriage.  As if that is the top of the mountain.  And expending alot of time, energy and money to reach that point.  However,  it is only when married that--- the real work really will begin and that, in due time, a man will find out the wisdom in his selection.

... in response to I think Ken, you, posted by tim360z on Dec 19, 2002

Tim,
It is a three step process in my mind. #1 Finding a woman that is "potentially" a lifetime mate. #2 Making sure she IS the one for you.  #3 Getting married and continuing the development of a strong relationship.  
-
Much is said here about #1.  What methods, connections an agencies to use in order to find the best candidates.  Virtually nothing is said about #2 and the guys jump right into marriage without much consideration in this area.  No one wants to "cut bait" and start over again.  It is a drag and they do not want to admit that they may have made a mistake in their orignial choice.  The ironic thing about this is that ths is the area that couples spend most of their time in an AM/AW relationship.  The "courting phase" is microwaved into a one or two weeks (if not days in some cases).  I'd like a dollar for every AW I dated that was "the one" (at least in my own mind) that turned into another disappointment after 6 months.  LOL.  
-
Of course, most men are astounded when they actually enter step #3 which is when the real work begins.  Oh and by the way, if steps #1 and #2 are done correctly, #3 lasts the rest of your life!
KenC

... in response to Re: I think Ken, you, posted by KenC on Dec 19, 2002

...for every AW I dated that was "the one" (at least in my own mind) that turned into another disappointment after 6 months."

Bravo Ken, Bravo. I'd only change "A/W" to *any* woman. So simple, so easy to understand, and such a common experience among men. When applied to the MOB process this single piece of simple wisdom takes on an enormous meaning. In fact, it may be the single greatest defense one has against the "The Power".

Regardless of what they think at the moment, every new relationship is unstable due to the lack of knowledge the participants possess about each other. It's the entire crux of the MOB issue, the nucleus of almost every point I've made, and the basis for the perceptions and resulting opinions of those on the outside looking in. It's also one of the greatest lessons a man can learn in dealing with women in general.

The strange thing is that many men fully understand this but simply choose to ignore it. Amazing.

... in response to " I'd like a dollar..... , posted by LP on Dec 19, 2002

LP,
EVERY new relationship is exciting.  That is why one begins the relationship.  But it is how that relationship stands up over time that is important.  Will it stay good for a week? a month? a few months? a year? No one knows until you spend the time together.  In my experience, a woman can maintain a charade for quite a while, but even the most motivated actresses cannot keep it up past 6 months.  The key word here is "motivated".  And just at is that motivation?  Love? Visa? Marriage? Hmmmm.
-
You have brought the phrase "POB" here and it is important for guys to understand it.  They also have to understand the powers that are in heir own arsenal.  Initially, men have the "Power of the Visa" at their disposal.  Although this is temporary and usually only good for 90 days, it is important not to give this power up to the first pretty girl you meet.  The second power is much more MUCH more forceful and is even effective with AW.  You have it and they want it.  Call it the "Power of Matrimony".  But you had better damn well use it wisely because it is a one shot deal! (Reloading this weapon is a motherf--ker)  Why on earth would a guy shoot his wad (give up both POV and POM) within a few days/weeks/months of meeting a stranger is beyond me.
KenC

... in response to Re: I think Ken, you, posted by KenC on Dec 19, 2002

Ken, please don't be mad at me. I'm trying to such this up, I really am, it's being betrayed by Natasha that I cannot get over, having a relationship not work out is one thing, having your heart broken is bad enough, but to be lied to, deceived on a grand scale, and to give everything you have into the relationship, only to be betrayed in the worse possible way is almost incomprehensible to me that someone, anyone on this planet is capable of doing. And to think that this girl who I gave everything to could possibly do this to me, it's just not something I as of yet can accept.

I'm really not trying to suggest that RW are bad, I don't know enough of them to make that assessment, but my problem is with the process itself. Plus I'm very resentful that this RW Natasha could be the kind of person she has turned out to be, no AW has ever been like that to me. Is that just a coincidence? Perhaps it is, I don't know, but this relationship has cost me so much in the way of time, money, and emotional hurt that all I can see is how much it wasn't worth it to me, I can easily get an AW, that is not much of a problem for me.

I realize that many people are successful at this venture, including yourself, but do you want to know the truth in what I see between who is successful and who isn't?

Guys who have above average in money, who can give these RW an easy life, who own their own homes, who don't have to struggle at all, and who provide these girls with a lot of security.

That's fine, but that should also be spoken of, of course that is also true with AW as well, but for a guy like myself it is far easier and safer to just date local AW, that way when it doesn't work out, I don't have 30K invested over 2.5 years into it, and if things don't work out, it probably wouldn't last any longer than 6 months.

I took a huge gamble, and I lost big. Those numbers may not mean anything to you, but they are a lot to me, how am I going to rebuild my credit? It's been destroyed now, all because I married a lazy sloppy RW who acted as if she were the nicest person in the world, but only the opposite is the truth, she is a freak with two manly tattoos, who drinks Jack Daniels straight, (disgusting) who drops food all over the house, etc etc etc.

She turned out to be the worst girl I've ever known let alone gone out with. Is it just a coincidence that she is Russian? Perhaps it is, perhaps I just picked the absolute wrong girl from my lack of being able to assess her, maybe I have nobody to blame but myself, but you know what Ken, I don't agree with that. Because the fact of the matter is, people like Natasha should not exist in this world, and the fact that they do only goes to show how messed up this world is.

This world is filled with evil everywhere, people who are jealous, people who are greedy, people who are selfish, people who are cruel, people who murder, people who have sex with little children, people who don't care about other people, this world is about money and power, this world is about making money no matter what the cost, this world is about trying to find a woman in a world where few good woman exist. And if you don't believe that, then you only have to look as far back as your own relationships. And since you went for 25 years with one and it failed miserably, what makes you think that your present relationship will work out?

What makes you think that in two years, you yourself won't be in my shoes? I'm sorry but I've seen so many woman in my lifetime who will cheat on men, turn on men, lie to men that I cannot be deceived by them any longer, I know who and what woman are, I know the cold hard truth about them, and I feel sorry for all of us men because no matter what, we are all screwed in the long term.

Don't get me wrong Ken, I'm not saying there is anything wrong with Lena in any way whatsoever, and I hope that you two stay together and be very happy with each other, all I'm saying is that if you look at the bigger picture, relationships just fail time and time again, and in my generation, this is all the more true.

And the idea that over in Russia girls are somehow any different is a pharse in my opinion, they are only better at acting, using their femininity to get what they want.

I sincerely wish you and everyone else on this board the best of luck with your happiness in your relationships, this world is very hard and some are better at dealing with it than others, some people belong in this world and some don't, I don't and never have I'm afraid.

Ken, I'm sorry I'm not man enough for you, but this is the hardest thing I've ever had to deal with, and I'm not sure I'm going to make it, so with that in mind, please let me make a suggestion to anyone considering this venture.

BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL, this venture is not for the weak at heart, if your tuff, if your mean, if you can assess a woman and cut her off like it were nothing, then maybe you can do well.

But if your nice like I am, and want to believe people are telling the truth, than you may end up like me. Nice guys do indeed finish last, if you want to succeed in this world you must lie, you must be cold, you must be selfish, and you must outsmart others in order to succeed. Being a good person and succeeding in this world do not go hand in hand with each other.

Sorry, but that is the cold hard truth.

David

... in response to Re: I think Ken, you, posted by KenC on Dec 19, 2002

part compared to #2 and #3. It is addressed very frequently on this board.  But,  if very good judgement isn't made in #2,  then #3 will be a disaster.  

I think, due to time constraints and other factors in this very long distance pursuit, that step #2 is a rushed and hurried affair.  For many,  though somewhat unaware, it becomes a "blind leap" off the precipice into #3.

In step #2 very little real time is spent together,  a "courting" process whereby each person really begins to know the other.  I don't think, 1 week or 5 weeks or 4 months may really be enough for either person to glean very much about their supposed lifetime partner.  Seems like a roll of the roulette,  with everything bet on one #.  With the odds far against you.

I wonder Ken?  For step # 2???  What was your method?  Thanks, Tim

... in response to Step # 1 is the easy, posted by tim360z on Dec 19, 2002

Tim,
I never proposed marriage until I was ready to give up POM. (See post above to LP)  I didn't bring Lena here on a K-1, but a student visa.  She could have stayed here as long as she was attending classes.  She was free to go back and forth because it is a multiple entry visa.  I didn't feel the government should have a say as to when we were ready to marry.  There was no pressure, no clock ticking on the wall pushing for us to get married.  Just two people doing what came NATURALLY.
KenC

... in response to You don't listen Davey....., posted by LP on Dec 18, 2002

What do I say LP?

Look, I realize what you're saying, I really do. But try to understand this ok? Natasha is an expert at lying, better than anybody I've ever seen. Now girls in general can lie very well, but in my past relationships, it doesn't take long to figure this out. But Natasha has skills far beyond any girl I've ever dated, I always said to myself, "if she is just playing a game with me, she is the best actress I've ever seen".

My point is that this girl is good, she was able to talk with me on the phone convincing me of how sweet she was, how smart she was, etc. Like an idiot I fell in love with her, I just had thought I had found such a quality girl, I didn't feel it necessary to find another.

Ok, in retrospect I realize there were some warning signs that I quickly shrugged off, and obviously I should not have.

1. The flies in her room.
2. Two very large tatoos, one dragon and one other ugly one.
3. Drinking Jack Daniels straight.
4. Didn't have a job.
5. Would not tell me about her family, her mom, etc.
6. Never asking enough questions, as if nothing mattered to her.
7. Once here, never cleaning, being far too messy.
8. Never having anything to do with the relationship, thinking that everything is up to the man, and when I say everything, I mean everything, even watering the plants.

Yeah there were some warning signs that I didn't want to pay attention to, and I guess at some level that is my fault. But I didn't know it was suppossed to be so hard, now I guess I do.

I could do it over again and do much better this time I think, it's just that it will cost another year of my time and 20K from start to finish including getting her here for awhile, not including car, dental, insurance, clothes, haircutts with highlight, makup, (you know, 40-60 dollar stuff at Macy's) and since it will be some time before she will be able to work, include food, time, teaching her so many things, etc etc, you are so right when you mentioned having enough money to do this right.

Hmmm, the girls who come to Vegas for the weekend are starting to sound better and better. Far easier, much more convienant, with a whole lot less risk. Either that or I move to Prague for 6 months or so and see if I can find a nice girl wanting to come back with me to the USA, or maybe I'll just stay there.

One thing is for certain LP, I won't make the same mistakes I made this last time, maybe a hundred different ones, but not the same ones. Next time I'll get to know a few girls to get some perspective.

I'm glad things are going well for you LP, take care.

David

... in response to Re: You don't listen Davey....., posted by John LV on Dec 19, 2002

...I agree with Charles, you be starting to make sense now.

There were some glaring issues presented to you that you simply choose to ignore. Once again, the "it'll be fine" attitude took over. The reluctance to flush your investment can be a potent one but you must if the signs are there.

While my refusal to marry for so many years has spared me the common financially destruction, I too bare a few emotional scars from my exploits. You'll get over it, just like the rest of us. I know it's difficult to belive now but with time the scars will become surprisingly small and you can do much to help them heal quicker.

What you take away from this is far more important than what she's taken from you. In fact, I'd say you got a bargain. The long end of the stick. I know that sounds crazy now but trust me, your future will be better for it if you just don't let it warp your perspective.  As Ken says, considering how you ignored the signs, you got off real easy.

I'm suggesting you give up this ghost, the board has heard enough. Come back in awhile and tell us what happened but in the meantime, skip the running commentary. If you're going to tell me anything, I'd rather hear the practical side of it than the emotional side. We all know the pain, it was no different for each of us.

... in response to The light comes on...., posted by LP on Dec 19, 2002

Ok, upon further reflection, I can see now that I have nobody to blame but myself for getting into this mess in the first place.

Example: In order to go see Natasha for the first time, I sold my car and belongings and moved back to CA from FL to work in San Diego, but first I would go meet with Natasha.

This was a fairly big sacrifice, but we had talked with each other everyday for 3 months, for hours each day. I spent a minimum of 1000 per month on phone bills with her. She was the sweetest girl I had ever spoken with, and talking with her was intoxicating, she seemed so smart, so sweet, and very feminine.

At this point of talking with her two hours each day, and more than one time of 4 hours a day, I completely fell for her. It didn't even matter what she looked like, I would accept her no matter what because of what a sweet woman she was.

Then we met at the airport, it took me a grueling 24 hours to finally get there and see her, and usually a person doesn't look there best after 24 hours of being on a plane. Anyway I get to Prague and I hate to say it, I was in culture shock, and didn't handle it all that well.

We went back to her apartment, and we had decided earlier that I would stay with her for 3 weeks. Oh man, that was my first huge mistake other than falling in love over the phone. So there we are, together in person after only knowing each other over the phone, we had known each other so well from talking on the phone so much, or did we?

Although we had done so well over the phone, talking about everything, getting to know each other, playing, making jokes, etc etc, we/I thought we knew each other.

On more than one occassion, I noticed she would get angry if she didn't get what she wanted. She seemed very selfish to me, and I should have known right then and there who she was, but I didn't want to see it, I was still living the fantasy and I didn't want it to be over yet :-)

As a matter of fact, things got so bad between us, we didn't get along at all, she turn into a very different person than who she was on the phone, I didn't like her at all, so much so I tried to leave after only staying for about 7 days, only I couldn't get a flight out of Prague to go home, so I had to wait another 7 days before I could leave, so I was trapped with this chick.

I almost moved out many times, but we managed not to fight much, mostly because I just shut up, just waiting till I get onto the plane to come home again.

We never did get along the whole time, and at the same time, we did do some things together.

But when we parted, we both were thinking this would be our last meeting. But when I got home, I wondered if I was at fault for my trip? If I could do things better next time, or if Natasha and I were really so bad for each other?

We kept talking on the phone, and on the phone we seemed to get along so well, we could talk with each other a lot. It took me months to build a relationship back up again, and this time we thought we could be much better, since we understood each other better this time. So I went to see her in Prague again for New Years, and I stayed at my own flat. We got along great, and her mother was there this time. We had alot of fun together, and we thought things would be good for the both of us.

I came home, she got her paperwork together, and I filed the forms, 6 months later she arrived in San Diego. We waited 3 weeks, got married, and soon after things started going wrong.

What did I do wrong? Everything I guess, we were never right for each other from the beginning, and I should have realized this from the beginning. My story is the perfect example of what not to do, I hope it helps somebody else who may be stupid like me.

David

... in response to The light comes on...., posted by LP on Dec 19, 2002

It is very true, we all have known the pain,
I usually say, that,  my wrinkles are all paid for and in
hard cold cash.
Luckily, kept some of the cash, to start all over again.

... in response to The light comes on...., posted by LP on Dec 19, 2002

I will go away if that is what you want, but I would like to talk about it, I think it helps me. What do you mean when you say "practical" side of it?

I'll tell you anything, I realize you have more experience than me and I'm looking for insight, understanding, and help to get there.

David

... in response to Re: The light comes on...., posted by John LV on Dec 19, 2002

...for me, personally, if you're going to stay here:

1) Quit yer whining. We understand you hurt but there's little we can do to ease your pain. Life's lessons aren't free and it's your time to pay, simple as that.

2) Consider (or take) the advice offered you and be damn grateful for it. 1) Get a lawyer. 2) Talk to a professional therapiss (Thats's no spelling error, sorry Oscar ;-)

3) Continue to foster a thoughtful and intropsective nature, your good side if you will. Your bad side is *so* bad, nothing remotely good will ever come of it. It's time to take Globetrotter's advice. If you like what you see in the mirror, ask others what *they* see. You'll be surprised. Understand, very few people can be objective about themselves.

4) Look to the future and know that your time will come. As long as you focus only on the lessons learned and not the cause of them, your time will come.

5) Life isn't finished beatin on you yet, be prepared for future crap you can't control and just deal with it. As the man said: Learn to suck it up.

6) By practical, I mean things like where are you now? Where is she now? Whats happening? Even then, that may not interest some here. But skip the emotional stuff, just the facts.

7) Read number 3 several more times. Print it out and put it on your bathroom mirror where you can look at it every day. lol, or post it over the toilet.

Otherwise throw out that PC, go out into the desert, and don't come back.

... in response to Re: The light comes on...., posted by John LV on Dec 19, 2002

Talking about it was what was offered to you, but you seem to like to insult everyone.  Plus, this is what a counselor/therapist would do for you.  Why one would come on bended knee, then bite the hands that feed you because it is not what you want to hear, is beyond me.

Anyone can change parts of their behavior.  One can quit drinking, smoking, cursing, etc.  What is difficult or impossible to change is your character traits as that is who you are.  A good place to start is to look in the mirror.  If you like what you see, and like what you get from who you are, keep doing what you're doing.  If not, get to work.

... in response to Re: You don't listen Davey....., posted by John LV on Dec 19, 2002

David, in spite of your statements to the contrary, you really didn't listen to any sound advice that was available here and elsewhere in the pursuit of a relationship, particularly with an RW.  To your credit, your last post is the first of your hundreds that finally recognizes and lists some of the many brain farts that your superior intellect failed to correct and recognize during your courtship and marriage.  Could this have been due to the POB?-after all, you do describe her as manipulative.  We'll never know and neither you nor the Board should care at this point!  But what you should do now is list what YOU did to cause some of your problems, as there is little doubt that there is plenty of blame to go around in this failed marriage.  The biggest thing I see is your failure to establish mutual communication and understanding.  There is a great deal of pain now, but, like KenC, I have been to the rodeo before, as have others, and life goes on.  THIS TIME, LISTEN to the advice you are getting, AND MOVE ON.

... in response to You don't listen Davey....., posted by LP on Dec 18, 2002

desire is quite explainable-the sustaining of a species. Through sex and violence we procreate and the strong surive. As we develop new ways to procreate, sex will become less desireable and we will evolve into getting our jollies other ways. I see all thing in the universe as perfect. We are all exactly where we should be-in lieu of what actions we have taken. Now that is GOD!!!
We have been give all things in the universe at our fingertips-what better gift from the great Jester? If you want to really screw some people up, give them what they want!!! That is what happens to the FSU seekers-they get exactly what they ask for...
Joe
The POB is not as interesting to me as a set of nice legs and nice breast though. I am into the intellectual and caressing stage of life.

... in response to "POB"???, posted by Patrick on Dec 18, 2002


http://www.planet-love.com/wwwboard/search/searchdisplay.php?page=russian&archive=000130&id=57181

... in response to "POB"???, posted by Patrick on Dec 18, 2002

.

... in response to "POB"???, posted by Patrick on Dec 18, 2002

I don't know the context of your question but I would say "Place of birth"

... in response to Re: "POB"???, posted by Bubba on Dec 18, 2002

yeah, that's it.

... in response to Re: "POB"???, posted by Bubba on Dec 18, 2002

Similar location so to speak