Planet-Love.com Searchable Archives

It's Sunday morning for me at 6:15, last night Natasha came by the apartment, she offered a proposition to me.

She said that she wants to get her car back, the 2002 Mitsubishi Eclipse I had bought for her. If I will give her car back, she will move back into the apartment, she will pay half the rent, she will pay for the car, she will pay for the insurance, and she will help to pay off some of our bills we have. But we must live together as roomates, her in one room and me in another, and I must let her have her own life, where she is free to go out with other guys.

I have to admit, being the fool that I am, I almost considered it, but now I need to hear what some of you more experienced guys would say about this?

Please tell me what I need to do is pack my stuff, go get another apartment on Monday, have movers move my things into a new apartment, and let my credit go bad with all the bills.

Is that what I should do? To be honest, I'm just not sure what I should do here, and I need a little advice. If I try to stay here at this apartment, all of her books and many of her things are still here, even if I can get them out of here, she may still keep coming around, especially if she falls on her face which will probably be the case and come crawling back to me a month or two from now.

Should I just pack my things and move out immediately?

Thanks in advance,

David

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

DavidSD,

Welcome back. You would have remembered me as Greg or Greg123 back then. You might remember me because I was about your only supporter back then, even though I did agree with many that some of your comments were kind of strange.

First of all, I am sorry to hear about your dilemma. I do have a post that is in response to your first mention of this story below.  

I have not read any of your comments or responses to questions yet so, what I may ask may be redundant and, if so I apologize.

Obviously, the lady you got involved with is a VERY dysfunctional person. David, do you think that she had the right intentions in marrying you? I ask this because when a woman is in love she will do every thing she can to show you such. She basically turned you into a provider and nothing else almost. This says to me, getting here may have been her only motive. What do you think?

Greg

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

......doormat? Sounds like she wants to put you in a little box she designed for her convenience. Tell her that if you get laid 5 times a week, with enthusiasm, you might think about it. Then it would work for both your conveniences.

Steve

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

Heed the advice given to you by Wizard below in his response titled "IMHO" to your post entitled "Please help me".

The longer you delay implementing his very sound and wise advice the worse it is going to be for you.

Good luck, and don't forget to bring it to the Lord in prayer.

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

You need to consult with an attorney and file for divorce. Move if you can. If you agree to this "arrangement" she has proposed, then you will only be setting yourself up for additional heartache and possibly worse! Be honest, could you handle laying in bed listening to her go at with another man in the other room? Somehow I doubt it! Or are you going to allow her to set you up for a domestic abuse charge? If she will do anything to stay in this country, then she will cry wolf! Trust me on this one, been there, done that! My situation is only slightly different than yours. The only real difference is the time...1.5 years for you and a couple of months for me. You cannot be emotional regarding these kinds of matters, that's why you need an attorney ASAP. Advise INS of the divorce proceedings immediately. I don't know how one goes about notifying INS yet. You may need to consult with an immigration attorney as well in order to remove the AOS burden. It may seem expensive now, but if you compare it with 10 years of financial responsibility for her, it's relatively cheap. Not to downplay the expieriences of the board members, but the only advice you need is that of your attorney!

P.S. Regarding your earlier post about women in general...it's not true at all. You were just unfortunate enough to find a bad one...most are nothing like what you describe. See an attorney and correct your current problem. Take a break and take care of yourself. Then find the right woman for you. Best of luck!!!

... in response to Re: Update: Need advice, posted by Travis on Dec 1, 2002

Thank you my friend, and the best of luck to you as well. I didn't realize it would be so hard to find a nice girl for one's self? I sort of perplexed that it has turned out to be so difficult?

I guess that's life?

Thanks again and take care.

David

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

.............. ever go to Minsk, Belarus, in your search for a FSU woman?

Best of luck
John

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I also don't know why people don't believe you. These relationships, I think, are much more difficult (but worth it if you find a good one) than the much less complicated domestic relationships. My friend who is a lady who is a translator and facilitator of many FSU lady relationships with many Western men says the kind of breakup you describe is VERY COMMON!!! So all of you who have been ganging up on David think you are totally immune to losing it when your hot babe gets over here and starts attracting attention like a Monster Mag, you are all delusional. Many, she tells me with first hand knowledge, can't handle it. They become control freaks. They yell at her. They may try to control her movements (sounds like David, you didn't do this-- you gave her wheels). They become mentally unglued. She can't even smile at men, even return a smile to a wrinkled old toothless prune that smiles at her. You don't know if you can handle it until it happens. Ten days in Kiev or Moscow and a followup week in Turkey don't count.

I think some people have given you excellent advice. LP for example and some others mentioned getting a lawyer and filing for divorce immediately. (RW gave some good food for thought.) Also, you MUST never be alone with her again. I say this because she might indeed claim abuse one of these times after being alone with you. Especially once her back is against the wall. I believe you may have written that she hit you. In that case ask your lawyer about filing something against her for this. You said she's networked with her friends on how to play you. If you claim abuse before she does, her possible/likely (?) claim against you, I imagine, would be weakened.

What I have new to add (unless I missed it before) is that I would offer her a deal. You tell her she has disgraced you as a wife and disgraced herself. If she wants another guy, that's cool-- but she's got to do it the right way. She goes back home and the bartender boy (or whoever) does the paperwork. Assure her she will be able to come back (although you may take steps otherwise). You say you don't want to control her-- she is free to live her life and be with whoever she wants EXCEPT YOU! Resist the temptation to yell  and be nasty to her over the phone or in company with your lawyer. You offer to buy her a plane ticket. When you confirm her presence in her country, you tell you'll give her a thousand dollars. You tell her it's this or nothing-- you and your lawyer are going to cut her off and take all her possessions. You tell her you KNOW she can't survive in this country without you, and she's blown all of her chances. (Instead of seeing yourself as a victim to whom this might happen, aggressively threaten her with losing everything.) If you know what buttons to push, lie to her as she did you, pull them all to scare her to take your offer. Put the fear of Jesus in her, if you know how. If you have a good lawyer, he or she will do this, too. Give her a deadline-- a few weeks to a month. This letter could come from the lawyer. If she takes the offer, don't send her the money, so she won't be able to come back. Then put her on scammer sites.

My only comment on the personality thing is that you mentioned that you don't have friends and you are alone in life. You know that an even greater challenge than this mess with this trailer trash is your battle with yourself. You have to lighten up on the extreme intellectualism and worship of the mental life if you don't want to be alone your entire life (I taught a few years at Harvard, so I do know what I am talking about). It's a lonely deadend. Work on toning down the things that put people off (see threads below-- the Taliban-like Christian self-righteousness and proclaiming your genius-- it's very unattractive). Work on being balanced. Consider setting new priorities. What's more important: Quantum mechanics or friends? What works better: Bragging or being humble? Making real friends with people is something you must do. Not online, but wherever you are now. And wherever you go. Be patient with yourself and others. Don't even think about marriage until you have made a few guy friends and dated some more women in your area. Have real, face-to-face relationships. Go to Mensa meetings or wherever to meet people.

You ARE smart and I bet if you read some good self-help books, there would be no need for seeing a counselor. Check out the books by Dr. Paul Hauck. He's one of the best kept secrets, IMHO. A web search will work. He is eminently qualified (he's not a pop psych guy), has written many books, and the books are very short and right to the point. You'll "get" it immediately, I think.

Finally, it's "haphazardly," not "half hazardly." : ]

... in response to Re: Update: Need advice, posted by Scaught on Dec 1, 2002

I'm placing my words of wisdom via how he talks to other people on a different message board.  You really should take a moment a go read the garbage this guy writes and posts.

So true what your saying also, when relationships go sour the crap really does hit the fan.

I think alot can be said how you project yourself to the lady, if you buying her and family everything while over there and returns to live a humble life, well, your setting yourself up.

Just like these guys that go get women 20 years younger than they are... Granted some of these ladies are mature enough carry themselves well and the guys do the same.

But the ones that don't have their feet firmly planted on the ground are the ones that this kind of destructive relationship falls victim to.

Clearly, David is in this lot of men.

Who didn't take their time on trying to find the right  lady, but instead ran and jumped into marriage with the first one that came along..

Me, personally, I might be married in 3 or 4 years from now.  I'm not in any hurry.  But, one never knows when the right one will be around the next corner.

What works for me, may not work for you or vice versea.

... in response to Re: Nobody is gang up on this guy, posted by wsbill on Dec 1, 2002

You surprise me in that I agree with you, you are right about that, use me as a good example of what not to do, my own ego and proudness made me fall, and so I have fallen, ouch.

But like others have said here, this will only make me a stronger person, and it has made me more humble too.

I do not mind in you or anyone else using my experience as the exact thing not to do, you are right, I went for the first one, I didn't pay attention to the signs, I was too needy and lonely.

But the good news is I'm growing up, I may be a late bloomer in that its taken 35 years, but its better late than never.

Tell everyone never to do what I have done, or they may be paying the price just like I am.

David

... in response to Re: Update: Need advice, posted by Scaught on Dec 1, 2002

Thanks, I will take everything you have said into consideration. Language was never one of my strong suits :-)

And just out of curiousity, I'll check out Haucks books, just to see what he is all about.

Thanks again.

... in response to Re: Re: Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

n/t

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

Sugar Ray Robinson would say,"Keep your hands up, and your ass off the floor."

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

David, BASED ON WHAT YOU HAVE SAID, I certainly concur with the prevailing sentiment that you should reject her proposal, as well as proceed with the divorce and INS action.  As noted in a recent post, the I-864 could be financially disastrous for you, particularly given her work history that you desribed.  She is playing you for the car and, even if her proposal is legit, I would be concerned having a woman in my home that I supported who is, at my expense, banging the bartending school.  With your occasionally mild episodes of anger, this could be explosive.  However, I am curious as to how you could have had this woman with you for 1.5 years when just over a year ago you wrote me requesting K-1 information.  Go figure.

... in response to Questions, posted by Charles on Dec 1, 2002

...I'm not taking sides in this but I'll say a few things:

1) David is really who he says, at least as far as his story about living in Orlando and San Diego. Those of us who've been around here for a long time have dealt with him before and I can assure you, it's the same guy. I know for sure many things about him and his history in the MOB scene.

2) His story is real, at least as it pertains to his filing a K1, having an interview in May of 2001 (the 14th according to the info I have) and bringing to the US a woman named Natasha shortly thereafter. It's also true that he's been having ongoing problems with this relationship for some time. I know this to be the absolute truth. From that point forward, I know nothing for sure. Thats where Ken comes in, he's picked it up from there. I don't know if any of this recent stuff is true but knowing what I do, I would not be surprised. It all comes down to if you trust Ken's judgement in trusting David.

David, I'll point out a few things to you. First, see how people respond when you control yourself? Remember this in the future. Second, Let her come back? Don't be a fool.  Whose name is the car in? If it's her's, give it back. It'll hurt her more to lose it from repossesion and you'll be protected. If it's in your name, keep it. In dealing with this situation always consider the legal issues and protectinging yourself first and do *nothing* based on emotion. You need a lawyer, asap.

Seek legal help and file for a divorce immediately. He/she will use an investigator to gather evidence of her unfaithfullness. Her being unfaithful can be a blessing in disguise at a later time. Seperate your assets immedidately, especially those you had before the marriage. (I believe Nevada is a CP state but I'm not sure.) Report her to the INS if she doesn't have a green card. It'll likely be pissing in the wind but it costs nothing and won't hurt.

Do not assault, confront, stalk, or otherwise give her any oppurtunity to use the penal code against you, and leave her "friends" alone. Distance yourself, break all contact with her. Stay in your apartment if you can and have her leave, otherwise bug out and let her have it. If she can't afford it, she'll lose anyway. Do all these things as soon as you can but your attorney's advice takes precedence over anything said on this board.

Lastly, get help for your disorder. This is a golden oppurtunity to stop the cycle. There is a reason you have no friends and your future relationships will not prevail unless you treat the underlying cause of why you alienate those around you. Think hard about this. Your next woman will be different but if you're not, it'll go boom.

And if on the slim chance you are fabricating all this, you will only suffer down the road. In a way, this entire experience could be the best thing that ever happened to you. Don't blow this chance.

... in response to Fwiw...., posted by LP on Dec 1, 2002

See...that wasn't so tough.  A good post with good advice to help the guy who appears to be down.  Help when possible, come "gunnung" when necessary.

... in response to Re: Fwiw...., posted by Globetrotter on Dec 1, 2002

...found it tough, I only find it deserving. You need to understand the history here to understand why some need advice and why some are morons who'll never take any. Many guys wouldn't learn if they were slapped upside the head. This guy just might benefit beyond his present situation so I'll take the time to tell him what I think.

But only once or twice because, like anyone else, I've got my own crosses to bear.

... in response to Fwiw...., posted by LP on Dec 1, 2002

Thanks LP, but believe me, I'm not lying about any of this, I wish I were, but I'm not, its the sad truth I'm afraid. Why would I lie and make myself look like a fool anyway?

The car LP is in both our names, so as I understand it, I have just as much right to the car as she does? She already called the police on me and apparently told them I stole HER car, but the car is in both our names.

I can take it within the law correct?

... in response to Re: Fwiw...., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

...Whose name is the name under? Is that joint also? Keep the car, or sell it to afford you legal consul. Or give it back, to her. Do what your lawyers says. Remember, everything you do from here on will be judged down the road. Remember that everytime you make a decision.

Fwiw, I don't think you're lying. I know too much about you. I took a dim view of the threats you made against me in the past and way back then decided to learn something about you in case it was needed. Lucky for you, it wasn't. You see David, the one thing I learned from my previous career as an LEO was that System kicks ass better than anyone. It can really screw up one's life. While the government may be inefficent, the legal system is like the Terminator. Once it comes after you, once you're caught in The Machine, it never forgets and will never, ever stop until it gets you. With the advent of modern information technology there are no almost cracks for someone to fall through.

You must always remember this. The System can be a powerful friend if you use it correctly, or it can be an enemy that'll eat you alive. Although I'm speaking mainly of the criminal justice system, the civil system is nothing to be trifled with either. Use it to your advantage now. Put the emotions aside and stop worrying about such pissy things as the car or what you should do on your own. There is *no* saving this marriage, that should have been obvious to you long ago. See an attorney asap and do exactly what he tells you because he knows the system, he knows what kind of foe it can be. You haven't a clue and, like most people, will make several mistakes you'll regret later if you wing it now.

This *will* pass, other's have suffered through it and survived. I know it's difficult but you need to to focus on your future *now* to insure you don't repeat this experience. And that includes a serious examination of your role in this little adventure because I for one, having witnessed your behavior in the past, do not believe it's all her fault. That may be a tough thing for you to swallow right now but I'm positive them be the facts. If you recall, many people foresaw this experience based solely on your personality. I'm not gonna rub your face in it but you need to consider everything for the sake of your future. Even though it takes two to tango, in general if do as you've always done you'll always get the same results. This simple life lesson is amazingly difficult for many people to learn.

I'm sorry for your pain now that it's plain to me you have issues not related to this experience that you're perhaps unable to control. Focus on the longterm, but remember that this will pass and you *will* survive it. You are not alone, I think many of the men involved in MOB stand a good chance of being eaten alive because of their lifestyle and lack of interpersonal relationships skills. It's ironic they should be the last people to be involved in this endeavor but thats why they need to excericse more restraint and caution.

Amazingly, most don't. They chose to let their emotions rule their intellect and often pay the price. You were already behind the curve and now it's time to learn from it. I shall leave you with that advice, take it for what you feel it's worth.

Good luck...

... in response to Well...., posted by LP on Dec 1, 2002

Thanks LP, I promise to keep what you have said in mind, and I appreciate your advice.

I hope that you can forgive any bad things I may have said to you in the past, this experience is certainly a humbling one.

Thanks for your help.

David

... in response to Questions, posted by Charles on Dec 1, 2002

Well that would be a good trick huh?

I guess the only answer I can think of Charles, is that you must be mistaken. I never wrote to you concerning the I-864 to my knowledge, I did all my own paperwork, and didn't need help from anyone to do it.

I was married to Natasha on July 3rd 2001, if you don't want to believe that, its ok with me, but I would have no idea why you and some others would be so skeptical, is is that everyone in this world lies?

I thought the Russian culture was filled with distrust, and the lack of God, but now I'm not so sure the American culture is any different.

But speaking of the I-864, yes that has me very worried, if you know about this, I would appreciate any advice you can offer.

I spoke with the INS over the phone, the girl that I spoke with basically told me that what I need to do is to write the INS a letter, explaining the situation, and explaining that I would not like Natasha to get her permanant greed card based upon marriage to me.

I had thought that if we got divorced, this was automatic, apparently it is not, apparently there is a chance she can stay here anyway?

If this is the case, by what basis can she get public assistance anyway? Welfare? What? How could she be able to do this? And is that all I need to worry about, or are there other things that I need to be concerned about?

And how can the INS allow this to happen, why would they allow her to stay if she has done this to me, do they not open the doors then for every scam girl out there to do the same? Believe me Natasha has many Russian girl friends who are teaching her, and even encouraging her, telling her what to do, and how to do it.

Why does the INS allow this? Surely I cannot be the only one, and surely the INS knows these things are happening? They should be less tolerant to what some of these scammer girls can pull off.

I guess if things get too bad, it will be time to move to Mexico after all.

... in response to Re: Questions, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

Well, I got my dates mixed up, but we did correspond - I just can't add.  You do need to be concerned about the I-864 as this could obligate you to pay for all public assistance given to this woman for 10 years from the issuance of the inital green card.  Based on your description of her work history and habits, this is not a risk that should be overlooked.  If she's unemployed, she qualifies for food stamps, medicaid and welfare payments.  It is your obligation to provide her with the minimum income to keep her off welfare.  That figure is contained in the I-864 documents - probably about $15,000 a year but check to be sure.

You are correct that she can stay if she claims abuse, but as of this time it appears she has not done that, but don't rule it out.  You might want to document the absence of abuse.  The other, more often used, technique to stay in the U.S. is to claim that the marriage was entered into in good faith but just did not work out.  You need to see an immigration lawyer in your area on this one in order to convince INS that she should not receive a permanent green card that will keep you obligated on the I-864.  As I mentioned in the post below when this issue was raised, I would strongly suggest putting your resources into this issue as opposed to the divorce.  Since you haven't been married that long and have no children or real property, the divorce should be relatively painless and inexpensive.  There just isn't much to fight over.  So put your legal dollars into fighting her with INS.  Otherwise, you may be fronting her health and welfare payments for a long time.

... in response to Re: Re: Questions, posted by Charles on Dec 1, 2002

Man that is scary, curse me for my mistakes, I can't believe I walked into this one, I liken myself to a cocky fish in the river, who thought I was too smart for anything or anyone to get me, and then a nice piece of bait came my way and I went for it, and got reeled in, and now I'm sitting on the boat gasping for air, wondering, what happen?

God sure has a way of humbling those who are worth humbling, I'm sorry I ever became too proud, what a fool I have been.

Once again I must humble myself before God, and with my fellow man.

Yes I'm scared now, I will see how much an attorney is going to cost me on Monday.

Thank you,

David

... in response to Re: Questions, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

Yes, there is something more to worry about...health insurance.  I believe that if she were to receive medical treatment via Medicaid, you could be billed.  Look into it, but I think you need to keep her insured until she leaves the country or she marries someone else.  Just think, a car accident injury or an apendectomy could cost you 20grand!

... in response to Re: Questions, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I forgot to mention, apparently there is some provisional law that would allow Natasha to stay here if she were a battered wife, either physically or mentally?

She has threatned me on many occasions that she would lie to the police claiming I beat her up in order to stay in this country.

Yes, that is the type of girl I mistakenly married, and yes I'm very worried about her, that is why I'm going to file for a restraining order against her, to try to cover my own behind.

She is dangerous, absolutely downright dangerous, she will do anything to stay in this country, even lie to the police, she has already threatned me that if I don't give her car back, she will get me into huge trouble with the police, I asked her how she would do this, and she would not answer.

But I have done nothing wrong, but still I'm afraid of her, a woman like her is capable of anything, my only hope is that I come out of this alive and not in jail.

I need a lawyer but don't know that I can afford one.

... in response to Re: Re: Questions, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

You claim to make 150K and don't know if you can afford a lawyer?

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Questions, posted by Jski on Dec 1, 2002

Making 150K was an exageration I'm afraid. I started trading 8 months ago, and at first I lost about 3K, then I started to learn how trading was done and I started doing much better, I got lucky a few times and made some really good money, and I speculated that if I could keep that up, I would make about 150K per year. However, I took some bad losses recently, so I not doing as well as I thought, however I'm still doing pretty good.

But I'm unwilling to touch my trading account unless absolutely necessary, you have to remember that its my only source of income right now, and trading is not easy. If I touch what I have in my trading account anymore than what I already have, I won't be able to do it for a living anymore.

I don't know how much a lawyer is going to cost, but my guess is 2,000 or so, thats going to be a little difficult under the circumstances, my wife has tapped out my checking account, and she has run up 8K in credit card bills, and I have 3500 a month in bills to pay. So I'm basically tapped out, my only hope is to do very well with trading over the next couple of months and get these bills paid off, but just as easy as that could happen, I also could take a big hit to my account in the market doesn't do well, or if a stock I'm in takes a bad fall.

Its risky business, but its the biggest challenge I've ever faced and I like it, and if your good, you can make a fortune, I'm trying to get good, everyday I work on my skills, it's fun, it's rewarding, it's challenging, and I enjoy it, although it is hard work.

I trade from 5:00am pst to 5:00pm pst 5 days a week, it's very demanding but like I said, it can be very rewarding.

David

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Questions, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

[This message has been edited by Jski]

If you have assets you can't afford NOT to have a lawyer.  If she's smart, she'll get one and freeze that trading account of yours as its a marital asset.  First one into court stakes the claims, its up to the respondent to refute them.  The $2000 might get the paperwork started and maybe get him into court once or twice.  If you have a fight on your hands I would revise that estimate upwards 4 to 5 fold.
I've done it both ways....Nasty drawn out legal battle that drained my accounts (thankfully I was real young and no houses), and the latest one done over coffee and $200 to a friend of a friend lawyer to draw it up.  I wouldn't do the later unless you have complete trust in her and what you are doing.  From the sounds of it, you don't.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Questions, posted by Jski on Dec 1, 2002

Well the reality of the situation is that she doesn't have any money; the only way she is surviving now is off some guy who has now become the sucker. Personally I don't think she is going to make it here in this country, she won't get a job, and even if she did she won't be able to keep it, whoever she is going out with right now will eventually get tired of her and get rid of her, she has no car, she has no money, and the real kicker is supposedly her mother coming out here on December 19th, I have no idea where her mother will even stay, and I had no idea she was even coming. I had thought they need me to make the invitation like I did last time, but perhaps I'm wrong?

Anyway, I don't think she has two feet to stand on; I could go file the divorce paperwork myself for 152 dollars, give her last address as the one I'm at now, she will never get the paperwork, and by default I'll be granted a divorce.

You have got to remember something, this girl is very ignorant, she has no idea about credit, about money, about bills, writing checks, etc etc. If it weren’t for other Russian girls coaching her, she wouldn't know anything at all. It’s like dealing with a 13-year-old little girl, even though I've met 13-year-old girls with more sense than her.

You have to remember; she went out with me so she can't be all that smart. But seriously, I think she has gotten herself into big trouble, there is one thing I forgot to mention.

The guy who she went out with, I know his number, I called him, he seems like a very nice guy, he told me he had no idea she was married, and she later admitted to me that he didn't know because she didn't tell him. Well guess what, this guy is on my side now and he says he will help me by simply telling the truth about what happen.

She is caught, she is guilty, I don't think a Judge or the INS is going to believe one word out of her lying mouth, I have letters written in Russian with me now, I believe once I have them translated, it will further show her character.

Little does she know it, but she will hang herself, I don't need to do anything really, except for file for divorce, notify the INS, get a restraining order against her, and move out onto my own and leave her alone.

She is going to lose all of her books her at the apartment, and she has 50 boxes worth of them that weigh 2,000 lbs, but she thinks she is so smart that she will be able to save them. Like I said, she is ignorant, she does not believe that the apartment managers will kick us out of the apartment for not paying the rent, that is how ignorant she is and how much of a fantasy world she lives in. Apparently in Russia everyone gets a free apartment, so getting kicked out is foreign to her, everybody gets a free education, so having to pay for college makes no sense to her, everybody gets free medical and dental, so having to pay 2000 dollars for her dentist work is something I must be lying about to her.

She is psychotic I believe, she is headed for disaster; she will hang herself and doesn't even know it. I predict she will be back in Moscow within 1-2 months on her own accord. I don't believe she is going to pose me any threat at all once I'm able to escape from her, everything is going to start tomorrow morning, movers will come get my stuff and put it into storage, I will turn in my key to the manager and let them know of the situation, and I will then find another place to live and move in, once I do all of that I will file for divorce and notify the INS.

Her game is almost over.

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

[This message has been edited by Charles]

This message was deleted

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

Why are you asking a board full of complete strangers what you should do in this situation?  Surely you have some family and/or friends in your life to counsel with on important decisions?  I just think to ask questions like these are very inappropriate for a forum like this.  
If you want information on how to go about finding a woman in the FSU or what different cities are like or agencies that are good or bad, that's great, but to be asking people here how to handle your personal life is a bit much, don't you think?

What do you think guys here are going to say about your girl moving back in after all you have said about her?  It really seems to me that you are deliberately trying to manipulate people here David, and I think you should seriously get some sound psychological help.  You have gone from "I will never look at another woman again", to "life just isn't worth living", to "Hey, should I let her come back and take advantage of me?", all within 2 days!

This whole story and your obvious questions really smack of manipulation and I smell a fraud..  Maybe as Ken says, you have a girl here and it was real, but you are really getting weird here and I think you should seek some help, NOT from this board, but from family and hopefully a skilled therapist..

... in response to Re: Update: Need advice, posted by Oscar on Dec 1, 2002

First of all, I don't have any family, my mother was the last and she died Oct 18th 2002 from Cancer at the age of 50, that's correct, my mother had me when she was 15 years old.

Secondly, I have always lived a secluded life, I have never had a job where I could meet people, I have always had the type of job that keeps me secluded, I never go to bars, or clubs, and don't do anything where I could meet anyone, and as I get older, this only becomes more true.

So I have no friends, and haven't for many years now.

So these strangers as you call them, are all that I have, and many of them are older than me, and although I do consider myself extremely intelligent and knowledgeable, I lack wisdom.

And men who are 50 years old, are much wiser than me, and I am not foolish enough not to understand that they can help me, they can give me good advice, and I would be wise to listen to them.

One of the ways one becomes so knowledgeable is by learning from others, everyone has knowledge to some degree, and as a Philosopher, I try to absorb that knowledge.

I hope I have made things a little clearer.

David

... in response to Re: Re: Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

You are 35 and have NEVER had a job where you ever met any people?  Your Mother had NO family and you had NO family friends of any kind?  Uh, huh..
Even if this were all true, which I have a hard time believing, would it not make more sense for you to seek clergy, since you seem to believe so strongly in God?  It would make even more sense to go therapy to speak about these things rather than asking for and just taking advice from a bunch of strangers you have never met on such personal issues!
I'm sorry David but what I really see is a guy with some real issues that strongly need to be addressed, jerking around a lot of people here..

... in response to All you "have made clearer" is..., posted by Oscar on Dec 1, 2002

Well, I'm sorry you feel that way.

... in response to Re: All you "have made clearer"..., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

Why be sorry?  Because I feel you need some real help from both clergy and a good therapist??  Why are you sorry I feel that way? I think these two simple suggestions would be of greater benefit than anything you will get here on this board concerning your very personal issues from people you don't even know...

... in response to You didn't address one thing in my post ..., posted by Oscar on Dec 1, 2002

I'm am very certain that there are many good religious leaders out there, the problem is I don't trust any of them. I have been to Church, and what I have found I do not like, some of those people are some of the biggest hypocrites around.

Try to understand that evil is intelligent, evil seeks and loves power, one of the best places for evil to prosper and hide is the one place where you would never expect to find it, namely the Church, the Catholic church in particular, although I don't exclude the Christian church either though.

There is no man alive who can lead me in spiritual matters, I understand the Bible better than most any human being currently alive, and God and Jesus Christ are my leaders, they can help me better than any other.

As far as therapist are concerned, try to understand that as a scientist and philosopher, we laugh at psychologist and psychiatrist, we do not respect their profession, just as we do not respect chiropractors, or palm readers, or psychics, or fortune tellers, or astrology.

I know more about the human brain through nuero science than any psychologist ever thought about knowing, he could not teach me anything, but I could however teach him.

For instance, most every psychologist alive doesn't even know the basic common denominator of all human behavior, and without that knowledge, it would be impossible to understand why humans do what they do.

And that common denominator is the two controlling forces to all human behavior, everything you do, and everything you don't do, is controlled by "the need to avoid pain, and the desire to gain pleasure", this is our mathematical biological program if you will.

Just as a microprocessor simply measure whether the "circuit is on or off", and thus we can create a language from this and make this language interact with this binary process to make the computer do what we want it to do, so is the human brain similar in its makeup. It too works off a binary process in as much as everything is controlled by both pain and pleasure.

I am currently writing a book which is titled "Quantum Society with respect to Brain Sex Theory", which not only deals with brain sex but also our built in biological program, among many other things thus the title quantum.

So you see Oscar, I am far beyond the help of man on this planet with respect to my current level of knowledge, but like I said, I cannot know everything, and my biggest weakness is a lack of experience, and thus wisdom. This is where other men who are older than I can help me, for I may know a 1000 times what they do, but they have the one thing I do not, wisdom and experience, and the only way I can get those things, is with time, and time cannot be rushed no matter how much I wish I could.

If you are a therapist, I would be happy to discuss anything you would like to, but I appreciate nonetheless your concern for me, because if you had no concern for me, you would not have responded, I may have a great deal of knowledge and understanding, but I'm still just a man like you and need friends, need support from my peers, and need to be accepted.

I thank you for your help.

David

... in response to Re: You didn't address one thing in my p..., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

Your arrogance and narrcissistic nature are your own worst enemies.  They will likely prevent you from seeking the kind of help you desperately need..  
Look at these posts David.  If anyone ELSE had written them, you would likely be calling them a nut case!

"So you see Oscar, I am far beyond the help of man on this planet with respect to my current level of knowledge."

And-

"There is no man alive who can lead me in spiritual matters, I understand the Bible better than most any human being currently alive."

And-

"I know more about the human brain through nuero science than any psychologist ever thought about knowing, he could not teach me anything."

David, you have some real issues and they are NOT going to go away WITHOUT some SERIOUS HELP..  All your reading and tremendous knowledge will not help you any more than they have already!  
If what you are doing is NOT working, stop, and try something else!

And NO David, I don't want to "discuss" your issues.  I am not your therapist and this is NOT the place to do that kind of work...

Do yourself a favor- Swallow a little of your pride and get a therapist.  I PROMISE you, in one session they will know exactly where you are and what to do about it!  

... in response to David, you need help-, posted by Oscar on Dec 1, 2002

Oscar, he doesn't want any help even though it's been offered to him.  He has some idea that because he is educated he is smart.  Unfortunately, that is only one piece to life's puzzle.  Smart would be an education in many things including street smarts and interaction for which he has none.

Let him fail on his own.  This guy will lose all by himself.

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

(and I'm really not sure is this message is for JohnDavid or the readers...)

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

So we can hear about you misery some more.

... in response to Re: I think you need to take her back in..., posted by wsbill on Dec 1, 2002

You have always been a strange one wsbill, I see some things don't change.

... in response to Re: Re: I think you need to take her bac..., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

at the DYN msg board on yahoo.  Sums up what kind of a luzer you are...

Your vile personality and speaks for itself in all those posts.  What makes you a sensitive person now?  The only valitity you have is from KenC and he is suffering from Stockhomn Syndrome in just meeting you and knowing you.

Clearly, you need friendship and loyality.

In part time to get a puppy dog since it's clear nobody, not even your wife can stand being around your negativity.

... in response to Re: Your the one who is twisted... just ..., posted by wsbill on Dec 1, 2002

Well I'm glad you know me so well, congratulations.

But do you know what else?

I don't need to speak with you anymore.

Have a nice Sunday.

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

[This message has been edited by robobond]

This message was deleted

... in response to Re: Update: Need advice, posted by robobond on Dec 1, 2002

[This message has been edited by robobond]

This message was deleted

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

called it correctly below ("One thing I have read.....").
"DAVID" is "stringin'" you along. This guy and his ongoing saga are as phoney as a three $ bill! Let it go!

... in response to Guys, BarryM, posted by MtMav on Dec 1, 2002

Are you sure about that? 100% sure? You must be genius if you are.

... in response to Re: Guys, BarryM, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I am 101% you are a troll DSD, pure ole bullsh!t. Guess that put's me to your genius level..........OHHH NOOOOOOOOOOO!

... in response to Correcto MtMav., posted by Jack on Dec 1, 2002

Actually, I've lurked on this board for quite sometime but seldom contribute. I know the personalities and remember "DavidSD" well. I thought he was a rather scary, angry, mentally disturbed individual. I thought the original "David" could be violent and dangerous. This "David" seems rather different.

... in response to Correcto MtMav., posted by Jack on Dec 1, 2002

Well then sir, I guess you are 101% wrong? And I guess you also believe Ken is a liar too, I'm sure he appreciates that Jack, thank you for your extreme wisdom.

... in response to Re: Correcto MtMav., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

So I am wrong about you being the DavidSD, DSD, from San Diego who would rant and rave on the P-L board (and many others after getting banned from here) over the last two years, always letting us know how great he was and how stupid we were, we white guys that is. The Jews, blacks and browns of course were even dummier that us white boys according to the gospel of DavidSD. No Quack DavidSD, you are the same DavidSD, DSD, from one and two years ago, I am 101% sure about that. You think posting as John LV doesn't make you any less the troll DavidSD was?  

You know what DavidSD, you got what was coming to you because you were so stupid! How does it feel to be called so stupid DavidSD, just as you referred to many of us? To be so smart, as you consider yourself, well look who is so damn smart now! Others tried to give you advice, good sound advice and you sh!t on them. You called us all stupid, you and your Russian bride were different, you did not need advice from us lower humans, you were smarter than us as you had an IQ of 186. (So did the uni-bomber. He was so smart he thought it was alright to kill people). You didn't need to meet anymore Russian woman other than the one and only Russian woman from Moscow that you met. You knew this one well enough, she was the perfect woman and very much in love with you and you in love with her (sex should not be confused with love, have you learned that yet DavidSD!). As you told those who tried to help you repeatedly, "you knew what you were doing".

The best thing about this dialog going now is it might show some other smart guys what can happen to them and that maybe they should take there time, not rush into marriage with a girl they do not know, meeting more than one Russian woman. The only reason I even waste my time to respond back to you now is in hopes other guys searching for there dreambride might learn something from your stupid antics and behavior.

... in response to (*/*), posted by Jack on Dec 1, 2002

Jack, I agree with you on everything except for two things, first I have never taken the name DSD, that person was an imposter I guess? And I have never wrote you any hate email before, never, I don't remember exactly but I may have written to you once or twice, but certainly no hate email, I have nothing against you whatsoever, of that you can be assured.

Yes I have been foolish, and it takes a real man to admit to that, and so I do.

At least I'm here trying to give others insight into my experience, and my faults, maybe it could help others, and certainly it proves you right what you have always said.

Believe me, I wish I had listen to you, but yes I thought I was right, proudness always comes before a fall, I'll try never to forget that again.

... in response to Re: (*/*), posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I meant to say "pride" always comes before a fall. Yes I'm half illiterate.

... in response to Re: Re: (*/*), posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

DavidSD, maybe you have learned something about this most precious search for one's Russian dreambride. Maybe life and it's hard reality has taught you a few things. Maybe you are a little more humble.

You burnt a lot of bridges 2 years, one and a half years ago, and it is going to take some individuals, like me, some time to see if you have really changed or do you turn into the same old DavidSD at midnight.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: (*/*), posted by Jack on Dec 1, 2002

As long as you don't feed me any food or water after midnight, I'll be fine :-)

... in response to (*/*), posted by Jack on Dec 1, 2002

now that is the fact Jack! Impressive. You broke it down huh? I like that direct approach. I was trying to say the same thing but I got lost in the whole world vision thingy.
:)
Joe

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

If there ever was a BOHICA, this is it.

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

David,
Stick to the plan and move.  See an attorney Monday.  Get her out of your life and eventually your head too.  Why would you even consider prolonging the misery that being roomates would surly bring?  (How will you feel when you come home and find her humping her new man on your sofa?)  What makes you think that she has magically changed into a wage earner all of a sudden?  (She has been lazy and not been able to hold a job so far and that will not change)  Why would you want such a disrespectful slob as a roomate?  YOU CANNOT TRUST ANYTHING SHE SAYS.  Remove yourself from the daily pain of being with her.  She wants the car back plain and simple.  Let the courts decide how the assets should be divided.  As for the bills, you have been footing them so far and you will have to continue to do so in the future.  Wanna preview of how it could be living with her as a roomate?  Look back at the aggravation she caused you over the last 6 months and then multiply it by 10.  MOVE ON!
KenC

... in response to clean break is best, posted by KenC on Dec 1, 2002

.

... in response to Ken, I'm sorry, but you are being played..., posted by Oscar on Dec 1, 2002

Ken, do you have any idea why these people think this way?

I'm sorry but it is bizarre to put in mildly.

I can only wonder what has been said that they do not believe?

... in response to clean break is best, posted by KenC on Dec 1, 2002

I know your right Ken, I just needed to hear it from someone else, but I know your right.

Don't you find it strange that a person can be like she is? I have been out with lots of girls in my 35 years, and I have met girls who had done every guy within a 30 mile radius, but never in my life have I met a girl with this kind of nerve, it amazes me, sickens me too, but amazes me nonetheless.

I can only wonder how out of all the girls I could have met, I had to meet this one? I don't think I could have done much worse.

But I guess I should have known when we were in Prague together and we were standing at the bank teller together, a guy came up from behind us and she saw him and stepped away from me as if she were not with me, I thought that was odd. Or when we were walking along in Prague and a good looking guy (Russian) was standing against the wall and I saw her give a big smile to him. Or when she walked out of the Bartending and Cocktail waitress school I sent her through, another good looking guy walked out too and she smiled at him.

Boy have I been blinded for so long, what a fool I have been, and yes hindsight has 20/20 vision for sure.

Thanks Ken.

... in response to Re: clean break is best, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

David,
Sorry to say, but your's is not a unique position at all.  Women have been playing men from the beginning of time.  It is the natural order of things.  They have something we want (sex) and they know how to advertise it.  It is the bait to get what they want from us (food and shelter).  I know this is a rather simplistic explanation and in no way PC, but that is what it is all about.  Now the scenareo gets a tad bit more complicated when you add emotions into the mix and women's financial opportunities now available.
Your wife is not unusual in any way.  Your blindness to her undesirable traits is also not unusual.  A "fool in love" and "love is blind" are in no way new concepts.  Move on and learn from your mistakes.  Best of luck.
KenC

... in response to it isn't strange or even unusual, posted by KenC on Dec 1, 2002

Thanks again Ken,

Isn't it amazing how some people would stick there foots in their mouths by saying I'm not telling the truth?

I mean, seriously, who could make up such a bizare story? Certainly not me, and if I could, I would start writing Fiction books since I could probably do very well at it.

I mean, if you're going to make up stories, why not make them a bit more believable? Even I myself don't believe my story, I'm still waiting to wake up from this long nightmare.

I have been doing a lot of thinking of late, and I can now see so many of the warning signs, next time I should be able to do much better, at least I hope so.

I hate moving, and moving from SD to LV was a real pain, now I must move again to another place here in LV, but at least this time, once I do, I can have some peace for once.

Thanks again Ken, I'll give you my number when I get one again, and I'll call you when my phone gets hooked up.

Take care and enjoy your Sunday.

... in response to Re: it isn't strange or even unusual, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

some go round and round and some just run off the proverbial cliff-and many just sit pickin their seat! Like Mave. For some reason Dave you have captured the hearts of some on the board. If I was you, and I am not, I would find that part of me. The funny thing is this girl is probably more like you than you know. My wife is a real bytch but she so am I. haha
So if you have half the insight you clame-begin with self reflection. Then pump up the Zoloft, bring your girl in, have sex like monkeys, collect the rent. If you lucky she will be into 'swinging'. You will not get married again and the institution is only for those who wish to retire from ultimate passion. So take your crazy azz to her bed and have a blast for a while. But, be objective and do not apply fetters. If you want to be a true genius you have to experience as many of life's offerings. Yes people are going to think this is crazy, but every person that they have admired or called hero has done worse. You people in public office, you leaders, your superstars all are 'nontraditional'. I have become domesticated-for now. With a few years I will be sitting Italy writing more diatribe having young girls give me massages-and yes my wife will be there.
It is you life-live it.
Joe

... in response to there are various forms of misdirection...., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

NT

... in response to Flakey, Goofy, pure flakiness! N/T, posted by MtMav on Dec 1, 2002

nt

... in response to there are various forms of misdirection...., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast [them] down to hell, and delivered [them] into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;  
   
   2Pe 2:5   And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth [person], a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;  
   
   2Pe 2:6   And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned [them] with an overthrow, making [them] an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;  
   
   2Pe 2:7   And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:  
   
   2Pe 2:8   (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed [his] righteous soul from day to day with [their] unlawful deeds;)  
   
   2Pe 2:9   The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:  
   
   2Pe 2:10   But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous [are they], selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.  
   
   2Pe 2:11   Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.  
   
   2Pe 2:12   But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;  
   
   2Pe 2:13   And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, [as] they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots [they are] and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;  
   
   2Pe 2:14   Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:  
   
   2Pe 2:15   Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam [the son] of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;  
   
   2Pe 2:16   But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet.  
   
   2Pe 2:17   These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.  
   
   2Pe 2:18   For when they speak great swelling [words] of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, [through much] wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.  
   
   2Pe 2:19   While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.  
   
   2Pe 2:20   For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.  
   
   2Pe 2:21   For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known [it], to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.  
   
   2Pe 2:22   But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog [is] turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.  

I shall pray for you my friend, turn from the sins of this world, do not get caught up into this sexual perversion, I know its difficult, but with God and his son Jesus Christ, all things are possible. We must lift each other up, not pull each other down. We all sin, and that is why you must ask forgiveness from those sins.

And I myself must remember what Jesus said, "Cast not your pearls before swine, lest they be trampled upon".

No more pearls for my current wife, they are dirty enough as they stand now.

David

... in response to Re: there are various forms of misdirect..., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I am not Christian. I believe in one God not psuedowannabegods. I also do not buy into dogma from self interest groups called religion. If God can create a universe, I am sure she can talk to me without the influence of some self righteous mediator. Sorry!
Joe

... in response to live and let die 'paul mccartney' ...., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

Applying your own logic, you are basically claiming either deity or special revelation. Because neither is true you are essentially creating God in *your* own image.

Talk about "pseudowannabegods", look in the mirror.

... in response to Re: live and let die .., posted by WmGo on Dec 1, 2002

the very first book God says, Man is now like "US" meaning the Gods......or as you may claim the trinity. So again read your scripture. I did not make the rules I just live by them-try it you may like it.
Joe

... in response to huh exuse my but in your Bible/////, posted by yoe on Dec 2, 2002

Like Lucifer you misrepresent the Scriptures.

Your reference is to Gen 1:26. That verse does not say what you claim. On the contrary, that verse is universally  interpereted by all major Protestant denominations, the Catholic church and the Eastern Orthodox church as a conversation between the three Persons of the Holy Trintiy. It speaks of God's decision to create man in *His* own image: a being possessing three parts: body, mind (soul) and spirit.

Thanks for revealing who you really are. It comes as no  surprise.

... in response to huh exuse my but in your Bible/////, posted by yoe on Dec 2, 2002

Yoe, I think there is not one person who contributes to this board who lives the life God had intended for us to live as much as WmGo does.

For you to suggest William to try to live by the scripture, he might like it, I can assure you he does and he loves it!

... in response to live and let die 'paul mccartney' ...., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

She?

Boy are you lost my friend, I was once lost as you, but God (He) came into my room and saved me from evil, spoke to me, leaned over me, and took away my fear.

Again, I will pray for you, for that is what Jesus has called us to do.

... in response to Re: live and let die 'paul mccartney' ....., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I am actually an ordained minister. I do have the authority to forgive! But thanks anyway. I have been prayed for by the best. Ironic how those who are most needy feel the need to pray for others to feel worthy.
Joe

... in response to pray for yourself my brother, you need i..., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

"I am actually an ordained minister"

And you claim David is more in need of help than you?

Pathetic. Absolutely pathetic.

P.S. Only God The Holy Trintiy has the power to forgive.

... in response to Re: pray for yourself my brother, you ne..., posted by WmGo on Dec 1, 2002

I agree his "posts" show a complete misunderstanding of even the basic precepts of Christianity and an even worse understanding of the Office of the Holy Ministry.

... in response to Re: Re: pray for yourself my brother, yo..., posted by Philb on Dec 1, 2002

nt

... in response to pray for yourself my brother, you need i..., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

Your an ordained minister and you say the things you have said?

I hope for your sake you are lying about that, because if not than you should know all too well what you have done, you have my pity.

... in response to Re: pray for yourself my brother, you ne..., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

have you  been following the religous wars lately? Just because you have bought into a lie does not make it true! You truly are lost and that is understandable. But you need to focus on yourself. And yes it is true I am a minister of God. By the way isn't it ironic that we can say words like hate, kill, muder but cannot say fukk, or orgasm or cokk or puzzy...anything that deals with intamacy has been labled 'curse' words or profanity and everything dealing with destruction is glorified and enamered. I thinks you have been duped on all sides my friend. Remember it is all symantic. Words are just words-but action is where the truth is.
Joe

... in response to have you listened to your christian lead..., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

You are the furthest thing from a "minister of God" as is humanly and spiritualy possible. Amazing that you have never made this claim before in all the time you have posted your drivel here.

You may charm a few, but you are clearly one sick puppy.

... in response to Have *you* listened ?, posted by WmGo on Dec 1, 2002

Let this fool (Yoe yoe or Joe or Moe or Curly whatever his name is)go. He is clearly a goofy flake. Goofiness and goofballs happen. The only surprise for me is that a few on this board gave the goofball some credibility/credence. He should be curtly dismissed as a feeble minded imbecile/buffoon/oddball regarding his views on religion and most other topics.

... in response to For WmGo, posted by MtMav on Dec 2, 2002

Agreed

... in response to For WmGo, posted by MtMav on Dec 2, 2002

ya you-prove me wrong------where is your email, you have mine liar, troll
Joe

... in response to Have *you* listened ?, posted by WmGo on Dec 1, 2002

not very Christian! One great thing about fools-they always speak of things they know nothing about. I do, whether you like it or not, legally have the authority to forgive. And as your lord so eloquently says, you must follow the law! Your bible has more contradictions than ....anything. Your God, son of God, lord, savior or what ever the term referring to Jesus is needed at the time is never wrote anything-nothing. As far as I know 'God' only wrote one document-the 10 comandments and this document clearly was interpreted to say to worship 1GOD. Not 3. That is why Islam is the largest religion in the world. But them again you have never read the Koran in its original form have ya-what? you have never read the entire Bible.......I bet you have actaully never read much of any relegious docterine except a few excerpts. Even your leader never read the Koran-I know becuase they do not read Arabic. So cast your stones all you want-do it in the name of heaven you can justify it in the end (Billy Jack)
joe

... in response to Are you casting stones?, posted by yoe on Dec 2, 2002

[This message has been edited by WmGo]

1. You obviously do not know what it means to "cast stones."

2. You have clearly revealed who your are spiritually aligned with.

3. Even in *that* realm you are less than a peon and a very feeble minded one at that; I have seen many much more formidable and in that regard you are somewhat of a dissapointment.

Take a look at your future: Phillipians 2: 10-11.  

P.S. Your assumptions about what I have or have not read and studied are, as can be expected from any assumption, incorrect.

... in response to Have *you* listened ?, posted by WmGo on Dec 1, 2002

Anyone can be ordained by going to the ULC's website. They can even give you the title of Bishop or Saint. No kidding.

So Yoe or DavidSD can become ordained.

-blm

... in response to Online ordinations from the Universal Li..., posted by BarryM on Dec 1, 2002

in case you did not know this!!!
What are your credentials?
Joe
Oh yea anyone can get a law degree too!

... in response to have you listened to your christian lead..., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

N/T

... in response to A "minister of God"..........?..., posted by MtMav on Dec 1, 2002

you just are not that interesting. At least Dave was intriging. You lost my intersest on your first bogus post-I think after you were banned or something. But good luck at ya. My wife and I are going to take off for a month a travel-have a sloppy holiday!
Joe

... in response to have you listened to your christian lead..., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

"Do not cast your pearls before swine lest it be trampled upon"

You and I my friend have nothing further to discuss, enjoy your Sunday.

... in response to Re: have you listened to your christian ..., posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I withdraw my pearls.........
joe

... in response to good point......., posted by yoe on Dec 1, 2002

N/T

... in response to Keep the pearls..........withdraw your g..., posted by MtMav on Dec 1, 2002

nt

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I forgot to mention, she also stated that she would not be messy anymore, and that she would help to keep the place clean.

But here is the funny part, she brought with her some food to eat, she bought a Lean Choice frozen meal, a loaf of bread, pack of cheese and a pack of sliced ham.

As I speak to your right now, the left over package of Lean Choice is sitting on the counter top, with food still in it, the ham is sitting out on the coffee table, the loaf of bread is sitting on the stove, and the cheese is with the ham on the coffee table, having been left out all night long.

I wonder if she would still eat it?

This is the person with whom I'm dealing with, I think she may be psychotic, and actually I truly do feel sorry for her, I really honestly truly do.

... in response to Update: Need advice, posted by John LV on Dec 1, 2002

I assume that you went to Russia to find a wife, not a room mate.  She only wants to be room mates.  Besides, she has left you once: the only safe assumption is that she will do it again. And, I suspect, she will do it sooner rather than later.

I realize ending the marraige is expensive, both emotionaly and financially, but I think in the long run you will be better off.

I wish you well.
Richard

... in response to Re: My advice, say NO!, posted by Richard on Dec 1, 2002

Thank you, I know you are right, I just needed to hear other people tell me what I already know, I guess I just need some encouragement.

Thank you.