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I want to know what happend to MDante.
Then ole dande-I hope he found a gal.
There are many guys I have seen come and go here. Most I hope really do well with their gals. The others, I hope just get busted before they hurt someone. One thing is for sure, there is a phenomenon here. And people can say what they want, but these guys with foreign wives have a better home life-in general.IMHO
I think that I have the most beauriful wife-LP has seen her. Believe it or not-she would not give him a secon look. ;)
So look to others on this journey with hope, sympathy and compassion. It is very difficult and very wonderful. At times board like these are all people have to go to for a little breather and comaradity. I have been using this board for around 3 years and have hated it and love it. I have had people call me names and give me great advice. But most importantly I knew there were other guys going through the same thing.
Is it crazy to do what we do? yes
Is is against the norm? maybe
but, it is happening and it is working. I have met maybe 50-75 AM/RW couples. So many more from other places.
Only thing that I know is that my wife love me and I love her. Not in the TV sense-in the real "we are stuck with each other' sense. Maybe I could have found someone else. Maybe not! I know what I want-I do not and did not need to go on a cattle call. For guys who are unsure of themselves or what they want-they may take a few years and date many women. I did it when I was young, insecure and had no idea what I wanted. When I decided-I decided. So whatever works. Do not let anyone discourage you-if it feels right. The worst that can happen is you will miscalculate. Just as Wild Bill. But I would never fault a guy for trying.
Peace
Joe

... in response to But more interestingly,, posted by yoe on Jun 16, 2002

While I like the idea of having LP's insights and analyses back on the board - if it means we have to put up with yoe's inane meanderings - maybe it's not such a good idea after all.

Cheers yoe!

- Dan

... in response to I Don't Know . . ., posted by Dan on Jun 16, 2002

With every word of reason............somebody has to have some wisdom (that be me).
You see, the heart does not run on 'reason'. It does not make sense. But what makes less sense, is how you and others support a person who berates you, calls you names and says that your are a fool and a loser! Read the archives.
It was not until I kept reings tight, your buddy uses all of my material to win you back-and then to insult you again. I just remember ole David SD saying, that he was going to win everyone over just to come out say 'gotcha'.
Again read the archives!
I have always been consistent and honest!
LP was Anti-RW just a few months ago. Or was he just 'dating' a few. Now he has found the one and brought back a child? Hmmmm. Again read the archives.
Dan, SOMETIMES you make sense! But, others I think that you just like to read yourself type!
Cheers! :)
Joe
I told you consistent!

... in response to Hey Dan..........., posted by yoe on Jun 16, 2002

I think you are spending WAY too much time reading the archives! Seems you've nearly got them memorized.

There's bound to be a more productive way to develop your new Eastern Europe business interests.

And BTW - consistency is my middle name.

- Dan

... in response to Your Skin is Thinning Out Down in That W..., posted by Dan on Jun 17, 2002

you could have been more............forceful. I have pretty much said my piece. I will cool it for a while again. I don't wish anyone any misfortune. Mostly, I did not want Mark to call his Victoria and get all paranoid-it can happen. I am glad he is more secur. People can really hurt with words, man. I know what some of the guys here did to me. It could have ruined the whole thing for me. When you are new, you only have guys like us for help. So do not give up Dan, you are good help for people-mostly. Just learnto put the breaks on-you do not have to get the last word-always. As you know I am very much this way. Many people here have great knowledge-even lp. sometimes people just let their insucurities overide their true intention. I belive that lp does not have ill intentions-he just gets carried away. he starts hair pulling looking to get someone going then the fist come out. I never took him personally and I knew what was up. We all like a good spat-we are animals after all. I know that the board is quite without the trolls. lp left after the trolls left-it took away a lot of the fun. anyway, peace
Joe

... in response to thanks for taking it easy on me........., posted by yoe on Jun 17, 2002

when Dan just try to get the last word in most of the time it is because he was right IMHO

... in response to Yea but, posted by greg2 on Jun 17, 2002


Nevertheless...

The constant need of everyone to get the last word is what makes the wars last so long and get so tiresome.

"You didn't read my post..."

"No, you didn't read my post..."

"No... You didn't read mine..."

etc,

etc.

Fact is... if they didn't read your first post... chances are REALLY good that they're not going to read your fifteenth, either...

I mean, I like Dan. And, I like Oscar, too.

But the war had to stop... you can only do so much of that...

... in response to Re: Yea but, posted by MarkInTx on Jun 17, 2002

Sometimes it gets redondunt for sure Mark.

But even then out of all of it sometimes comes some good that otherwise would not surface.  And, most of the time, not all, it gets called redundent and the end is soon to show after the value of it all has been retrived IMHO. Other times it all becomes down right comical and entertaining also.

... in response to thanks for taking it easy on me........., posted by yoe on Jun 17, 2002


Joe,

I appreciate your comments, and I appreciate why you made them.

And I also could not agree with you more.

Except I disagree that LP doesn't mean to hurt people. I think that is exactly what he means to do.

One of the reasons that I find LP's postings so despicable is that he *does* try to hurt people.

Look at it: He will not tell us where he went, or who's girl he screwed... nope... he wants to be vague, because then he can affect as many people as possible. When pinned down, he'll back off and say: "Hey, I just said *maybe* I did..."

The fact is that I never asked Victoria if she were with him. Why? Because I know Victoria. And I know LP. Even if he directly said he was with her (which he didn't, and wouldn't) who am I going to believe? Victoria who has sacrificed for our relationship, and has never lied to me about anything? Or LP -- a small little man who hides behind an internet identity and lashes out at everyone behind the safety of anonymity?

I find it amusing that he has never posted details of his trips, pictures of his journeys, or pictures of either him or his "wonderful woman who wouldn't give you any of you a second glance..."

Good idea. As long as he remains an "international man of mystery" then he might be able to prey on some people's insecurities.

If he posted pictures of himself or his woman, then all would see him for exactly what he really is... and then he would be much less effective...

What could he do when everyone discovered that he was not an all powerful wizard of Oz, but was instead just a short, balding man hiding behind a big metal machine???

... in response to Thanks ... And, posted by MarkInTx on Jun 17, 2002

Mark,

I have seen pictures of LP. Sorry to tell you but he is not a bad looking guy at all. I have seen pictures of perhaps all or most of the women that he spent any real time with from the FSU. They were all very nice looking women.

... in response to LP = LP, posted by greg2 on Jun 17, 2002


Your point being?

I'm not a bad looking guy either... and my fiance is a very nice looking woman...

Big deal... That and .50 gets me a coke...

My "Fat Bald guy" reference was following the Wizard of Oz analogy.

I have no idea what he looks like, so I'll have to take your word for it that he's "Not a bad looking guy." (Although, I'm sure he wouldn't be my type...)

I doubt, however, that he is some Brad Pitt look-alike who has women throwing their panties and hotel room keys at him wherever he goes, though.

And I find it absolutely impossible to believe that his woman is so far superior to everyone else's that she wouldn't give any other of us "losers" a second glance...

Anyway... whatever...

I am bored discussing the jerk. That's the only reason he came here, anyway.

He is like a board terrorist... if we spend all day talking about him... he's won.

I'm through...

On to important items...

... in response to So what?, posted by MarkInTx on Jun 17, 2002

I merely gave you information that you said you felt was missing and important enough for you to mention that is all.

I have not found his latest post Mark so I can not comment about some of what you say. If it is not appropriate, I promise I will attack him. Where is it anyway?

... in response to Re: So what?, posted by greg2 on Jun 17, 2002

You probably just don't see it, because it was in the midst of the Ken, Dan, Oscar war.

It was in the thread:

"come on Oscar, be honest" started by KenC

Although I summarized it above for Dan. All of the quotes in there were the ones I found objectionable. I didn't read his next several posts... I'm sure I would have found a wealth of material there, as well...

... in response to Thanks ... And, posted by MarkInTx on Jun 17, 2002

watch it with the short balding man thing...

heh heh :^)

... in response to hey hey now..., posted by BrianN on Jun 17, 2002

Ooops...

I thought about that later...

I was not calling him Fat and Bald. That actually makes no difference in the scheme of things, anyway...

I was simply finishing the Wizard of Oz analogy... the "Wizard" was just a short bald guy... not an all-mighty wizard...

That's all I meant...

... in response to thanks for taking it easy on me........., posted by yoe on Jun 17, 2002

I've frequently - though not always - felt something of a soft spot for you. And I think I have commented favorably on your humor and your forthright nature. I really appreciate your posts that admit some of your frailties and poke fun at yourself - and others.

On balance - I've enjoyed your posts. You *do* occasionally seem a bit full of yourself - and you *can* come across as more than a little arrogant - but what the heck, you take the good with the bad - right?

I don't share your perspective on LP however. I don't think his departure (hiatus, actually) had anything to do with Patrick's improved troll procedures.

FWIW

- Dan

... in response to Hey Dan..........., posted by yoe on Jun 16, 2002

.

... in response to I Don't Know . . ., posted by Dan on Jun 16, 2002

Dan,

To each his own... I know that LP seems to have his staunch supporters.

But if anyone else had come on and said the things he said, I think the "voices of reason" on the board would be all over him.

I haven't read his last few "contributions" but just in the two that I did read, let me cite a few of his "insights" as well translations:

"Since I'm long finished with this..."

Translation: "I am so far ahead of everyone, that even reading this board is practically beneath me..."

" (and settled in with a woman who wouldn't give a fool like you a second glance), "

Translation: I am a much better man than you. And my woman is much better than yours.

"...would be surprised if he knew how much testing I had to go through during my current and previous careers"

Translation: "I have held important jobs that guys like you can only dream about... You'd be shocked to find out how important I am..."

"...I focused solely on this city for two years. I went though a lot of girls there, rejecting all who didn't live up to my standards and leaving them for others who, apparently, have lower ones..."

Translation: "I've already seen your woman and discarded her. She wasn't good enough for me, so she had to settle for someone like you."

And of course... the "best" insight of all:

"I should actually thank you for providing me with the greatest test of willpower I've had in years. You make it difficult, I mean *really* difficult, to avoid telling you something that would rock your world. Lets just say the crew of the Enterprise and you don't share one thing in common"

Translation: "I've already screwed your girlfriend, pal. And then I rejected her because she didn't live up to my standards..."

You think this drivel is valuable and insightful?

I think its pathetic.

Seriously... all he ever does is come on here and tell us how smart he is, how much better he is, and that everyone (except a small handful) are losers.

The board was better off without him when he was "retired."

But he didn't stay retired, did he? Nope... and you know why? Because he needs to stroke his own ego. He'll never go away.

Not as long as he can spout off, and have some guys on here say: "Way to go LP! You tell them!"

He pretends he is "above this" board... but the fact is: He needs this board.

Insecure people need their egos stroked.

... in response to ..."insights and analyses"..., posted by MarkInTx on Jun 16, 2002

Mark,There is not doubt that LP could be harsh.

The fact is that there are guys who have frequented here who were so in LA LA land that they needed some serious shock therapy. I did not come away with the feeling that it was not his intent to hurt but to say take another look. To give a heads up on caution. I do not think that he would have been effective if he had been diplomatic. His approach was to not be labeled as someone who understated anything that is for sure. I did not read many insults as such but as comedy quite frankly.

I understand totally where you are coming from. It is valid for each of us to have our view on LP.

You know, the whole problem with this MOB thing is that for most it forces people to accept the LA LA Land attitude to some degree. But there are less healthy forms of this perspective also.

For most people, they simply are not allowed the time to get to know someone so, you have to go on little knowledge. If you are going to do this, you are going to have to give in to the fact that to some degree you are going to have to trust that God is with you in your decisions and trust in your own intuition about what you are doing and who you are bringing over.

KenC said that it took him six months of dating to know someone. I agree. We do not get that. These ladies have the same problem/challenge. Very little is factual and thus we are all functioning on hope more so than if you could have the time to date like you would an AW. I do not want to hear about the 50% divorce rate either as no one has given any data on these FSU marriages other than hopeful opinion.

RW made a statement that if things do not seem to be working perfectly in the beginning that one needs to wonder why. She feels is they are meant to be, this is what will happen. I do not agree but there is some truth in all of that.

There have been guys here who were clearly ignoring one red flag after another and still wanting to just have faith. It was almost as if, once a guy invested any amount of time in a  woman he would prefer to move blindly forward perhaps because of not wanting to have to start over - wanting to rationalize the red flags away instead. People like LP, regardless of their style,  say watch what you are doing. You do not have to agree with his style but his message behind it is a good one.

I am sure there are guys that he has done this to who proceeded and things will continue to go fine for them. But, most likely I sense we will not hear it too often on this forum if such is not the case.  But those attacks about ones sanity can be ignored if they do not apply to one or they just might get a guy to look at something he has been overlooking.

Then, on the other hand they could get a guy to become paranoid and screw up something that could have been very special. If you are too trusting or swing to paranoia - in either case you have a problem and each has to find his own balance. And, IMHO finding balance it is easier to get the big picture by seeing extremes of reality on both sides and then finding my own balance with these perspectives being known.

... in response to Re: ..."insights and analyses"..., posted by greg2 on Jun 17, 2002


Greg,

I will not comment on LP, his alleged insight, or what I feel about that (for reasons already stated)

However, let me comment on the rest of your post because you bring up some (THANK GOD) valid points...

You are a scientist. As such, you were trained to look at things scientifically, to whit: Form a hypothesis, gather facts which will either support it or disprove it.

Can this approach be applied to dating and marriage? Forget in the FSU... can it be applied in general?

I submit: no. When you wring all of romance out of love, what is left?

Honestly... should we marry for large dowries, good breeding stock, and political advantages? This is how marriage was commenced for years. And, it is frankly what we are left if we reduce love and marriage to the scientific and practical.

Now, you mention "La La" land... I know what you refer to. I have felt the pull, as I think most people on here have -- if they are honest.

It is a dangerous siren, waiting to wreck you on the rocks.

But is the solution to this to stop all emotion and make your decision based solely on practicality?

At some point, love is based on faith. Reason can bring you to the edge of the cliff, but it takes faith to get you to jump off.

Yes, I am a romantic. No apologies.

I have lived that way all of my life...

I knew I wanted to marry my ex-wife after three dates.

Someone can jump on that and say "aha! See that? Doesn't that prove to you that you need to be more pragmatic and less romantic?"

And I would say to them: Not at all. I had some of the happiest moments of my life during the three years we were married.

I don't know if you are an animal lover, but I really have had some great dogs in my life. One of the best dogs I ever had died last summer. He lived, interestingly enough, three years.

I will admit, I suffered great pain when he died.

Guess what: Every dog will one day break your heart. They live ten years on an average. Get close to a dog, and eventually he will die and leave you.

So... should I never own a dog again?

Nonsense...

The God who created my heart also created in it the capacity to heal.

So... I got divorced. A great love affair of mine ended.

And if I had to do it over again... would I?

You bet.

Even though it ended. Even though at the end, there was pain. I wouldn't have missed it. On balance, the good outweighed the pain.

Life is full of Pain. And it is full of great moments of joy.

I will not let my fear of the former rob me of the latter...

... in response to "insights and analyses"..., posted by MarkInTx on Jun 17, 2002

hahaha
you are quite the exquisite preparer of words. I have to admit, it is a pleasure reading you post-just for the shear eloquence of it.
Joe

... in response to I sure wish I had your spelling talents!, posted by yoe on Jun 17, 2002

Sometimes I just post and go...

But most of the time, I will cut and paste my post, and put it into Eudora, which runs an instant spell check for me. I correct my (MANY!) mistakes there, and then re-paste it.

It takes very little time, and helps me keep up the illusion that I actually know how to spell!

... in response to "insights and analyses"..., posted by MarkInTx on Jun 17, 2002

asdf

... in response to can not disagree with you. n/t, posted by greg2 on Jun 17, 2002


Just when I find someone with intellect to debate... ;-)

Hmmm... maybe the real test of intellect is knowing when it makes no sense to debate, huh?

Don't be such a stranger, Greg... I always enjoy your posts...

... in response to ..."insights and analyses"..., posted by MarkInTx on Jun 16, 2002

nt