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Tonight I just got back from 10 ghastly nights in jail, the product of my first and only arrest, a rather horrible experience for a 62-year-old with diabetes and arthritis. And I owe it all to my lovely Russian wife, age 45.

We were married September a year ago, after a whirlwind (1 year) Internet romance. My idea was that, even if the marriage did not work, at least I would be rescuing a woman and her son from a terrible existance in St. Petersburg. (Had I met her 18-year-old son, Ivan the Terrible, on my only visit with her in Russia, I know I would have searched elsewhere for a bride. Over the past year, I have not been able to elicit one conversation out of this kid -- only grunts.) It was a classic case of no good deed going unpunished. The marriage is now ending looking something like a painting of the torments of Hell by H. Bosch.

It was not long after the civil marriage ceremony that I knew this romance was never going to be a romance. For one thing, I never heard her say she loved me. Not once. (Strange she couldn't lie about that, too, as she did with so many other things.) Within four months, it was obvious she was only here to get her green card and get her sullen, arrogant kid into an American university. (Now that the universities in Russia are no longer free, she had no hope of getting him into one there.) She nagged and attacked from morning til night. She disliked romantic play, did not understand teasing, and would turn the most innocent remark into some kind of attack on her or Russians in general. After a while, everything DID become an attack on her or Russians in general. In short, she taught me to hate her.

But when I suggested divorce, she practically went into epileptic fits, yelling that I had promised her a place in America, etc., etc. I would think about it overnight, then relent. Eventually I settled on a plan whereby we would share the house (but not my bed) until the conditions were removed from her visa. When she and her kid obtained employment, they would share in covering the living expenses. This was especially necessary, as my jobs were general contract affairs, with periods of unemployment between them.

When I got laid off in September, I pointed out to her that I needed $500 a month out of their salaries until I got back to work. She was not happy about that, but protested only a little. Then, a week ago, she decided she could go off on her own and not run the risk of deportation for breaking up the marriage. Her plan?: portray me as a vicious wife-beater and psychological abuser.

I fell right into the trap. When she told me she was moving out without paying some of her bills (especially the $750 phone bill she ran up on calls to Russia), I went ballistic. There was an argument which ended with me throwing one of her silk blouses at her. (That was the extent of the "violence.") She rushed out and called the police.

Little did I know that in Texas they can throw a guy in jail on an uncorroborated charge of abuse by a woman. Had I no more than raised my voice to her, she could have had me arrested, thanks to the Draconian laws of this state.

Once I went into the pokey, I had a hell of a time getting out. Now I face big attorney's bills because of her actions. Meanwhile, during the time I was sitting in the hell of the Travis County Correctional Facility, her son was ripping off my computer, a CD player, and a backpack. With the money they had been stashing away, they rented an apartment and bought a car. They have moved off to parts unknown, and I don't care to know where they are, as I have no desire for any kind of further contact with these two.

Needless to say, I am now determined to get this woman deported before the conditions are removed from her visa. America does not need this kind of citizen.

I am posting this message as a warning to those who think all Russian women will be eternally grateful for the opportunity you give them for a better life (some may be, and you may even get a "Thanks" from them, but don't count on it). For what it's worth, I have met five couples here in Austin where the man is American and the woman Russian. Two of the couples are younger, with the spouses under 30. These appear to be okay matches. But for the three where the husband is over 40, either he or the wife do not appear to be happy at all.

A second reason for posting this is to solicit opinion from those with similar experiences. I had taken this woman to be somewhat naive, someone who was excessively unfamiliar with American bureaucratic procedures and even a bit dumb. But I now think she knew all along what she was doing; to say she is devious and manipulative is to use terms that are much too mild. I believe Russian women over a certain age are skilled con artists with survival skills they learned in order to deals with the harsh realities of life in Soviet (and Glasnost) Russia.

I would not care that this woman skipped out on her bills or even that her son had lifted some stuff that did not belong to me had she not gotten me thrown into the slammer on a bogus charge of violence against her. Are there any suggestions out there on how I can assure that this harridan and her evil spawn get their butts kicked back to St. Petersburg where they belong?

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

Get to know them a little better next time.  If she doesn't appear to like you at all, why the heck are you marrying her?  There's another board for guys like you, find it and join your fellow complainers!

My friend got thrown into one of the worst jails in the US but his wife was American.  He spent 4 nights in jail and was threatened by other inmates for complaining about being thrown in jail.    

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

My what a horror story. Sorry to hear this and thank you for taking the time to post your experience.

First of all you need to realize that you have placed yourself in a position to be a look a like of a typical troll so do not be offended by such being suggested.

Why do I say this? - because so many times before the pattern of the troll can imitate your scenario - first time poster who comes here after the fact with a horrible story. This is a typical troll approach. Usually people who have not posted and have such an experience are not looking for Russian forums to talk.

Your reasons for coming here now at this time, as best I can tell, could be two fold.

One is to get advice as to what to do now since the event. This most likely is not the best forum to find those answers. There is another site that was started by Shane Neff where there are several men who have had problems like you describe. This would be an excellent place to present that question. Guys here are either searching, in process or happily married. I can not give you that address but I am sure someone here can.

Your second reason would be because you are of a compassionate and  altruistic nature and being such, you are compelled to do what you can to try and help someone else avoid that which was your plight.

Most likely no one knows you here. You could be a gentle kind man who has had a terrible experience or you could be a real ass hole trying to force a situation on your lady. No one really knows at first when you present yourself. So, there will be questions posed. As dialogue ensues you start to form shape hopefully reflecting correctly who you are. If trolls did not exist, you would not be put through this. Just accept it, don't get upset with anyone here - blame it on trolls and you will be correct.

If you honestly want to help others to not go through what you have gone through, more than just the unfortunate facts of the end result are needed. I would encourage you to share as much as you can. Simply telling guys to not seek a bride from the FSU will not help most as they will proceed anyway.

The types of things that can help would be what warning signs did you see that you did not take seriously. They had to be there. This will help others to not make the same mistake of ignoring such.

How much precaution did you take? Did you just jump into this? How many times did you go see her?  Did you have a prenuptial done? Did you seek advice along the way at some other forum? Did you ever read this forum before bringing her over here? At age 62 how do you look compared to her? Do you look like a good match? Why did you look to the FSU? All of this would be helpful.

Again, I am sorry for what you went through - others have gone through worse and others have their dream wife years after the two year limit has passed. It is all about being the latter position and not the former and any information that you can provide that might help someone get the latter versus your result will be greatly appreciated.

In time this will all be over for you, just hang in there.

... in response to Could have been worse could have been pe..., posted by thesearch on Dec 14, 2001

1

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

Man that is ONE sad story. Hey check this out. I had this AW, I paid for all of her clothes, food, housecleaning. Seh never did one dish or cooked one meal or washed one pair of panities--------------and she had the gall to write checks off my corporate account to her, steal my $500 watch and a Gold Graduation ring-MY MOM GOT ME-----------then sleep with other dudes...........................poor me..........poop on that dude...............I knew what was up-I just did not want to see it. Let it go bro. You asked for it now learn from it and move on. If you think that is bad..............I got a story of my college 'love' who was having sex with a republican congressman.
Good luck dude,
Joe

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

anybody should think about Russian women is that they are naive or don't know anything about US laws. Believe me, if she does not know now she would learn after she gets to USA.

As I discovered, there is more information posted on internet and discussed between Russian women here about divorces, legal rights, freezing assets, separation than any other topic - and that is not because all Russian women are shrewd, but because there are very different stories from both sides.

There are a lot of questions to the story as with any situation, but what strikes me the most is one question "why did you marry her?" - she never said she loved you, you never SAW her son, you made only ONE visit to Russia. What were you thinking? It is the most "polite" question I can come up with.

Honestly, I don't think there is much you can do about it. If she does have green card - no matter if it is temporary or permanent one, she can not be kicked out of the country. And I am sure she knows that as well.

Russian Wife

... in response to Last thing, posted by RW on Dec 14, 2001

One more thing. My wife has a conditional resident visa. This is supposed to mean that her stay here is not guaranteed unless one condition is met: that the couple remain married for two years.

As I understand it, this condition is not being enforced by the INS. The woman has only to demonstrate her husband battered her -- as evidenced by her call to 911 -- to get around that condition.

If the INS is not going to enforce this stipulation (and, admittedly, there are good reasons for not enforcing it), then the agency should tighten up the rules for the K-1 visa. Maybe they should require that contact between the man and woman be for something like 30 days over a two-year period before submitting an application. They should also discourage female treasure hunters by making exceptions to the community property laws for a set number of days that would be a trial period for the relationship. And, for that matter, the man should have to put into escrow an amount that guarantees a return fare to Russia during that period. Finally, the 90-day grace period before a required marriage should be extended to 180 days, and this would be the trial period.

... in response to Re: Last thing, posted by doctahd on Dec 15, 2001

Maybe the man (that would be - or at least *should* be - YOU) would take responsibility for themselves - rather than whine and moan that someone else should protect stupid men from themselves. Don't you think??

As for the "trial period" - the K-1 is not now, and never was, intended to allow a "trial period" before marriage. It was designed to accommodate those people who had met someone overseas and fallen in love and wanted to find a mechanism to allow them into this country legally so they could marry *here*. It has always been possible for a US citizen to marry elsewhere and then petition for the new spouse to enter the US (albeit sometimes with a lengthy wait) - but not always possible for a fiance to enter the US legally for purposes of marriage here.

So it would seem that you propose:

a) revision to the visa regulations so that petitioners may bring people into the country for a "trial" marriage - presumably so that it will be easier to send them away if things are not to the petitioner's satisfaction (you know, snoring or walking with a slouch - whatever), and

b) institute legislation that would push more of the burden of making good decisions to law-makers, rather than the person making the decision taking that responsibility themselves.

Yep - you're absolutely correct - you'll fit right in over at the Whiny-boys board (that would be the RWNA-TT board).

- Dan

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

Your story line sounds just like what we are looking for.

WE are always looking for failed foreign marriage stories.  Your sounds perfect for the part.

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

It seems like that evil piece of sh!t Shane Neff his having a recruiting drive for his cult again.

-blm

... in response to Looks like we're being attacked by RWNA ..., posted by BarryM on Dec 14, 2001

posts assumed to be valid??

... in response to Why are negative posts assumed to be Tro..., posted by juio99 on Dec 14, 2001

But the stories sound so familiar.

... in response to Why are negative posts assumed to be Tro..., posted by juio99 on Dec 14, 2001

because a lot of people here are living in a dream....
don't buy all the bulls h*t you read on msg boards...go there for urself and get ur own opinion of it, this is the best advice i can give u...
But in my opinon, after a few times only u start to understand pple there, and i'm just saying that u start...
For me Russians are like matriochkas...it's a surprise after another one, but that' s why they are so interesting!

... in response to Why are negative posts assumed to be Tro..., posted by juio99 on Dec 14, 2001

If you had - you'd know that many regular posters offer some rather horrific stories - and we KNOW they are not trolls. It is the ones that pop in here for the first time, claiming to have been around a while - and with the same general tone and lack of substance to their posts - that arouse suspicion.

Unlike some claims, this board is NOT all about the positives of women from the FSU. Quite to the contrary, there are loads of reports of scammers and the potholes that can befall the unwary.

Read the board - you may find something of value here.

- Dan

... in response to You Haven't Been Reading the Board for L..., posted by Dan on Dec 14, 2001

Doctah D again.

Trolls?

I guess there are all kinds of nut cases who write into various forums around the Web, so maybe I shouldn't be surprised that there may be bogus messages about bogus RW being the queens of evil.

Trust me, mine isn't bogus. I was simply so surprised and shocked that this marriage turned this bad this quickly and (though I shouldn't be so surprised by this) that a woman would be so desperate to hit the U.S. jackpot she would enter into a marriage she didn't really desire. (By the way, I don't believe this woman had this devious master plan worked out from the get-go to pass her first INS hurdle, get a job, then kick me into jail; I think she picked up the information on how to do this elsewhere. I think she really did believe she would grow to love me and that I would grow to accept her horrible kid. Neither dream came true.)

I wrote into this site because I only now found it. I wanted to warn AM to do the reality checks I skipped and to find out if there was anything I could do to guarantee this woman will not continue to play hopscotch with my life. I guess I'm looking in the wrong place for that.

... in response to Looks like we're being attacked by RWNA ..., posted by BarryM on Dec 14, 2001

No one is "attacking" anyone except you.  A guy tells a story, and true or not, it is NOT some kind of attack.  Leave that poor guy Neff alone, you seem to have some kind of vendetta against him.  Are all Orthodox Christians paranoid like you?   Give it a rest!

... in response to From a famous movie..."What is your..., posted by Stevo on Dec 14, 2001

The movie line was "What is your malfunction, Private Pyle?!"...the words uttered by the drill sargeant played by R. Lee Ermy to "Private Pyle" played by Vincent D'Onofrio in Stanley Kubricks "Full Metal Jacket".

Just a correction.

-blm

... in response to From a famous movie..."What is your..., posted by Stevo on Dec 14, 2001

For those new here, BarryM and Shane Neff have a long-standing feud.

The story goes:
Shane was married to a RW, and eventually things took a turn south.  Shane said he tried to go to the local Russian Orthodox Church for marriage counseling, but instead the parrish priest further split them apart, advising his wife to file false Domestic Violence charges or something and dumping him.  Whether this is true or not, I don't know; I wasn't there.  Suffice it to say that now Shane has all the love for the Orthodox Church that a person who was molested by a priest in his youth might have for religion and God in general: not very much.

Barry, if memory serves me, converted to the Orthodox faith as a way to grow closer to his own Russian wife.  He found it to be spiritually satisfying and supportive.  So naturally he has all the religious fervor of a recent convert.

In each case, you have people shaped by their diametrically opposed experiences.  And think, who are the most annoying and preachy non-smokers?  Ex-smokers, of course.

Now, Shane avoids this board, and Barry avoids the RWNA-TT board.  If you don't see both, you only get one side of the fight.  So it appears that Barry has declared Jihad against anything that hints of Shane and his board.  And whenever anyone comes on and hints that all RW are less than perfect saints, he is quick to load up his plane with C-4 and drive it into their building.  Is he a whack job or a Defender of the Faith?  Personally, I think he's just a nice guy trying to practice a little old fashioned Chivalry and defend his lady's honor.

As for the original post, IMNSHO, Jeff is correct.  Not only did this guy breeze past some obvious red flags (an easy mistake we can all make since red flags are just "caution warnings" after all), but he blew right thru some barricades in his eagerness to: a. end his loneliness;  b. play out a fantasy role as a Knight in Shining Armor rescuing a fair damsel.  He may find a more sympathetic ear among the RWNA group, but I suspect even they will call him up short on some obvious blunders to avoid should he decide to be part of the RWTT set.

... in response to WWF Smackdown presents: Barry vs. Shane!, posted by Bob S. on Dec 14, 2001

I don't know what IMNSHO means, but I'm the guy who did the original post, and you are absolutely correct in your summation of me.

In my defense, I never spotted any support groups when I began my Russian quest back in 1998. Either they weren't there or I was insufficiently adept at hunting them down. (I believe Google was not available then.)

Although it sounds like it may be a choir singing songs of death and immolation in the fires of Heck to those who already know the awful truth about their fate, I'd like to take my chances with the RWNA group. (Which stands for "Russian Women... N?....A?...?) Where do I find it?

To those who have found happiness with their Russian brides, I am very happy for you and happy that you have affirmed my faith that good things possibly could have come out of my marriage to a Russian woman. The RIGHT Russian woman.

... in response to Re: WWF Smackdown presents: Barry vs. Sh..., posted by doctahd on Dec 15, 2001


IMNSHO = In my not so humble opinion
RWNA = Russian women - Never again

As others have said, your story sounds quite a bit like a (what we take to be fictional) account that members of feminist groups like to come here, pretend they're distraught American men, and post every week or so, then after generating lots of comment, come back with "you're all a bunch of losers" conclusion. Sorry to hear your story and best of luck to you. If you search the archives for RWNA, I'm sure you'll come across the website address.

-- Jeff S.

... in response to Re: Re: WWF Smackdown presents: Barry vs..., posted by Jeff S on Dec 15, 2001

Thanks, Jeff,

It's good to see there's at least one human being who uses this board.

I swear on a stack of bibles and Boy Scout manuals my story is true. I don't know why feminists would come in with bogus stories. According to an article I read tonight, there are now more single men in the 35-45 age group than women in the 30-40 age group in the U.S., so the women shouldn't have any gripes about guys searching for Russian brides. In Russia, the ratio greatly disadvantages single women.

Well, I can tell when I'm not wanted and that there are a goodly number of A holes using this site (I'll bet Barry is really a scrawny wimp with an inferiority complex who hides behind the anonymity of this page to flame anyone who gets in his sights.)

But, again, thanks Jeff for being different than these other guys.

I won't be back again.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: WWF Smackdown presents: Barr..., posted by doctahd on Dec 16, 2001

You were stupid enough to post here before you understood what this board stood for and, by the way, I think you're lying to us. Your story sounds like a broken record from the usual feminazis and RWNA trolls that spew their garbage here.

Jeff, by the way, is interested in Asians. Going by his profile, he is kind of out of place here.

As far as an inferiority complex goes, the fact is that no one achieves superiority by flaming the likes of you, but someone has to shotgun the vermin and clear up the bullsh!t that the likes of you post here. My humble role in this makes the sincere posters look good on here.

-blm

... in response to Hey jerk off, get lost., posted by BarryM on Dec 16, 2001

Hey, Barry, I think that you should learn to be more tolerant of other people.  I would like to remind you that, as Jack recently pointed out, we have some real life members, (Jeff from Pennsylvania) and King Dande for example, whose stories had all the marks of troll posts.  However, they proved not to be trolls.  

I would like to suggest that you give the good Doctah a chance.  If you are right,  he will hang himself.  On the other hand, he may prove to be an upright member of our community her.

Welcome aboard DoctahD!

... in response to WWF Smackdown presents: Barry vs. Shane!, posted by Bob S. on Dec 14, 2001

I have seen Shane's "My Story" propagated all over the internet since 1999. He hit most of the Internet dating sites a long time ago... dating sites for AW/AM by regions. I saw one of the first incarnations of the "Story" on Matchmaker.com I think in late 1999 or early 2000. That was long before I even considered pursuing RW/UW.

If anyone is fanatical about his cause, it is Shane. That bigoted nutcase is relentless in his denigration of international dating of RW/UW and the Orthodox Church. He also is urging his followers to lobby Congress to shut down the MOB business and restrict k-1's for RW/UW. His motivations are ego and power rather than some altruistic sympathy for us "victims" of greedy RW/UW and agency owners.

I did not actively flame him until he rudely intruded on here and RWA. I did not accuse him of lying until I saw contradictory posts by him on other boards around 1999-2000. His accusations against the Orthodox Church are false and reflect his personal bias against us.

I only started my tirades against him around spring of this year. There was no one else objecting to his false statements and he seemed to convince everyone on here. I stood alone against his evil and he showed his true colors on here.

There still exists on several board's archives some of his past posts that reflect a much more contradictory "Shane" than most PL members have seen. Occationally, an internet search on "Shane Neff" will show some of them. Find out for yourself. Most of the incriminating stuff is now vapor unfortunately.

-blm

... in response to WWF Smackdown presents: Barry vs. Shane!, posted by Bob S. on Dec 14, 2001

I think that's a good explanation of why Barry acts the way he does.  Makes me feel as if I've been a little rough on him. {grin}

... in response to WWF Smackdown presents: Barry vs. Shane!, posted by Bob S. on Dec 14, 2001

Thanks Bob; I think we can ask every one to calm down.

Mark

... in response to From a famous movie..."What is your..., posted by Stevo on Dec 14, 2001

Your comment regarding Orthodox Christianity - or faith of any kind - was a shot below the belt.

As for Shane Neff - he has well-earned any "vendetta" that anyone chooses to launch against him and his board of whiny-boys. Neff's vitriolic attacks against this very board Stevo - and the persons, such as yourself, who post here - are well documented in the archives.

Yes, Barry can be a bit harsh in his responses - and yes *MAYBE* this new poster is merely relating an honest and sincere story. Then again . . . .

- Dan

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

Why does your profile say you were married since 1998, but you indicate in your story you were married in September one year ago (if my date calcs are correct, that would put it at September 2000)??

Have you visited this board previously, or is this your first time here?

LOTS of other questions, but let's just start here.

- Dan

... in response to Uhhh - Not That I Don't Believe You, But..., posted by Dan on Dec 14, 2001

I just checked my profile. The question asks "When did you first develop a curiosity...etc.? I first developed a curiosity in 1998, as stated.

... in response to Uhhh - Not That I Don't Believe You, But..., posted by Dan on Dec 14, 2001

I don't know why my profile says I was married in 1998. That's when I first made contact with the little woman on the Web. Perhaps I was up too late when I wrote that. Yeah, that must be it, because I don't even recall writing a profile.

The lateness of the hour might also explain why I posted a message the first time I found the forum. I'd just gotten out of jail and I desperately wanted to find out how I could stop the damage to my life. I'm beginning to get the point that I can't stop it as long as she wants to continue doing damage.

... in response to Re: Uhhh - Not That I Don't Believe You,..., posted by doctahd on Dec 15, 2001

you weren't thinking clearly when you wrote your profile and likewise when you you thought that you would be a knight in shining armor, saving this poor lady from her life of misery. And not meeting her son before you brought him over is in my book 1 of the dumbest of all. Then when you realize that you have no relationship, you offer her to be roommates w/ you. And now you come crying to us, what do you expect, a shoulder to cry on?
But now that you've been ridiculed, why not get a lawyer and maybe think about sueing for false charges and then your lawyer can offer her to drop the suit after she drops the charges, after putting some major pressure on her. And maybe call the cops and press charges of theft of your computer and the other missing items. And lastly grow up and take responcibility for yourself.

... in response to Uhhh - Not That I Don't Believe You, But..., posted by Dan on Dec 14, 2001

We can smell BS a mile away.  Trolls should write out their story line and get their dates right before they start posting.

... in response to You have an excellent eye Dan, posted by BubbaGump on Dec 14, 2001

Whenever I see a post such as the one above, I consider it an automatic flame. Anyone who is authentic would not make such a post on here, especially his first post. Someone who starts posting here without taking the time to read the content of this forum is an idiot. I lurked on here for close to 3 months before I started posting.

As far as I'm concerned, such trolls are open season and I have no problem nuking them. I don't believe in that touchy feely "lets be nice to the stupid nasty people and have an open mind" type of crap that some seem to espouse on here.

Flame them.

-blm

... in response to Those bozos are easy to spot., posted by BarryM on Dec 14, 2001

Not that that bothers me any.  Flame on young Barry.  Somebody has to take the lead flame role.

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

You married her without her ever saying she loved you? and married he and took on responsibility for her son without ever having spoken to him? Maybe you should read Dr. Laura's book, "Ten Stupid Things Men Do to Mess Up Their Lives."
-- Jeff S.

... in response to Re: My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by Jeff S on Dec 14, 2001

I don't want to blame him; he is already hurting. This is not a blame game. If the woman said " I love you " and if he had spoken to the son, would the outcome be any different? I have heard plenty of similar stoies in which the woman prefessed her love for the man... ten times a day before the marriage.

Mark

... in response to Re: Re: My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by mdante99 on Dec 14, 2001

Thanks.

And you make a very good point. It's difficult to detect true love, and it's doubly difficult when there are language barriers and culture clashes involved.

... in response to Re: Re: My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by mdante99 on Dec 14, 2001

I'm not trying to start a blame game here and I am truly sympathetic to what happened to him. I also feel that false domestic violence charges are unconscionable, not just because they screw up the life of the accused, but they also dilute truly dangerous situations with a lot of crying wolf. That being said, though, by his own admission:

"We were married .. after a whirlwind .. Internet romance. My idea was that, even if the marriage did not work, at least I would be rescuing a woman and her son from a terrible existance in St. Petersburg."

It doesn't sound like the basis for a strong, close marriage to me. For any newbys or lurkers out there (this site gets over 30,000 hits a day and only a couple dozen posts) anyone naieve enough to think that they're some knight in shining armour out to rescue a sweet young thing from the horrors of a third world existance should be plenty aware of the fallacy of that kind of thinking.

-- Jeff S.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: My Horrible Russian Experien..., posted by Jeff S on Dec 14, 2001

Jeff,

I'm now aware of the fallacy of that kind of thinking.

Admittedly, I've been a slow learner.

... in response to My Horrible Russian Experience, posted by doctahd on Dec 14, 2001

I have to assume that your story is true.
At least some lessons can be learned.

1. A cool temper is very paramount; for those without one, marriage in general and AM/RW relationship in particular is not adisable. This though is easier said than done.

2. There are  considerable cultural differences, a clear understanding of those is very essential. RW are not American, they don't think like one, act like one, or behave like one and marriage with one is NOT a cakewalk.

3. When you bring a child with the woman, you are bringing additional responsibilities that make the relationship even more vulnerable, and you must be prepared for it.

4. The first year is the most crucial year; if you see that it is not working out, it is best to very amicably buy her a plane ticket home.

5. Vindictiveness does not solve the problem; " getting even" does very little to improve either party financially or emotionally. Accept that the marriage did not work out, and offer to pay her to go back; inter-cultural marriage did not work for you... without putting the blame on anyone. People are different; that does not make them either good or bad. I respectfully disagree with the general notion that there are some " bad " RW; and somehow one can avoid these bad ones and a find a " good " one; and then life will be hunky dory. The problem is in interpersonal relationship which is made at least ten times more difficult with cultural differences between the parties.

6. A carefully drawn pre-nuptial agreement prepared by a Russian speaking lawyer should be a "sine que non" for such marriages; a pre-nupt usually spells out what would happen in your circumstances, among other things... mine does.

I am sure there are other lessons.

Mark

... in response to Lessons Learned, posted by mdante99 on Dec 14, 2001

Thanks for your points.

The trouble began when I did suggest she return to Russia about four months into the marriage. She had absolutely no desire to return and stated such in no uncertain terms. It was then, I think, that she saw me as a threat to her well-being and the die was cast for her eventual escape from the marriage.

As for a pre-nuptial agreement, it just never occured to me.

... in response to Lessons Learned, posted by mdante99 on Dec 14, 2001

On Pre-nuptials.

- Dan