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Hi Guys,

Things are proceeding fine with my girl and the long distance thing we've got going. I am planning to get down there in the next few months when work allows.

The only doubt I've had recently was with me telling her - te quiero. I've said it twice so far, once on the phone and once in a message.

Maybe I'm a sap for saying it without having met her, but hey, I'm calling it how I feel it. Anyway, both times she has responded - me too (yo tambien). She hasn't said - yo te quiero - to me yet herself.

Kinda makes me wonder because in English when you tell someone I love you and they say me too, it's kind of not the same emotion as saying I love you too. You know, using the L-word.

Am I the only that thinks like this about this subject? My Spanish is pretty good but sometimes the meaning just doesn't compute you know?

Below are some of the things she has written me in Spanish. I was hoping to get some feedback from you guys fluent in Spanish about how sincere she might be. Of course it's damn near impossible over the internet but hey.

Stuff she wrote...
Acabo de escuchar la canción que me enviaste, y si, estoy dispuesta a abrir mi corazon para ti, quiero que seas mi bendición, mi luz y mi sol... Tu eres todo.

Solo quiero que sepas que siento que eres el hombre que siempre he buscado en mi vida. Te agradezco por enseñarme que es posible realmente ser feliz...Besos

Tu eres lo mas sorprenderte que ha pasado en esta vida. Eres precioso! Te espero.

Tu eres la chispa que encendió el motor de mi corazón y las ganas de ser mejor cada dia. Muchisimo besos para ti.

Igual me encanto haber hablado contigo, me pareces una persona muy agradable y lindo. Espero poder hablar muy pronto contigo nuevamente. Muchos besos y abrazos.

Maybe I'm reading too much into it. Maybe she isn't isn't ready to say it yet, and a bit of patience from me is needed.

Gracias.
BobEsponja

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

Well I didn't have to wait long for that to happen. I've just let things roll on quietly without mentioning it. She told me on the phone today "te quiero mucho". Dunno why I was so impatient or insecure. Have to work on that.
Thanks all.
By the way she is from Peru, not Colombia. And she has already taken her profile off amigos.com, which to me is a good sign she's serious. She only signed up in April. Damn I'm glad I checked that site out!
Buena suerte a todos.
BobEsponja

... in response to she said it, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 13, 2005

Bob, you sound like a smart guy. Take her statement of love with a grain of salt. it is very positive that she said it and shows a lot of interest but dont get your hopes up until you meet. you have not met, right? also, have a backup plan when you do. True love does not form over the internet or telephone. It does not form even over a couple months together. True love takes time

... in response to Re: she said it, posted by papi on Jul 13, 2005

You're right Papi. But then again no two relationships are quite the same.

Is my understanding that "te quiero" and "te amo" are slightly different ways of saying "I love you" correct?

"Te amo" is more meaningful? You fluent guys out there, what is your call?
BobEsponja

... in response to Re: Re: she said it, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 13, 2005

As Papi said, take whatever the chica said w/ a grain of salt until AT LEAST you meet them in person.  Many latinas i've met in S.America are VERY affectionate with actions AND WORDS.  Most americans guys ONLY say I LOVE YOU in two instances a) we wanna get laid or b) we REALLY mean it.  We don't throw it out there very often ESPECIALLY the second one.  BUT i've notice Latinas say it with alot more frequency.  Doesnt mean they're lying, it just means that's how they feel AT THE MOMENT(aqui & ahora).  Things can change for one day to the next.

... in response to Re: Re: she said it, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 13, 2005

both are expressions of romantic love - which is premature in your case. saying it is ok and a positive sign yet again you need to meet and spend time together before these expressions can take on any real meaning. I stress again, have a backup plan - maybe an agency lined up in the event things dont unfold as planned

... in response to Re: Re: she said it, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 13, 2005

te quiero mucho is..i really like you a lot...but te amo is much stronger, this is love you.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: she said it, posted by jediknight on Jul 13, 2005

[This message has been edited by Red Clay]

Te quiero can be, and is, said to a relative, sibling, parent, etc. to mean "I love you". Te amo is only for your special lady, gf, fiancee, spouse, etc.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: she said it, posted by Red Clay on Jul 13, 2005

te quiero is also used between lovers

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: she said it, posted by papi on Jul 13, 2005

Yes, spouses and lovers will say te quiero but you can say te quiero to almost anyone that you care about. You don't say te amo to your dog or your friends unless you're sleeping with them.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: she said it, posted by jediknight on Jul 13, 2005

my impression is that te quiero is heard more often and is an expression of love stronger than I like you. TQM or te quiero mucho - i love you very much

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

Bob,

I am the last one to try to give you advice on all the ends and outs of a relationship with a latina.  Having said that, I can tell that I just recently came out of a situation where I corresponded with a latina for 5 months.  In May, I went to see her in Cali, and I was even more impressed.  I thought all was well, and then I came home, and everything started to unravel.  However, that is not to say that everyone will have the same experiences.  In fact, I would say right the opposite.  So, basically, just go see her and then only time will tell.  But,  don't read too much into great, romantic emails.  I had many, sweet, romantic emails and thought I knew the woman; but I did not.  Other men here have had great success. Who can figure it out?  I can't.  I wish you every happiness; just don't get your hopes too high at this point.  Then there is the the part of having a Plan B.  Well, that is too long to go into, but it is a good idea.  Best of luck to you.

                          OkieMan

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by OkieMan on Jul 11, 2005

On the issue of "writing it" but not "meaning it", is it related to the "scammer" phenomenon?  I wonder if your friend started in the relationship with the idea of using you as possibly a "green card" ticket.  Then, after meeting you, she learned to respect you, and could not follow through with it knowing it would hurt you.

Latins live in a religious culture, and my experience is that Latins I have met have a conscience and a sense of right and wrong.  I suspect a Latino scammer would be more than willing to scam someone if that person were involved in immoral or unethical behavior.  However, he or she may be hesitant to truly scam someone who is genuine in his motives.  Take the "gringo tax" as an example.  The logic goes that since you are a rich American, at least in stereotype, you can well afford to pay more than the going rate for service.  However, that does not mean the hotel is going to take your Visa card and empty everything from your bank account just because you are a gringo--even though a crooked hotel employee might do just that...

I know of Pilipinas that set up sham marriages with willing American accomplices.  If they both have other partners, it is a green-card sham, and stays at that; I have never actually met any of these.  On the other hand, if it is a scam on the American man without his knowledge, the story is very different.  They show the saying that love is composed of actions with the feelings that tend to follow.  So far, I cannot even name one scammer with an unwitting American parter that ever returned to her real husband/boyfriend out of the seven (possibly ten when counting elderly couples).  Out of this group, only two have actually divorced their American partners, and both that have divorced their American partners have married other Americans.

Okie, there is probably something there about which she did not tell you. It could be another fellow, a physical problem, family pressure, or even other children she about which she did not tell you.  She may have lied to you about some part of her background or family situation, and after you left, came to the realization that eventually she would be discovered. Or, if she really did develop feelings for you, she may have feared she would not have the ability to control those feelings in the event this really was an attempt at a green card.  Yes, things may have unraveled after you left for the states, but a gut feeling tells me this is unlikely.

Anybody else have some thoughts?

Mark

... in response to Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by lapentier on Jul 12, 2005

Thanks for the thought, but I would as soon let it die.  I could second guess all of this until I die or retire; but I don't want to.  It bugs me to no end, but I am trying to just let go and move on.

                      OkieMan

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by OkieMan on Jul 12, 2005

The main reason I posted this response was to show that sometimes when things don't work out, it is for the better.  Being honest and forthright is frequently the best policy, and in this case, it may have really kept you out of trouble.

Best wishes,

Mark

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by OkieMan on Jul 11, 2005

you are so right okie, just cause they write it - does not mean they mean it

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

It's hard to make a judgement on her words without knowing much about her.  Nonetheless, much of it sounds a little too desperate considering she hasn't even met you yet.

I just hope no money is being sent her way.

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by doombug on Jul 11, 2005

Doombug,

No money is being sent her way.

Just as an aside - when I said I'm definitly coming to visit, she said it is "us" who will pay for it together because this trip is for "us" to get to know each other.

She wants me to pay my airfare only and her to pay for everything for both of us while I'm in Peru. I said I'm not happy for her to do that, but she insists. At this stage we've decided to agree to disagree and we'll figure it out when I get there.

Is that common for say a Latin girl to offer to do that for her Gringo boyfriend coming to visit? Obviously it depends on her financial situation, the majority of girls would not be able to do that however much they wanted to.

BobEsponja

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by doombug on Jul 11, 2005

it is hard to judge but depending on the number of calls or emials two people have and the content of the conversations, it is entirely possible that you could start to develop feelings or an attraction, just don't let it get out of hand until you've actually met
JK

... in response to Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by jediknight on Jul 11, 2005

I agree.  And Malandro's post below yours provides a perfect example of the pitfalls.

I had a similar situaion.  I started getting attached to a lady friend from the Ukraine, but instead decided to just let the lovey-dovey part die out.  I kind of realized that everything we'd shared up to that point would end up having been said in vain if we didn't click in person.

It was a waste of time, basically.  Sort of like reading a romance novel (which I don't!), and not being the buff dude on the cover who's gettin' all the action.

... in response to Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by jediknight on Jul 11, 2005

with an American woman (actually German living in the states) through Match.com

they started out writing each other and then moved to phone calls.  My friend's strategy was just that, to develop an emotional relationship with her before they met so that when they actually did meet, HE thought it would go smoothly and she would fall lovingly and willingly into his arms.

the phone calls would sometimes last 1 to 2 hours.  She used my friend as a sounding board and he enthusiastically participated as it fit the "strategy" perfectly.  Now  this lasted for about 3 months.  Remember now, they live in very near proximity, not US and Colombia, and they haven't met yet.  

They finally went out one time.   A couple of days letter she left a message on my buddy's answering machine stating that she wasn't interested.

So, I do not recommend this strategy to anyone whatsoever.  what a complete waste of time.  You need to meet as soon as possible and put it on the line and not set yourself up for a big emotional let down.

... in response to I have a friend who followed that strate..., posted by Malandro on Jul 11, 2005

unreal, left a message on the machine

... in response to I have a friend who followed that strate..., posted by Malandro on Jul 11, 2005

its not a complete waste of time because its worked for me and others that i know that have met their wives through amigos.com.
it could be a waste of time if you don't know how to handle a relationship like that, if you focus on just one girl before meeting her, then you are taking a risk because meeting someone face to face is different than having a relationship over the phone/internet. before meeting my finacee, i had met up with local girls in nyc that i met through amigos.com, most were very nice but there wasn't a connection.
with long distance relationships, its better to write to a few at a time, maybe even in the same city that you plan on traveling to so you can meet all of them. sometimes it isn't feasible to meet that person for a while, because of work or money, whatever, the point is to enjoy the communication you have with that person without letting your emotions get out of control. be realistic, i was writing to 4 girls including my fiancee at one time. my finacee was in barranquilla and the others were in bogota, but i visited bogota first,met the other 3, one was very nice but not what i was looking for, the other was great over the phone but in person didn't have much to say and the other i started to detect red flags so i just cut her loose.  then months later i met my fiancee and we both fell for each other, it can work if you don't put your hopes in only one person.
JK

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

so I would not put 1 iota of stock in those romantic messages she sent you.

in fact, Dr. Aaron sent me the exact same message last week.   guácala!!!

... in response to you haven't physically met her yet, posted by Malandro on Jul 11, 2005

THAT WAS A VERY GOOD ONE ...... i TAKE IT YOU AND DR. aaron IS VERY TIGHT ????????

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

Your perception is correct.  You don’t have a relationship until you have met a woman in person.  If a Colombian woman wants you she will tell you “te quiero” at least a hundred times a day.   Some of the things she wrote sound like “piropos” .. sayings that Latin men tell woman to seduce them .  Maybe she got them from her brother.  If you go to Colombia, you are better off meeting more than one woman.  Don’t tie yourself down.

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by valuedcustomer on Jul 11, 2005

You may think that you are compatible.  However, when the two people meet, the expectations may be different that both people realized

Beattledog

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

Did she say 'me too', trying to show off her english or did she say it in Spanish? Sounds from the letter that's she's really interested in you. However, I don't think you posted the letter hoping for a translation. Since you said you've been talking on the phone, I'll reckon that you understand Spanish, and even if you didn't, you'd have run it through a translation program instead of asking us what it says. I think you meant to ask "Hey guys, does this sound like she really likes me?"....well, yes it does.....but a word of warning--she may not like you posting messages that she meant only for you on a public forum....women are funny like that.

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by Michael B on Jul 11, 2005

"...she may not like you posting messages that she meant only for you on a public forum....women are funny like that."

Seems pretty harmlessly anonymous to me.  None of us know BobEsponja personally, nor his lady friend in Colombia.  And I doubt she visits PL for MOB advice.

If Bob had instead told you what she said verbatim on the phone, would her "privacy" still have been "violated"?  This sacred email privacy thing is absurdly blown out of proportion.  

Women are notorious gossipers.  They will tell their mothers, sisters, and friends everything YOU said/wrote to them.  I've seen it first hand recently in Lima, when the sisters of my ex would huddle to talk about their guy issues.  Why should this "right" be granted them and not the fellas?  They can consult on matters of the heart, on he-said/she-said, but we can't?    

No-holds-barred when it comes to avoiding the scam.

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

Acabo de escuchar la canción que me enviaste, y si, estoy dispuesta a abrir mi corazon para ti, quiero que seas mi bendición, mi luz y mi sol... Tu eres todo.

I've just listened to the song that you sent me and yes I'm willing to open up my heart to you, i want you to be my blessing, mi light and sun... you are everything.

Solo quiero que sepas que siento que eres el hombre que siempre he buscado en mi vida. Te agradezco por enseñarme que es posible realmente ser feliz...Besos

I only want you to know that i feel that you are the man that i've always been looking for in my life. i thank you for showing me that its possible to really be happy..kisses

Tu eres lo mas sorprenderte que ha pasado en esta vida. Eres precioso! Te espero.

You are the biggest surprise that has happened to me(or you are the biggest surprise in my life) you're precious. i'll wait for you

Tu eres la chispa que encendió el motor de mi corazón y las ganas de ser mejor cada dia. Muchisimo besos para ti.

you are the spark that has turned on(ignited) the motor in my heart y the desire to be better every day. lots of kisses for you

Igual me encanto haber hablado contigo, me pareces una persona muy agradable y lindo. Espero poder hablar muy pronto contigo nuevamente. Muchos besos y abrazos.

i too,  enjoyed talking to you, you seem like a nice person to me y lovely(also cute,sweet etc), i hope to be able to speak to you again. lots of kisses and hugs

... in response to another translation, posted by jediknight on Jul 11, 2005

Also, on this part: "Acabo de escuchar la canción que me enviaste, y si, estoy dispuesta a abrir mi corazon para ti, quiero que seas mi bendición, mi luz y mi sol... Tu eres todo.

I've just listened to the song that you sent me and yes I'm willing to open up my heart to you, i want you to be my blessing, mi light and sun... you are everything."

She's agreeing to/repeating what the song lyrics say.  From the song Eres Mi rlegion by Mana.  Great song. -TNC

... in response to Right on Jedi, posted by thundernco on Jul 11, 2005

I love Mana! They rock!

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

reading the stuff she's sent you it seems to me that she is really excited to have you in her life and don't worry if she doesn't say te quiero back, she might be waiting to meet you first to see if you are the real deal. for some, knowing someone over the phone, internet is different than in person, so she might be holding back, but so far it appears that she is happy to know you and you said it yourself,

"Maybe she isn't isn't ready to say it yet, and a bit of patience from me is needed"

for many latinas, patience is something that they value and appreciate in a man. don't be "intenso", many don't like to feel pressured or rushed, slow down a bit, continue showing interest and how much she means to you and how she makes you feel and how you can't wait to meet her.  i would rather have a woman tell me te quiero or te amo when she was ready rather than because she felt like she had to becuase i said it to her.

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by jediknight on Jul 11, 2005

Thanks a bunch Jediknight and all you guys, great advice there. I think that is exactly what I'm gonna do; just keep things going along without trying to second guess her thoughts or feelings. Try to chill out a bit. Like you say, a virtual relationship over the net is nothing compared to meeting in person.

Anyone have any experiences to share about meeting (and perhaps marrying) someone that they started out chatting online and then met in person? How was it?

BobEsponja

... in response to Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

[This message has been edited by jediknight]

i found my fiancee on amigos.com. we wrote to each other for 7 months, at first it was entirely friendly until about the 4th to 5th month when i started to realize that she had all of the qualities i was looking for in a woman.

i flew to colombia to meet her and her family, at first it was awkward, we were both nervous, such high expectations after so many emials, phone calls, webcam connections, instant messaging, that we didn't get comfortable until after the 2nd day, then things got alot better.

on that day her father had asked me how things were going, was it like i had imagined and i told him that frankly i thought his daughter was having second thoughts,that she wasn't as open in person as she was over the phone....he said, "i know my daughter.." and assured me that she was just nervous and didn't know how to act in front of me, her father actually reassured me that she was crazy about me and to give her a little time, well that evening we went out and we talked, laughed, everything, it was if the first 2 days hadn't existed, we laugh about it alot now, about how we both acted. on the 3rd day i asked her to be my girlfriend, that was in jan, now we're engaged. she told me that she had fallen for me before we met, it was after reading an emial i sent, something i wrote really touched her and then she knew....but she needed to confirm that i was real, she needed to meet me first.

long distance relationships are not easy but if you're lucky you'll find someone as wonderful as my finacee. send your girl messages to her cell phone, virtual e cards, send her pictures of you as a child, open yourself up and if she is the one for you she will appreciate it and let you know. good luck
JK

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by jediknight on Jul 11, 2005

Thanks JK and all you guys. It's interesting how all of us are different. For example you all read my story and your responses are all different which is great because we all perceive and feel things differently. That's why forums like PL are valuable.

Anyway, firstly JK (and guys like UtopiaCowboy & Jimmy StLois) who met their partners from amigos or match are proof that meeting over the internet, having a long distance relationship and then meeting in person can end in a happy marriage/relationship.

Secondly, all the phone calls, MSN, webcam chat, messenger, text messages, emails, letters, virtual cards etc I believe do allow you to get to know your girl. I'm not talking about physically. But her personality. Women are communicators, much more than we are, and for them this type of verbal, written, spoken whatever you want to call it, communication is very important. We have 6 hour phone converstations thru MSN while connected to webcams (all free, thanks MSN!). You can talk about a lotta stuff in 6 hours! Especially when the time flies and you both ask each other, where did the time go?!

So I wouldn't say it's "a waste of time till you meet". Rather, the distance and not being able to meet *yet* gives you both the opportunity to discuss all these little things that may not get brought up when you're hanging out with her on holiday just having an amazing time. When all the physical stuff happens.

I know so many little tidbits of info about my girl that you wouldn't even think about. She hates to iron. But loves to arrange the house, clean etc. Her cooking is so-so but loves to cook cakes, cookies etc. She's very tidy, so am I. She's allergic to cats...bummer I love cats. But hey the cat goes! She doesn't like to wear make-up much. Or any jewelery. Just simple little details, there are a million more other things.

I think myself that it may build a strong foundation upon which to meet in person and see where it goes from there.

Gracias for all your responses.

BobEsponja

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

I'm the first to recommend this approach for obvious reasons. It does give you an opportunity to get to know each other first. The problem with meeting a chick in person before you really know her is that the little head tends to take over. In fact I'd say that leads to many, if not most of the problems guys later experience. Of course having said that, the real-life meeting is the true test. I had a Mexicana novia that I corresponded with for a while and when I met her in person, she just didn't take my breath away. She was very attractive but something as missing. I met her twice in Mexico, the second time just to be sure that I wasn't selling her short. With my wife, damm, the first moment I saw her in person, I knew that I never wanted to leave this woman. Who can explain why it's there with one and not with another?

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

Bob,

Correct me if I am wrong, but I don't think you mentioned your age, or the age of the lady?  In some cases, it is no big deal; but I am still curious.  Also, I do not recall if you said how long it will be before you are supposed to take your trip to see this lady?  Whatever happens, I wish you the best.

                       OkieMan

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Spanish translations, posted by OkieMan on Jul 11, 2005

Hola Okieman,

Sure, I'm 32 - she's 25. Neither of us have kids. I hope to get down to see her in September/October. I speak Spanish well enough (not fluent), she speaks near fluent English from 15 months spent in Australia as a student 5 years ago. We use both languages but mostly Spanish.

BobEsponja

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Spanish translat..., posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

thats a great age range and nice that you both speak both languages.
one thing that helped me along the way was noticing how my finacee spoke about her family and the relationship she has with her parents. she is very open with them, talks to them about her concerns and listens to what they have to say. what was also interesting was the type of relationship her parents had, it is traditional where her mother stays at home but her father helps around the house, cooking, cleaning, etc, its 50/50. that is very progressive considering that they've been married for over 25 years and the way of doing things in colombia is that the man doesn't lift a finger, the wife does everything. although they could afford one, they never had a maid, so her mother taught my finacee and her brothers and sisters to cook, clean and help out around the house.
there are so many things that you two can talk about before meeting, i hope things work out. good luck
JK

... in response to Re: Spanish translations, posted by jediknight on Jul 11, 2005

Great advice! I can share a little story that follows this theme. I had been writing casually to a girl in Bogota that is a Doctor. For more than a year our e-mails were casual and non romantic. She never displayed a LOT of interest but was always friendly. I never pushed her for anything. When I decided to visit Colombia I told her I was coming, and arranged to meet her in person. Nothing serious. When we actually met, we had an instant attraction and chemistry, and ended up having a great time at dinner and later dancing. The person I met was totally different from the person that send me the casual e-mails. For many of these girls, we are not REAL until we show up in person, and they will not decide how they feel (nor should they!) until they meet you in person. Her e-mails are a LOT different now. Go there and see the girl in person before either of you decided who loves or wants who :-)

William

... in response to Spanish translations, posted by BobEsponja on Jul 11, 2005

I have just listened the song that you sent me, and if, I am willing to open my heart for you, I want you to be my blessing, my light and my sun... Your you are everything.  
 
Alone I want you to know that I sit down that you are the man that I have always looked for in my life. I thank you to become trained that it is possible really to be happy ...Besos  
 
You are it but to surprise you that it has passed in this life. You are beautiful! I wait for you.  
 
You are the spark that he lit the motor of my heart and the desires of being better every day. A lot of kisses for you.  
 
Same I love to have spoken with you, a very pleasant person seems me and I abuot. I hope to be able to speak very soon again with you. Many kisses and hugs.