decisions HELP!!!!!!!!

[Carl]

... in response to Yours is probably..., posted by shadow on Aug 28, 2001

I hope before you die, you do accept God. The Devil is around also. Your wife just let him have his way. Only God can forgive sins. I know this for certain. regardless of what others believe. Yes, I will comment as much as possible about God. I am a testiment to him. Take care and God bless you
Carl

[Ray]

... in response to Yours is probably..., posted by shadow on Aug 28, 2001

Larry,

Carl expressed an opinion that some may or may not agree with. We all express our own opinions here and I’m sure that nobody’s opinions will get 100% agreement all the time. Carl is only expressing what worked for him as it relates to the topic at hand. It may or may not work for others.

But I don’t believe that anybody is cramming their opinions or beliefs down anyone else’s throat on this forum. You have total control over that left mouse button (unless you’re left handed) so exercise your own discretion over which posts you open or skip over.

Peace,

Ray

[shadow]

... in response to Opinions, posted by Ray on Aug 28, 2001

Ray;
You are absolutely right, and I probably overreacted. However, it seems to be the consensus that when things go right for a religious person that it is all the work of god, and when things go wrong for someone else it is because they didn't believe as they did.  "When god is in charge, how can you lose?" in Carl's words.

When I was growing up, my parents were not religious at all. To this day I still don't know what their beliefs are. Probably, they have been athiests all their lives. We lived in a very sparsely populated area, but had three very religious families in the area who had children my age. My parents allowed me to go to church with these other families. They were all different religions, and when each one heard I had been to church with the "others", they tried to teach me the error of my ways. "Our god is the right god, theirs is not". "They will all go to hell for not believing in OUR god" etc. This got to the point I was no longer welcome at two of these families house because I had been to "that other church". The end result? I stopped going to church completely and stopped believing in ALL of them.

There came a time later in my life that I decided that possibly there is a god, but if so, which religion is he? Is he budhist? Catholic? Latter day saints? I came to the conclusion that I had belief in god, but not any particular religion. The closest I have ever been to believing was a year ago, when everything seemed to be going right. Myrna was due here within weeks, and with her encouragement to "Be a better person", I actually started to lean toward the roman catholic faith. Then, she arrived, and all hell broke loose. I found out what it really meant to have "christian values", for then, you could do anything you wanted to people and it was ok, for "you would be forgiven." In one of my final conversations with Myrna, she told me "God will forgive me", and therefore she had "No remorse".

Me, now I believe there is a much stronger religion than anything pertaining to a god. It's called having MORALS, something many self proclaimed "christians" seem to have misplaced along the way. Now, when someone starts in preaching to me I become very angry and bitter. God? IF there is a god, he has a very capricious and malicious way of showing himself to someone trying to do right by him.

I'm done now.

Peace be with you.

Larry.

[humabdos]

... in response to Re: Opinions, posted by shadow on Aug 28, 2001

I am with you on that Larry!   I belive in God Or what ever you want to call it.   But I don't belive in the devil or Hell its just something to scare the weak minded into submission.  My two cents   ... Hum

[Jeff S]

... in response to Re: Opinions, posted by shadow on Aug 28, 2001

Well, Larry. It seems Carl is going to pray for you after all, and I would not have expected less. ) You obviously have some pretty strong opinions and feelings here, that I hope you resolve within yourself. As much as I hate to get ino the middle of this, I'd like to reinforce something you said, a point someone else touched on a week or so ago in this forum, the guy who ahd lost his Buddist (Thai) wife to cancer: Acting morally and doing the right thing are as much a logical conclusion of an examined life as they are the mandate or religous dogma.
-- Jeff S.

[humabdos]

... in response to Re: Re: Opinions, posted by Jeff S on Aug 28, 2001

n.t

[shadow]

... in response to Re: Re: Opinions, posted by Jeff S on Aug 28, 2001

I wouldn't have expected less either. I guess he can't help it, they are his beliefs. I just wish he wouldn't include me in them.

[Carl]

... in response to Re: Opinions, posted by shadow on Aug 28, 2001

Larry
Since you are in so much doubt about God, I hope you will  read the bible, it is God's word and everything you need to know is there. You do not have to listen to others then. I will pray for you anyway.
Carl

[shadow]

... in response to Re: Re: Opinions, posted by Carl on Aug 28, 2001

believe in god, I did not believe in the bible, for that is written by man, not god. If your bible is correct, then all other religions bibles are incorrect? Also, all scientific evidence pointing toward evolution is also incorrect? No cavemen?  Hmm, just when I thought I had found my ancestors.  Larry.

[Carl]

... in response to even when I did..., posted by shadow on Aug 28, 2001

The Bible was written by God through the hands of man.
All of your questions and the answers are in it. It is up to you to find them. The rest is up to you, I have no more comments to make to you about religion. All I can say is it is what I know and believe and have certainly experianced the power of God.
Carl

[shadow]

... in response to Re: even when I did..., posted by Carl on Aug 28, 2001

WHICH bible was written by god? Yours? Muslims? Jehovahs? As near as I can tell, they were ALL written by man, or does your god own a print shop? All of the questions I had as a child were answered differently in every religions bible. They all contradicted each other and themselves. Who's is right? Your's according to you, muslims according to them, Jehovah's according to them, shinto, etc... Maybe they are all right, even though they contradict each other? Maybe the native Americans had it right. They worshipped the land and animals, until we came along and crammed religion down their throat. Have you taken a good hard look at exactly how we did that? How many peaceful, innocent indians were slaughtered by "good christians" in the name of god? To build a new country free of religious oppression? A new country with separation of church and state?? Does this make any sense to you at ALL?? The "survivors" the "good christians" put on "reservations", where they were forced to embrace "christianity". Of course, they were not fed properly, and were not allowed to go hunt anymore. Thousands starved and died from exposure. All in the name of god, in a country free of religious oppression. And now everyone wonders why life is so poor on the reservations. Would a REAL god allow this? I think not. The spaniards did similar things in the Philippines.

I will repeat, I believe everyone has the right to their own beliefs, and NOBODY has the right to force their beliefs on anyone else. Inevitably, when they do, innocent people die. And with that said, I will end this tirade.

Larry.

[Carl]

... in response to So exactly..., posted by shadow on Aug 28, 2001

Larry
First, I am not trying to force or cram my belief to you.
I am only expressing my oppinion and belief which I know, is the right way as I know there is only one God who made the heavens and earth. "Seek and you shall find"

[shadow]

... in response to Re: So exactly..., posted by Carl on Aug 29, 2001

as I am expressing, is that all those wonderful "good christian" people knew that their way was the only way and right way when they slaughtered the indians. After all, they did it, "In the name of god"! The heavens and the earth belonged to them, for it was THEIR god that made them, and those heathen indians didn't have any right to be on them in the first place. Those wonderful "good christian" people sought, and they found, and they killed for, the heavens and the earth, but that was ok, because they were christians, and they were forgiven, after all, their god was the ONLY god. Surely, it was the right way, there could have been no other way. All those other religions are WRONG! All those other beliefs are WRONG! This is what I've been hearing my whole life, you repeated it. I think you made my point for me. Unfortunately, you didn't comprehend it.

"Ask not he who has been blind for life, the color of the sky."

[Carl]

... in response to And my opinion and belief..., posted by shadow on Aug 29, 2001

why generalize so called christians? The muslems kill in the name of God also, it is right? one of the Ten commandments is;"Thou shalt not kill". I am not blind, I know for sure and read God's word. Take charge yourself and Seek the right way. Not go by what others do. God gave us a mind to make decisions. I pray you make the right one soon.
Carl

[shadow]

... in response to Re: And my opinion and belief..., posted by Carl on Aug 29, 2001

and I did find, the right way for me. Once again, it's called having MORALS and a CONSCIENCE, something many self righteous good christian people know nothing about. (please note my use of the word many, I did not say all) When I do something that I feel is morally wrong, my CONSCIENCE bothers me and I try my best to correct that wrong. Most christians, on the other hand, just ask god for forgiveness and all is right with the world. It's all ok because god forgives them. It's ok if they lie, steal, and cheat to get something because god will forgive them. It's all right if they slaughter thousands of innocent people because god will forgive them. THEY HAVE NO MORALS NOR CONSCIENCE. All they have is a self righteous attitude that no matter how many people they cheat or kill, it will all be fine because god will forgive them. It is not just the christian religion, nor the muslim religion, there have been more people killed is religious wars (in the name of god) than all other wars combined. So where exactly in this does "Thou shalt not kill" fit in? Maybe it should read "Thou shalt not kill except when it serves the purpose of a religious person". Then all these fine people wouldn't even have to ask forgiveness. It would save god a lot of time, then maybe he could work harder on things in the world that REALLY need his help.   Larry.