Maybe I just got lucky

[Pete E]

Maybe I just got lucky and then got preachy about it.I would like the imput of other guys with successfull relationships.
I have said many times you can always tell the really good girls right away.This was my experience with my wife.I have never ever doubted her character or honesty and that judgement has been vindicated by her.It just seemed such a part of who she was when I met her.She just seemed so honest and real,no nonsense or BS at all.Even through difficulties with language it still seemed certain.
Have other guys had this experience?I think it is the way it is with  some of the girls.
Then there is the whole other questionable area.Maybe the girls are for real,maybe not,its hard to tell untill you have known them for awhile.I think this is where guys get in trouble,but this may be a high percentage of the girls.The other type like my wife might be a small percentage so it might take a long time to find one one where its that clear?Is it reasonable to wait for this level of certainty?
Maybe other guys have felt this and been wrong?
Maybe it wasn't that my perception was so good,I just got lucky?

Pete

[Celt]

... in response to Maybe I just got lucky, posted by Pete E on Sep 28, 2002

Pete,

I think the women in Cali--or anywhere in the world--have
their radar for men as well. As has been pointed out in
many posts and contexts, they can sniff out lack of confidence from about the length of a bar room away.

I think luck is very important, but so is judgement.

From our point of view, you are correct: it is not that
difficult to spot the phonies and games-players. I used
an agency in Cali--Latin Encounters--and vetted most of
the dates the "mama-san" chose for me: (1) willingness
to take me to expensive places on a first date; (2) bragging
about all the "citas" she has had lately; (3) eyes wandering
and resting on everyone around me and seldom on me; (4) not
asking me any questions about my life.

The others wanted to conserve my money, show me unusual
things in Cali and teach me about its history; to know
about my hobbies and interests, and above all comported
themselves with a modesty that the others completely
lacked. And then there is simple chemistry...

I actually had better luck with Ricardo, which I never
expected.

I got lucky (so far) too, and will be in Cali in two weeks
to further the relationship along.

The real relationship begins when you leave Cali or Bogota,
and have to sustain it, IMHO. The object of my "noviazgo" and I spend alot of time on the phone. We both assume that
if we are giving up Friday and Saturday nights to talk
on the phone, and hear the voice of the other, we can trust
each other the rest of the week. Romance is great, but we
also talk about what we want from life, and whether we
can realistically provide it for the other.

I think there are more wonderful women in the Cali agencies
than "serpientes", but there are so many beauties that it is
difficult to concentrate on personality/character issues. If you can bed down 2-3 beatiful 22-year olds in a week's time, why waste time finding Ms. Virtuous? I would say more
than half the guys I met down there succumbed to this.

[Red Clay]

... in response to Maybe I just got lucky, posted by Pete E on Sep 28, 2002

Same here, I have never detected or sensed anything about my wife that seemed less than genuine. She is the most unselfish woman I have ever met. I could never imagine her feeling like the grass may be greener somewhere else; I don't even think about it as a possibility.

 The point I realized how much she loved me was the time she discovered I had corresponded with another Latina after we had been dating for a couple of months. Her reaction to that, how crushed she was, showed me that she cared more for me than anyone else I had known. Want to know how unselfish? She told me if I really wanted to be with the other girl that she would help me translate the emails from the other girl if I needed help. She was crushed at the thought that we might not end up together but still willing to be a friend enough to help me with that.

[Tai]

... in response to Maybe I just got lucky, posted by Pete E on Sep 28, 2002

Pete,

At THIS point you know(along with many others that know your wife), that she is a good woman...

However, given the time frame with which you made your decision...or should I say leaped into the decision...along with the communication issues...I would have to say that LUCK played a major factor in your case.

If it hadn't worked out, then the hindsight commentary would be like so many of the other horror stories posted: "Although I had only just met her, the connection was there...she appeared so genuine, and there were no red flags, etc, etc". -And you'd be used as a case study for what NOT to do.

Now...with that said, if guys are truly paying attention to the woman's behavior, then many of the lower tier sharks and users will be exposed. -However, there are sharks and opportunists that are not so easily exposed...and those guys that leap prematurely may find such a woman versus the good woman persona being portrayed.

Of course this is based on the notion of guys that know the "signs" when they see them...but hey, that is a whole other post.

just .02

Tai

[Pete E]

... in response to Re: A perception slanted by hindsight?, posted by Tai on Sep 28, 2002

Tai,
I posted at the time I met her"I don't think I could find a better person."So It was my perception at the time.Fortunately it was true.
Maybe some guys have had this experience and it turned ut not to be so.But I think it would be hard to fake.I do believe it is possible to play it well enough to fool alot of  gringos,but When its real it comes through at an even higher level I believe.Its not only the lack of red flags but all the things that seem so real,the humility,saying things that are not to ones benefit,like she thought she was not attractive enough since she had no interviews.
I was mostly asking if anyone had had the same experience here.One poster did.

Pete

[Aaron]

... in response to Re: A perception slanted by hindsight?, posted by Tai on Sep 28, 2002

Tai,

Why don't guys start a thread of all the possible red flags that they may encounter when getting to know a lady.

It would educate many experienced and non-experienced travellers.

Then, Patrick can modify that OUTDATED list of scams !!!!!! LOL !!!!!!

Jokingly,
Patrick

P.S. I think the site is put together very well.

[Aaron]

... in response to Maybe I just got lucky, posted by Pete E on Sep 28, 2002

Pete,

I think you found a really nice woman, and you were very lucky. Plus, from the photos you sent me, it seems that there is less of an age difference between you two. I think large age differences is a big factor. Honestly, most of the women that I met in May this year, between 19 to 27, said they didn't want someone that are too much older than they were. They said 5 or maybe 10 years, but that's stretching it, would be ok. But, allot of younger ladies actually do prefer partners closer to their age; however, they would not be shocked to see relationships where there are large age differences. Also, we can't generalize here about this issue. It depends on the people. I went out with some older ladies between 30 to 35, we both felt comfortable with each other. So YES I'm sure there are some latin ladies that would date younger men.

As for the intentions of the women, well this is a major issue. Basically, I would keep my guard up in an agency because these businesses promote the idea of marrying a gringo, and having more security in life (whether it be financial or emotional security). Given that this message is promoted by agencies, of course all the sharks in town are going to go to each agency to find the very inexperienced gringo who is going to be unassuming and naive...basically...fresh meat in a sea of sharks. I'm not saying all agency women are like this, but you better believe that there are women in agencies who are preying on gringos. It becomes worse when the women are very attractive, and find guys who are so zealous to find a beautiful latina that they loss all sense of judgement.

A beautiful latina is a beatiful latina, I'm not going to place anymore emphasis on that type of woman than that; this means even though she's beautiful:

1.) No...she's not the last beautiful woman in the sea.
2.) Other men are interested in her, but so what. Does she care about me?
3.) No...she's not going to manipulate me to get engaged and married within months.
4.) No...I'm not putting her up in a luxury apartment, constantly buying her and her family things, or paying for any cosmetic surgery she might ask for.
5.) etc., etc., etc..

Pete, I'm sure your wife didn't expect and ask for these things from you. She's a good women from what you tell us. However, there are many women in agencies that do take too many liberties, and also there are guys that go down and poison their chances of finding happiness by acting foolishly.

This is why I think taking the time to get to know the woman is the best thing. If she's sincerely cares about the guy, she will show it, and she will be willing to wait for the right time when both feel comfortable to get married.

Aaron

[Patrick]

... in response to Maybe I just got lucky, posted by Pete E on Sep 28, 2002

Maybe you just have a good picking sense.  I tend to think that some guys focus so intently on looks that they forget anything else when a really good looking woman shows interest in them.  When they're blinded by beauty, they tend to read in positive character traights where none really existed and ignore red flags.

Or maybe it's just arrogance for us to think that we may have better people skills to judge the women by than some other men have.  I've dated American women who were at least as physically attractive as my Latin wife and felt that the thrill of being with a beautiful woman did not affect my judgement when I was searching in Latin America.

It could also be that marrying women over 30 tends to be a better proposition for long term success.

Or I could be completely full of crap.

Who knows?

[Aaron]

... in response to Re: Maybe I just got lucky, posted by Patrick on Sep 28, 2002

I'll tell you what. You make allot of sense here. But, it doesn't help when you have photo clips of beautiful latinas plastered all over the Planet Love Website.

LOL !!!!!!!!!!

Jokingly,
Aaron

[Patrick]

... in response to Hey Patrick ...., posted by Aaron on Sep 28, 2002

I'll change all the banner ads to display only ugly women over 50 tomorrow.

[Tai]

... in response to Hey Patrick ...., posted by Aaron on Sep 28, 2002

I know several agency owners, and it always amazes me that they use young ladies to lure the clients to their agencies...then they discourage the clients from pursuing the younger ladies.

Age difference is the usual "issue" offered as reasoning, as it is easily applicable to the majority of men traveling to the agencies(typically older).

If the older guys are suggested NOT to date the young ladies, then agency owners need to change up their advertising and marketing tactics.

Another issue I've heard used is "the young ladies aren't a good risk for marriage". If that is the case, then why let them subscribe in the agency? Why expose clients to high percentages of bad risks?

Things that make you go, Hmmm?

It just goes to show that not all the game players involved are the women.

just .02

Tai

[Patrick]

... in response to Re: That raises an interesting point..., posted by Tai on Sep 29, 2002

Here's the slick marketing I use-

"marriages between much older men and young women tend to be less successful than those between a couple with no more than 10 years difference. Larger age differences are less of a concern for older ladies, but marriages between women in their early twenties and men in their forties or beyond are, in our opinion, at significantly higher risk for failure."

Should we get rid of younger women because the older guys might screw up their lives?  What about the younger guys using the service who should be pursuing women in the 18-25 year-old age range?  By the way, I don't think anybody under thirty should be getting married in the first place.  I'm not going to stop them though.

Should we get rid of candy from the grocery stores while we're at it?  Last time I checked, I saw it displayed in the store from the ground up to about 5 feet (at a child's eye level).  Then there's the alcohol and cigarettes that they're allowing adults to use.  At least they started displaying warnings on the packaging (after the government forced them to).

Unlike what seems to be the majority of Americans, I believe in personal responsibility.  I believe we should be able to choose whatever path we want in life and we alone are responsible for the consequences.  I'll tell somebody I think he may be making a mistake by marrying a woman much younger than himself, but I'm not going to eliminate the young women from the site to protect the older men from themselves.

Some of the marriages between 40+ men and women under 30 work.  There are also some younger guys looking South.  Lastly, I'll say that my own (unpopular) opinion regarding large age gap marriages might not be the holy grail of advice.  I just base it on what I personally, and through this web site, have seen.  Let each man make his own choice.

I'm glad to hear that you know of some other agency operators who tell guys that the young lady older man marriages are risky.  Very encouraging.

[Aaron]

... in response to Freedom of choice and personal responsib..., posted by Patrick on Sep 29, 2002

Patrick,

I totally agree with you here.

As for the younger ladies in the agencies, and younger guys who visit, well this is my take on it.

I started when I was 24, very young. But, I had my head fairly skrewed on right. YES, I bumbed my heard a couple of times in this search, but not so bad that it led to dire straights. As the few years went by, I learned allot.

When I started out, I never had the intention of getting married right away. I was looking for a girlfriend that would able to wait for me for a couple of years. I was just beginning graduate school, and I knew I had aleast 4 more years to finish my studies.

Personally, I agree with you, guys who are under 25 going down should not even think about marriage too quickly. I think this "game" takes allot of maturity. Not only a guy needs to have financial resources, but he needs to be level headed so that he doesn't get caught up in all the "vices" that will be presented to him, he'll need to able to handle cultural differences, and he'll need to be able to keep a level head when in the presences of 30 to 50 young women who are looking for potential boyfriends/husbands. This is not a game, of just saving up so money, flying down, and trying to meet every beautiful woman, then trying to get in their panties.

However, I still think guys who are mature enough to handle the search, probably few who will be under 30, should go and search. They should meet people, and find potential marriage partners. If they come across young ladies that are interested, but may not be willing to marry too quickly, or may want to keep their options open, then fine. Just don't get too serious about those kind of girls. However, if they want to met someone for being serious, then they should look for the types of ladies who are ready to settle down, and they should follow through with a commitment.

As for the agency owners, well that's another issue. I take their advice with a grain of salt. There's no way another person, who I've known only for a few days, can pick a marriage partner for me. They may be able to make suggestions about the lady, but I have to be able to reason and make decisions for myself.

Aaron

[Tai]

... in response to Freedom of choice and personal responsib..., posted by Patrick on Sep 29, 2002

Patrick,

I am definitely in favor of personal responsibility and accountability. We have exchanged views on age gap marriages before, and your view is well documented here...I do applaud you though, for putting your money where your mouth is...I can respect that.

My point is that there are agency owners that I know of that talk out of both sides of their neck...people that do NOT put their money where their mouth is...talking up the appeal of the young girls to lure the men down, then discouraging them from pursuing those young girls upon their arrival.

Concerning the younger men traveling to Colombia...in my travels I have yet to meet a guy under 30. Take that for what it's worth, but in my experience men under 30 make up a SMALL percentage.

And be that as it may...if a younger woman is a bad risk for marriage, she is a bad risk for marriage -regardless of the age of the man that is to marry her.

Ultimately, there should be less hype, less BS-ing, and more consistency and accountability.

But hey, that just my opinion.

Tai

And personally I don't think that cigarettes should be sold, PERIOD. -I mean if the government endorses for people to smoke, then suicide should not be on the books as a crime, because THAT is what smoking is...and alcohol is a DRUG so if they are going to endorse that, then why not CRACK, HEROIN, EXTACY...I mean this is America right, land of FREEDOM...we should be free to do whatever we want, right?

[Pete E]

... in response to Re: Freedom of choice and personal respo..., posted by Tai on Sep 29, 2002

Tai,
I agree with your statement about free to do what we want,and I will add even if it kills us.
I don't think the government should be in the business of protecting us from ourselves,but if they want to be they should start with cigaretes.
I had to laugh at Bill Clintons chicken sh-t approach to the issue.Take cigaretes away from people under 21.Actually the older you are the more harmfull cigaretes are.Its the old farts who are dropping like flies.Try to take their cigaretes away and you will have more truoble than if you messed with their social security.I remember as a kid being told don't smoke,it will stunt your growth.What worked better for me was cigaretes made me sick.What is so cool about this?
My father died of a heart attack at 43.He was a heavy smoker.I have outlived him and his 3 brothers.3 heart attacks,one cancer.Oldest guy made it to 58.Cigaretes are cool though.
Biggest problem for the cigarete companies now is they lied about it.I hope they get sued for every penny they have.Of course this doesn't take responsibility away from the smokers themselves.They had to know better,just like a guy who gets conned by a green card shark.They just chose to ignore the evidence.

Pete