UPSET

[Dave H]

Man--living in Detroit in the late 60's and early 70's, with Camaros, Vettes, Shelbys, Superbees, AMX's and so much more all up and down Woodward Avenue, was a gas, gas, gas...

Dave H remembers--he was there about that time.

Hey Rob,

Sure do! I used to know the make, model, and year of every American made car in the 50's, 60's and 70's. I even knew when they had the wrong hubcaps for a specific year. Today, I haven't got a clue!  

Your dad had big cojones driving a Jap car onto GM property! I am surprised that the UAW workers didn't chop it up, take it out in their lunch boxes...then mail it back to him piece by piece!    He must have really been a Big Kahuna!  

I was in the Studebaker plant in South Bend, Indiana many times. My dad eventually  purchased the plant for the corporation that he worked for. I always liked the Avantis too bad it was sold off before the purchase! But, I did get to see Avanti II's being  hand-built there by Avanti Motor Corporation.

It was even a big place back in the 1920's



 I was especially fond of the Studebaker Golden Hawks!








...and Commander Starliners!

[Jeff S]

My first trip to Florida was riding from New York to Miami in my grandmother's 1953 Studebaker Commander. It must have been about 1959.

It was black too:

[Dave H]

Do you guys remember the early Hondas in America? (1970 Honda N600) My uncle bought one used in the late 70's. During the gas shortage in 1979, he decided to drive it (instead of his big Olds station wagon) to work at Fisher Body (GMC). He had seen foreign cars destroyed in the parking lot there before. But  figured they wouldn't mess with it since it was old and not much of a real car...WRONG! He was actually quite lucky...they just picked it up and threw it over the parking lot fence into a field. It landed upright and the ground was soft, so it didn't really do any damage. That was the first and last time he  ever drove a foreign car to work during his 30+ career as a machinist! They didn't mess with you even if it was a different brand (like Ford), as long as it was American made. I don't even know what is made in America anymore!

[Dave H]

My first trip to Florida was riding from New York to Miami in my grandmother's 1953 Studebaker Commander. It must have been about 1959.

It was black too:

Hey Jeff,

A beautiful car! http://www.physicsdaily.com/physics/upload/4/4d/1953_Studebaker_Commander.jpg

[robert angel]

Those --at least many of them--Studebakers, were beautiful cars that looked great, were pretty good handling and arguably better built than most  American cars of their era. But I feel that looking back, while they're still lovely, they're 'period pieces' and maybe the Avanti is the only one I consider 'a timeless classic'. I mentioned oldies like Duesenberg and Auburn as being timeless classics, (Should've included the Cord w/ the flip up head lights and stream lining) but a lot of those had custom bodies  (Buerig, etc) and were 'one offs. Plus, few 'average Joes' could remotely afford them.


Man, those first Hondas were ugly and pieces of crap that rusted out fast! I made the close to 3 hour trip between Kalamazoo and Detroit Michigan in one of the earliest models many times and the floor boards were so rusted out, we joked that if it broke down, we could always use our feet like the Flintstones did in their cars.

Of course, being college boys, we'd have a few brews on those long rides, and those holes in the floor boards saved us from having to stop at rest stops!

I worked as absentee relief ( a floater) in what was then G.M.s oldest plant--in Tarrytown, N.Y. and the working conditions and morale were horrible. I was in the 'white metal' chassis area ("The Jungle Line"--w/ all the pull down spot welders) most of the time, with a new bone wrenching, muscle bruising job every few days. My body would get used to a job after a few day--then they'd switch me. Sometimes, it was the paint shop--which back then was almost as bad--chemical fumes and incredible heat.

I would see veteran UAW guys so pissed off that they'd throw their half eaten lunch in a car and weld the seats in on top of it.

It was mostly the old black guys who took me under their wings, telling me "Quit this job before you get used to the good money. I can't quit because I make so much and I can't do nothing else--I was a human being before I came here and now I am a cursing, angry damn robot slave- a slave to GM and I hate them!'"

They told me to back to college and I'm glad I did, although both GM and the UAW kept telling me to stay on--that they'd move me up the ranks. That would've meant taking sides and I didn't want that and one thing for sure is you didn't dare tell anyone that your dad worked at GM head quarters, because if you did--your life would be total misery. Looking back, I can see how the end was coming even back in the 1970s.

I toured the state of the art Ford F150 plant in Dearborn, Michigan  a couple years back and it was so clean and relatively quiet and peaceful. It was like a whole different world.

[Dave H]

Hey Rob,

The 1937 Cord 812 convertible and Auburn 876 Speedster (Boattail) are two of my all time favorite automobiles! I always thought that the Cord would be perfect with the Auburn Speedster rear! In the bottom photo, it looks like someone else thought the same thing. The "Coffin Nose Cord Boattail Speedster" is born! 

Dave

[robert angel]

Yea, Dave--whether it's music, cars or a number of other subjects, you know your stuff and a bit more than me at that.

I think that to an extent, music, with only so many notes and combinations and cars and various design elements, are ultimately limited and inevitably, we copy or are influenced by what we've seen and heard before.

Those California custom car makers like Boyd are great, but still have nothing on cars like that Cord or the boat tail Auburn. I have a whole book shelf dedicated to autos like that and while my 13 and 19 y/o son's love cars too--I wish they'd read those books, instead of being so into music, video games, school and girls. Maybe some day....

They act just like teenagers sometimes! The 13 y/o wants a new, red Mustang GT if he can't get a Corvette ZR1 in tangerine orange. My 19 y/o is into high end German cars, but he definitely has designs on getting my Lexus--especially as an 'impress the date' car--I never should've put that luxo liner in the 'power mode' setting on a straight away and stomped on it--zero to 60 in 5.4 seconds in a car that huge almost scared the lads, but I know my older son and know that given the chance, he'd take her out and see what 'she can REALLY do', curves and all. Hell--I was the same way.....

[Jeff S]

Robert:
If you like those, you'll LOVE these:  http://www.decorides.com/foosebt.htm

[michaelb]

There's a Honda dealer in Dallas, I want to say it's John Eagle, who has an S600 on his show room floor, but he won't sell it.

[robert angel]

Jeff S,

Those are really some cool cars! Thanks--I saved the site, too. I get so many auto magazines I don't get to read half of them, but I still keep renewing the subscriptions for some reason. Same with my National Geographics....


A few of those custom autos  look a little too 'Bat Mobilish" for my taste, but most of them have updated some great designs surprisingly well, especially the Auburn.

I saw they are selling Bugatti replica grills. I have always wondered what the big deal about the Bugatti was--I have seen and even sat in a few, and saw up close one of seven "Bugatti Royales" which at one time were the most expensive car in the world. That was one long auto.

Yes, they had a great racing history and were said to be pretty reliable and a lot of famous people owned them, but I think they're kind off homely, although the french Citroen should have a patent on the word 'ugly' regarding autos, in my opinion and the Yugo for being unreliable.

Jay Leno--a great car guy indeed who finally found a craftsman that could rebuild the top end of the great "J" series Duesenbergs for about ten grand (those cars are worth millions and basically all were at a standstill with unrepairable engines) said "The best thing about the Yugo, was that it came standard with a rear window defroster. That meant you could keep your hands warm as you had to push it down the road on those cold winter days!"

So called 'kit' cars have come a hell of a long way. Some of those Shelby AC Cobra replicas are simply stunning--that's an awesome car that's a timeless classic too. I don't know if the Ford Mustang "Eleanor" kit car models are nearly as well designed for the average handyman to build.

But alas, no matter how good a kit car and it's instructions, when it comes to 'handy'--I have ten thumbs for fingers that are pretty good at picking up the yellow pages and that's about it. Even as a kid, my basic model cars were usually a big glob of glue after I got done with them!

My one claim to fame that involves any 'handiness' was building, with a little help from my then 11 y/o son, the Boy Scout Soap Box Derby State of Georgia First Place Winner car--and we did it from the official Boy Scout kit, natch.

It took a delicate balance of weights in just the right places, a lot of sanding and stream lining, a good weight scale and a lot of graphite powder on the axles...

Don't even ask me about the electrical and plumbing work I have attempted over the years in my various houses, save to say the Three Stooges would've done better and I'd have saved money and grief by picking up the yellow pages instead!

[Jeff S]

Cobras???

You must not know about Listers:

http://www.listercorvette.com/Pages/History/History.html

http://il.youtube.com/watch?v=Gh8S0bdttZw&feature=related

http://il.youtube.com/watch?v=kIQ04uZWtZU&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_OF7UPJyxA&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[Dave H]

Yea, Dave--whether it's music, cars or a number of other subjects, you know your stuff and a bit more than me at that.

Hey Rob,

Thanks...but I doubt it! 

I never should've put that luxo liner in the 'power mode' setting on a straight away and stomped on it--zero to 60 in 5.4 seconds in a car that huge almost scared the lads, but I know my older son and know that given the chance, he'd take her out and see what 'she can REALLY do', curves and all. Hell--I was the same way.....

Bad idea!  My dad did that with me and my brother in his 65 T-Bird with a 390. Next thing you know my brother and I were asking our uncle to show us what his
68 427 Vette could do. When we went to pick up our dad at Wayne County Airport  (Detroit for others here) we talked is his assistant into seeing if his 1969 Camaro SS 396 could make the 90 minute drive in less than an hour...56 minutes!

Hey what can I say...GUILTY! I did the same thing with my older boys. I never could resist kids in their loud Honda Civics. I blew my engine on one ride home from the supermarket when my best friend pulled up next to us at the traffic light in his highly modified ($50,000 worth of mods) blown Ford Lightning pickup. When the light turned green, he took off and left us behind in a cloud of burnt rubber smoke.  After  a few seconds I suddenly punched through the cloud and passed him. I went back to see what happened. It turns out he burned up his $3000 clutch. When I went to restart my car it was rattling bad. I twisted the crankshaft and broke a piston rod. It was  only a Quad 4 motor.  Fortunately, it was still under extended warranty... money well spent in my case!

Dave