The problems with U.S. men-part 1.

[sean126]

The theory of this is what I believe is wrong with many of today´s American men...in general. (When I say "many" in this thread, I´m only referring to the people that I know, have met, worked with, read about, ect...obviously I haven´t traveled to each and every city meeting and asking men questions.)
If I have learned one thing for certain it is that many people have a very difficult time facing or admitting the absolute truth about themselves.  No one likes to be thought of as being wrong because with some...they subconsciencely think that equates to being a "bad person" or being defeated by someone else somehow, when in reality it´s just their stupid pride that they really struggle with.   It just kills their soul, their very spirit, to admit to the possibility that the way they´ve been thinking is incorrect and most consider it too much work to bother to change.  You know the type and each of us have seen it.  With men, it usually comes out as anger, the ol´faithful..."you shouldn´t judge me, you don´t even know me" weak argument or both at the same time.

With that said...in my generation I have seen a change in the gripes of the opposite sexes.  It used to be that the women would complain that they can´t find a good man to settle down with.  They used to be the ones who wanted to get married more quickly.  Now it´s the men who complain they can´t find a good woman to settle down with and WE are the ones who want the married life a little quicker.

One thing that stands out to me is a big contrast between the typical American man and the typical man from Barranquilla.
The Barranquilla man (if not all Colombian men) are stronger, on the inside, when it comes to dealing with women.  They are more comfortable in their role as the "man" of the household and as the leader of the family.  I´m not talking about the jerks who are dominating or controlling.  They also don´t rely heavily on what they can buy for (or give to) the woman or dangle their paycheck, job position or status in front of a woman like you´d dangle a carrot in front of a donkey to get them to do what you wanted.  Because Colombia is basically a poor country, the men here have to rely on "himself" and the type of person he is to woo and win the affection, admiration and respect of the woman.  In general, he only has "himself" to give.  He seems to be better at handling a woman who stands up to him or starts to try to step into the role of the head of the household ( some will take this part and twist it into something I never tried to say...but that´s O.K. some will understand what I mean and some will never get it.)

In contrast...many, many american men (and many women for that matter) believes that intelligence and good judgement in one area automatically carries over into another area.  You take a sucessful business man who makes a lot of money and you can´t really tell him anything.  He´s an intelligent and shrewd business man, so he MUST be equally as intelligent in matters of the heart, as a father or as a husband.  More times than not, this is not true...it´s not even close in many cases.  Many american men passively boast of or casually display their job, status, money or possessions in front of a woman like a male peacock spreads his tail feathers to attract a mate saying, "look what I have. I must be a good catch."  It´s been my experiences and my opinion that once a man reaches a certain level of financial comfort then their quality as a man, inside, goes down as their bank account goes up.  The more they acquire, the more they rely on those things to define who they are and what type of a man they are and less on relying on themselves as a man.  They allow these things to define WHO they are instead of allowing themselves to define it...or if they´re a Christian, allowing their faith in God to define who they are.

So...you have this hollow and superfical man with really not much substance thinking their money qualifies as leadership and their material things qualify as love and comfort to a woman...all the while wondering why he can´t find the right kind of woman.  He can´t give of himself what he doesn´t have.  Some don´t get it...that money doesn´t make you a smart person, a smart husband or even a good person.  All it makes you is a good and smart business man.  Everyone knows this...BUT FEW ACTUALLY BELIEVE IT.

In my opinion, many American men are also weak minded when it comes to women.  They may fight another man at the drop of a hat, they may be the next ultimate fighting champion, but when it comes to a woman...he really doesn´t have the balls or the will power (as the case may be) to step into his role that God has given him because he´s either lazy or afraid the woman will leave and he´ll be alone.  So the woman either walks all over him, rules the roost or decides to leave.  Many times the woman will slowly lose a certain amount of respect for him for one reason or another...but the bottom line is it´s because he´s not fulling his role as the man and the leader in the relationship.  For Christian men...the Bible says the woman will WANT to assume your role and position.  Her role is no less important or less significant, but it´s a different role that´s equally important.

From my own experiences, what I´ve seen and from others that I´ve talked with...everyone one knows that American men make a huge mistake by buying or giving gifts...to much to soon.  You don´t buy love with gifts, you can´t make someone respect you with money.  You can´t show someone how much you care about them with material things.  You can show them you appreciate them them with tokens of love from time to time, but it´s not the same thing.  You can´t very well appreciate someone else when your doing all the giving and they´re doing all the recieving.  Many times you don´t even know the person WELL ENOUGH to even appreciate them before you start "showing your love" by buying them things or giving them money. 
If your going to truly "give a gift" to someone out of the kindness of your heart...out of love, you should do so regardless of their reaction or anticipated reaction.  If your expecting a desired outcome then it´s not love or kindness...it´s manipulation and selfishness because your doing it for yourself and not for them.

I´ve also seen many men (myself included..as always) hold on to a bad or unsatisifying relationship or allow the woman to take charge out of sheer laziness...but mainly out of fear of being alone.  So the men let them have their way.  Your becoming a doormat.  Perhaps your nice and kind hearted, but your still a doormat none the less and it´s hard for anyone to respect a doormat no matter how good it cleans your shoes.  Many men have lost some of their pride (the good kind) in being a man and in turn, they have lost a certain amount of their self respect in the process.  If your willing to take mental abuse from someone or stay in an unhappy or unsatisfying relationship because you don´t want to be alone...you have very little self respect and you´ve totally lost sight of whats most important in life.  For a Christian man...one of the reasons God wants to be the center and most important thing in your life is because if you lose something in life, ie..your job, money, house, loved one...it will hurt, but it won´t destroy you because you still have your center...your center of gravity.  If your center is something else, say....a woman, then everything else revolves around her....your money, life, your faith, happiness, ect...and if she leaves you (or dies) then your whole universe spins out of control because your center of gravity is gone and it actually destroys some people.

I, for one, am not ashamed to admit that I have exhibited these characteristics in the past, but I have learned from it.  I think it´s called personal growth.  I´ve seen many men either do nothing and continue to be unsatisfied or unfulfilled in their relationship or try to to move on to a different woman.  Just like women all over the world need air, water, food and shelter to survive...they also need the same basic things from their man in order to help them fulfill their role as a wife.  I believe one "correct" role feeds off the other in order to be more satisfied, happy and fulfilled in a relationship...not to mention being able to show or give more love, confidence and respect towards one another.

If an American man goes to Colombia thinking he´s a better catch simply because he can give a woman more or better possessions, more material things and a more comfortable life, then he´s just as pathetic, shallow and feminine as the women who think they can give kisses, affection and sex for a greencard or money.  Because, in the end...it´s all smoke and mirrors with a little re-direction.  A computer can have all the lights, sounds and a big shiny case, but if it doesn´t have anything on the "inside" that a computer is suppose to have....then it´s useless.

A very funny thing happens when a man gets confidence, self respect, a loving attitude towards himself, sets personal boundries and developes a faith in something bigger than himself (or his own ego)....his way of thinking changes and then....TA DAH!!!!! As if by magic, he starts getting or seeking out a different kind of woman.

For Christian men...many of them aren´t Christians.  They are just people who go to church and they know how to recite some verses.  You can´t expect God to bless you with the right kind of woman unless your the right kind of "man".  You can preach and recite verses all you want, but people know what kind of a tree a tree is...by it´s fruit.  Some think they´ve been blessed if they meet someone in a church.  More times than not, that´s not the case at all.  Many people think going and being seen in church gives them some kind of moral credibility or instant knowledge in the role of a man, husband, father or whatever.

If I had to summarize my idea, I´d say American men have become weak minded and they´ve forgotten (or never cared to learn) how to be a real man in regards to a woman.  Like a dog can smell fear (no, I´m not comparing women to dogs here).....a woman can smell desperation, weakness, gullibility, stupidity and no self respect.  Because more men are stepping away from the plate and shrugging off their roles and becoming weaker...the American women I think, are starting to step up into more areas of the man´s role to fill the void the men have left behind.  Because many can´t find what they need from their man, I believe many american women are  developing those characteristics in themselves.  American women are becoming stronger, on the inside and the American men can´t handle it and won´t try to change themselves, so.....the American men are trying to seek out a more submissive and more docile woman in another country, but I think even then....they are in for a VERY rude awakening.

Theres much more I want to write about on this subject and I will at a later date, but for the sake of time, space and boring some people I will stop right here.  Theres a part 2 because theres another variation I want to discuss.

This is sean126 for planet-love.com saying....Papi for President!!!!   

[soltero]

Excellent post and observations. I made a similar post 2 years ago that should be somewhere in the archives. Too bad no matter how many times you objectively point this stuff out, those that need to hear it will just let it bounce right off of them...

[doombug]

The Barranquilla man (if not all Colombian men) are stronger, on the inside, when it comes to dealing with women.  They are more comfortable in their role as the "man" of the household and as the leader of the family. ... He seems to be better at handling a woman who stands up to him or starts to try to step into the role of the head of the household.

The downside for Mr. Super Macho Barranquilla Man is that he has to juggle so many novias...and hijos...and familias. Super Macho's gotta lie to Pedra to lay Paulita. (Get it? A twist on "rob Peter to pay Paul." )

This is hardly an enviable lifestyle.

Many american men passively boast of or casually display their job, status, money or possessions in front of a woman like a male peacock spreads his tail feathers to attract a mate saying, "look what I have. I must be a good catch." ... So...you have this hollow and superfical man with really not much substance thinking their money qualifies as leadership and their material things qualify as love and comfort to a woman...all the while wondering why he can´t find the right kind of woman.  He can´t give of himself what he doesn´t have.  Some don´t get it...that money doesn´t make you a smart person, a smart husband or even a good person.  All it makes you is a good and smart business man.

 

Hmmm. I wonder who you could be referring to...

If I had to summarize my idea, I´d say American men have become weak minded and they´ve forgotten (or never cared to learn) how to be a real man in regards to a woman.

I think there is a modern undercurrent of ambivalence among many AMs that you mistake for, or that wouldn't fit well with, your "weak-minded male" theory. Some of us are in absolutely no rush--as in, haven't a scintilla of desperation--to get hitched. The female mind is a rather complicated mechanism, and requires a good tinkerer with lots of time and patience on his hands.         

Because more men are stepping away from the plate and shrugging off their roles and becoming weaker...the American women I think, are starting to step up into more areas of the man´s role to fill the void the men have left behind.

 

What if, rather than men stepping away from the plate, the plate were being pulled away from us men? Family law. Divorce law. IMBRA. Bogus charges. Etc.

American women are becoming stronger, on the inside and the American men can´t handle it and won´t try to change themselves, so.....the American men are trying to seek out a more submissive and more docile woman in another country, but I think even then....they are in for a VERY rude awakening.

Careful. Those stereotypes are Third Wave, femifesto^© jargon. Once unleashed, you risk infecting every gullible soul here with a guilt complex, and we just can't afford to send our newbs abroad burdened by some belief that they are somehow "flawed." 

Peace, fo shizzle, and out!

[sean126]

Doombug,
I never could get this darn "quote" thing to work for me....so I'll number your comments.

1. Yes, this may very well be true....but I kind think they are still stronger never the less.
2.  LOLOLOL....If your thinking Papi, then no. I'm not referring to him.  Actually I didn't have anyone here in mind when I wrote that....and besides, Papi's my hero.  I admire his determination and tenacity.   I wouldn't take cheap shots at him.
3.  I totally agree, but I wasn't talking about the patient or slow moving kind.
4.   I understand why you'd think that, but if (in theory of course) the men in question would have their head on correctly....they would naturally make better choices in women in the first place and wouldn't have as many problems with stuff like that.  But that is leading into another subtopic. I understand what your saying though.
5.  The more "submissive and more docile" woman thing was leading into my next thread.   I think many (maybe not MOST, but many) men have the idea that some how the women in Colombia are more submissive and docile than American women are and I don't think that's the case at all.  What I was really getting around to (in my next thread) was that I think many men equate "a more traditional woman or wife" with also being more submissive and docile which is two totally different things. I almost got into an argument with a friend's wife over this very thing...her accusing me of trying to get someone I could control and dominate.  As hard as it may be to believe....I held my tongue and didn't voice my opinion of her idiotic and blantantly retarded comment.

I respected your comments Doom.  You help me think sometimes.

[doombug]

2.  If your thinking Papi, then no. I'm not referring to him.  Actually I didn't have anyone here in mind when I wrote that....and besides, Papi's my hero.  I admire his determination and tenacity.   I wouldn't take cheap shots at him.

No, I wasn't referring to Don Pap. I was referring to someone who you had gotten into a minor idiological spat with a few weeks back.

By the way, that's a spiffy avatar of you and the misses.

[papi]

Papi's my hero.  I admire his determination and tenacity

nice to see another card carrying member of the fan club. You are a lucky man - you and CP certainly could enter your wives in the Miss PL Beauty Pageant. One question, who paid for the taxi on your first cita?? lol

[papi]

Just curious what your friends and family thought of your wife?? I really didn’t tell anyone I was leaving on my first trip to Cali – and showed up with a woman a couple weeks later (she had a visa). Everyone thought I lost my mind and certainly didn’t approve of going south to meet a woman.

[blockbuster]

Sean,

 Quit teasing us with these small avitars of the beautiful wife. Put up a LARGE pic, please!!!!!

[sean126]

Doombug....LOLOLOLOLOL   and let's say I'll leave it at that.

Papi....Yeah, I'm a member...after all we can't ALL be heros. Someone has to stand on the sidelines and wave.
Sorry to say, I didn't do it Papi style....I paid for the first taxi. LOLOLOL.

My family, of course, thought I was crazy too and had to be "educated" that I was not buying a wife.  No one was  really hot about the idea of me going.  My mother has been married and divorced twice and my dad is on his third wife and I told them that I was 35 years old and I've never been married and I don't have any kids because I'm not stupid and I certainly don't take marriage lightly.  I may be irresponsible in other areas, but not in that area.  I told them that I have excellent judgement as far as people go and just because you dated someone for 10 years or they are your highschool sweetheart doesn't mean you won't get divorced.  They said, "Well, what if she comes over here and then leaves you...or what is she's only wanting your money?"   I said, again....I'm an excellent judge of character and if she leaves...she leaves...just like some of my other ex-girlfriends have done, but I believe I'm ready and I'd make a good husband and father now. As far as money is concerned, after she's my wife then what's mine is hers.  I do make a lot of money but I also have a lot of debt at the present time....and she's welcome to all of my debts that she wants."  I told them that I wouldn't be stupid enough to marry someone I didn't trust with my LIFE so why not trust her with my money also.?   
I also told them that "the amount of time you actually spend with someone BEFORE you get married is OBVIOUSLY no guarantee the marriage will work because you've been married twice mom, and dad I guess 3 times the charm for you.  You either have good good judgement about a spouse or you don't.  Trust me to know that I'm not an idiot and wouldn't bring someone home just because I'm desperate or lonely or a complete idiot."

My mother and some friends were asking about...."why do you have to go to South America to find a woman?"  I told them,  "I don't NEED to go anywhere to find a woman.  I WANT to go.  I've been every place here....Bars, nightclubs, singles dances, church, church singles classes, internet ect... and still haven't found the right one."  And they say..."OK, but why Colombia?"  "Well, all of my girl friends have been brunette....and who doesn't think a latin woman is sexy? and so why not Colombia?....and besides, If I've been praying to God the last few years for the right woman and He has made me a spontaneous person and I feel like He's put a little nudge in me to go....why not.  Sometimes if you are asking for God's best, it may not be across the street or close by.  You don't say...God give me a woman and please let her be around the corner.  If I have to go out of my way, then never mind.  If you limit God, then your not going to be getting His best....(and after meeting my wife and dating a bit and then starting the visa) I told them God's best for me just so happens to be about 1500 miles away."

That's basically what I told them. After they met her and spent a little time with her...everyone totally adores her.  She's as beautiful on the inside as she is on the outside.  Everyone who meets her loves her.  They whole heartily agree with me now.

[sean126]

Blockbuster,
LOLOLOL, OK.  I've been doing tae bo for a few months, but apparently no one appreciates MY Macho Bod.   

[blockbuster]

uh,

 You look good too dude, but your wife is amazing!!

[papi]

Sean, great post! Other guys have said they don't need to go south and in your case I believe it. Interesting you did - I think you would have done well anywhere. Glad to hear you are so happy. How did you get in so much debt? do you have a plan? I am not a fan of debt

[sean126]

Papi...it's the Ol' back taxes thing.  The good thing is that I will be out of it next month. 

BB, I need to down size the pic's today and then post them for you.  Thanks dude.