Advice on Medellin from you experts out there please!

[Flyboy777]

Hey HGents:

I truly want to get to Medellin this May to meet some women.   I was hoping to get some info from you guys re "how best" to do this based on your previous trips.

Specifically, after reading other TR's, I find that most the time, the agency is not mentioned and that is what I'm seeking.... which ones to either steer towards or steer clear of.    I guess these agencies are kind of a necessary evil for this, although I am a member of ColombianCupid.com but worry that if I set up meetings head of time, the woman might not show and the trip would become a bust.   

So, could I ask for some guidance on a reputable agency in Medellin to use for my visit.    I'm certainly open to other suggestions as well.....

Thanks

K

[dennislevy]

Hello flyboy

I don t know if I am an expert on Medellin, I did live there for 8 months, but I certainly know how agencies work or don t work. I ve used them and worked for one.

An agency is a small enterprise and usually the workers turn over quite frequently. So to ask if an agency is reputable is not the right question, the two questions to ask are...ç

Are the current worker(s) motivated to work for YOU when you are there?
What if any is the daily involvement of the owner?

And that s almost impossible to answer from outside of Colombia. That means setting up dates, confirming the dates and not lying to you about the avialiability and interest of women.


And that s not easy....quite often the girl lies to the worker.....oh yes I ll be there to meet him, the worker tells the man, he waits at the agency or somewhere else.....and the girl never shows up.

There is an agency owner on this board who has an agency in Medellin, his handle is Mudd, you should talk with him. I don t know enough about him or his operation to make a recommendation.    From my own experience, and talking iwht many men.....there are only two personal intros agencies in Colombia that I would strongly recommend and neither is in Medellin.  

But want to go to Medellin to meet women, here is my advice.

For every week you re there have a pool of 15-20 women from Cupid that you ve written to.  Leave a very polite, slightly personalized message for each women in their Cupid mailbox. Tell them the dates that you will be in Medellin, invite them to correspond with you, give them your email, chat, skype handle.....make it easy for them.  

2. In Medellin, find a hotel that you re comfortable and a nice restaurant near the hotel (that you can walk to)  or possibly in the hotel. Near the hotel is better....As much as possible, set up all your first dates in that location, because if they don t show up at least youre not out taxi fare.  DO NOT run all over Medellin to meet women, if they want to meet you some place else tell them that you cant do it, because you don t know Medellin. And if they wont do it, go to the next one on your list.

3. I emphasize, list...do not come to Medellin just to meet 1 or 2 or three women.

If you do these things, and you make realistic choices of women and you have some Spanish or speak passable to excellent Spanish and a good personality your show up rate for first dates will almost certainly be better then what an average agency worker can do for you.

OK?

[Flyboy777]

Dennis:

Outstanding and I sincerely appreciate your comments and information.   

By chance, is one of the agencies you "would" recommend in Bogota?    i've been considering a trip there as well due to size of and education of the women there vs Medellin.   

Thanks again

F

[dennislevy]

Yes, it is its called Introductions by Consuelo, the owner is Consuelo Romero, a very smart Colombian woman, who speaks exclelent English and gives excellent service. she has a smaller agency about 340 women are registered and her office is in North Bogota

[AndyLee]

I checked out the one smaller agency in Medellin that is listed here in the left hand menu under Latin Brides. They had 8 women in my age group, 38-50.
The other alternative in Medellin is Loveme.com or A Foreign Affair. They have several hundred women in my age group in Medellin.
AFA has gotten some tough reviews here on this list over the years but more recently an AFA tour in Barranquilla was filmed and generally AFA looked okay in the film, at least from the perspective of doing what they say they are going to do.
However, I personally decided not to go to a Agency "social" after I saw the video. First, there weren't many women in my age group (38-50) and secondly the awkwardness during the social was palpable.
However, if I WAS going to do a social and it HAD to be in Medellin I'd most likely go with AFA Medellin. That's not a recommendation, just a comment.
My preference right now would be to use the Introduction service of either Jamie in Barranquilla or Consuela in Bogota, combined with my own Cupid connections in the model Dennis describes above.
On the other hand, AFA Medellin also offers an "introduction service" which is about the same price as the social tour (once you factor in lodging), but more personalized service with one-on-one introduction to the girls of your choice. I believe there is a limit of 2 introductions per day, but that leaves you time to meet other women you've lined up through Colombian Cupid and Latin American Cupid. Again, I'm not recommending AFA, just commenting on my own feelings about it.
DennisLevy has given some very good advice above, based on his years of dating experience here in Colombia. I would be inclined to follow his suggestions IF you have at least low intermediate Spanish, IF you aren't shy, IF you have good communications skills and ability and skills to plan your own private "introduction tour".
The only caveat I'll add to Dennis' suggestions is that these women are very jealous. Even when they have just met you they will turn possessive very quickly. Juggling more than 2 or 3 in one city can be a real challenge. That's one of the benefits of working with an agency. The agency, if it is a good employee this month as Dennis points out, will run interference for you.
I've only been at this for 3 years and only in Colombia for a year but I can assure you that trying to have a serious relationship with more than one lady at a time in this country is asking for trouble, especially if they are both in the same city. You will wind up having to lie through your teeth and making up elaborate excuses every time you want to see one or the other. Being honest up front and telling each girl you are meeting several others is the right thing to do, but be careful, it could blow up in your face.
Medellin is a big city though, so if you find lodging near the middle and select women in the outer areas you will be able to pull it off, using the model that Dennis has outlined.
IF I were going to do it in Medellin or Bogota, and I'm seriously thinking about it, I would have an appointment for breakfast with one girl, a coffee at 10 with another girl, lunch with a third girl and ice cream at 3 with the fourth girl. Then if one of them is available I'd invite her to dinner. I'd leave the next day open so I could follow up with any of the four that seems to be a good match.
As Dennis points out, some of the 4 might turn out to be no shows but you can limit that possibility by corresponding with them a while ahead of time and choosing your dates carefully after meeting them on web cam.
It's been said time and again on this forum NOT to go to a country to meet just one woman, no matter how good she looks on paper and in letters and web cam. If she helps you plan your trip and helps you arrange lodging she will consider you HERS for your time in her city.
I did this my first time out the door in San Jose, Costa Rica, and the moment I met her face to face I realized I'd made a mistake, and I think she did too from the look of dismay on her face. We were both troopers though, we each felt an obligation to the other so we spent the next 3 days together trying to entertain each other. I was relieved to get the taxi back to the airport.

[Researcher]

      You got it AndyLee, it is best to go untethered! Your story is the best example of why. A one shot deal without ever meeting is a mistake IMHO and should be avoided. Just because you have online chemistry doesn't mean you have real world chemistry.

      Researcher

[Dan Las Vegas]

The best advice I can give you is learn as much spanish as possible, as very few people speak English in Medellin!  I would venture a guess in that most of us who have been to Medellin did not use an agency. Dennis brings us some great points in his post, so take them to heart.

Dan LV

[euforia51]

It's been said time and again on this forum NOT to go to a country to meet just one woman, no matter how good she looks on paper and in letters and web cam. If she helps you plan your trip and helps you arrange lodging she will consider you HERS for your time in her city.
I did this my first time out the door in San Jose, Costa Rica, and the moment I met her face to face I realized I'd made a mistake, and I think she did too from the look of dismay on her face. We were both troopers though, we each felt an obligation to the other so we spent the next 3 days together trying to entertain each other. I was relieved to get the taxi back to the airport.

I'm going to go ahead and dispel this notion ... take it or leave it ... and replace with: meeting one woman can and has worked out; if you know what you're doing, you have a very good idea of what you're getting yourself into before you ever board an airplane, and there is a mutual understanding between you and the woman should the chemistry be non-existent for whatever reason.

I say this with the experience of my first and only trip to Medellin, thus far, to meet one woman. And this experience worked out much better than we both could hope for. Is this an exception to the rule as stated here on the forum? Probably. But again, this is subject to the individual, what they are looking for, and what they are willing to accept and tolerate.

[whitey]

I'm also an exception to the rule ...

[utopiacowboy]

I'm also an exception to the rule ...

Yo tambien.

[fathertime]

Yo tambien.

me too to an extent....
when i met my wife i was travelling to BAQ strictly to meet her....i could have created a backup plan on the fly, but she was the only one i planned to see.

Fathertime!

[Zon]

Here is the good news.  I have never seen so many 9s and 10s in one city in my entire life (and I have been around a bit).  It makes one re-evaluate supply and demand - and the very scarcity of physical beauty. Second, its easy to meet women here.  They are not standoffish, and as long as you are sober about your league, you are in the game.

BUT, it's complicated; very complicated.

Paisas seem to be pretty fast on the up-take and always with an angle.  It is going to take a LOT of time to filter out the good from the bad.  Honesty!?   Integrity!?  Sincerity!?  Hmmmm.  This is a classist society.  That minimizes people's more noble characters.  If you have money - does not matter how you earned it - you at the top of the food chain.   DO NOT Bring your first world, American perspective and apply it here. 

Using an agency, or internet, as a substitute for time, trail & error, is like throwing a dart into a dartboard from 30 yards.  The more time you spend, the more culture you soak in, the closer you get to the board.  But, it is very difficult to imagine online or agency connections working in the long term.

BTW, I have seen a ton of Italianos here.  And, Italians are tough competition in the dating scene.  You must be the best you can be, and invest time.  Otherwise, I sincerely believe the other cities are a far better bet.

[AndyLee]

Using an agency, or internet, as a substitute for time, trail & error, is like throwing a dart into a dartboard from 30 yards.  The more time you spend, the more culture you soak in, the closer you get to the board.  But, it is very difficult to imagine online or agency connections working in the long term.

BTW, I have seen a ton of Italianos here.  And, Italians are tough competition in the dating scene.  You must be the best you can be, and invest time.  Otherwise, I sincerely believe the other cities are a far better bet.

Thanks for the on-the-ground update Zon, I for one am looking forward to reading your trip report and hoping you are taking pictures......I miss Medellin and it's nice to see photos like the ones Whitey posted a few days ago...thanks Whitey (your gal has a beautiful smile!).

Zon, I would use your dart board analogy instead to describe finding a woman in any city WITHOUT the Internet or Agency. When you are free range prospecting you see lots of 9's and 10's, yes, but how many of them are ready, willing and able to enter into a serious, long term, loving relationship with a gringo?
Which ones of the beautiful women you see on the street are; already married, boyfriend, divorced five times, jealous gangster ex-husband or ex-boyfriend, lesbian, five children at home, or pregnant, dumb as a brick, uneducated, unemployed, party girl, shopaholic, prepago, pro street worker, criminal background, major medical problems, major mental problems or, or or......
Or ask the question another way.....which ones of the 9's and 10's walking the streets of Medellin are; intelligent, educated, single, emotionally stable, not a financial train wreck, reasonably well employed, and, and, and......
In my opinion with the Internet you can zero in on a few ladies that meet your needs, at least on paper, before you even board the plane, then further weed them out once you are on the ground.
Without the Internet or agency you are starting from zero and working like hell just to find a few of them that even remotely fit your needs. If the 8-9-10s are the dartboard the man without the Internet is standing hundreds of yards away from it casting darts in all directions with very little hope of hitting the bullseye, at least that's my opinion.

As for the Italianos being competition.....use some logic. In very round numbers there are 1.5 million women in Medellin. Of that number 750,000 are single, and 150,000 of them are 8's, 9's and 10's. At any given moment there MAY be a dozen gringos (in this case Americanos) and a half dozen Italianos in center Poblado trying to hook up with one of these 150,000 ladies. Do you seriously think there is any real competition between gringos and Italianos?
Do you think these thousands and thousands of 8-9-10s are walking up and down thinking to themselves, "Hmmmmm, there's a new planeload of Italians in town today. To heck with the gringos, I'm only interested in an Italian Stallion today"?

[Jeff S]

Isn't it interesting that a big number of the happily married guys here traveled to visit one, so are all "exceptions to the rule," while the majority of the single and looking guys say the "rule" is to visit many and have an agency backup plan.

[AndyLee]

Isn't it interesting that a big number of the happily married guys here traveled to visit one, so are all "exceptions to the rule," while the majority of the single and looking guys say the "rule" is to visit many and have an agency backup plan.

good point Jeff, it is very interesting and very enlightening, goes to show that rules are made to be broken, although I personally don't think 4 happily married guys is a 'big' number, given the thousands and thousands of us who have tried it that way. I applaud their success and appreciate their situations, though. Well done guys!

There are like maybe 4,000 people registered on this forum and 4 of them were successful 'exceptions to the rule' that isn't really a rule other than a figment in our minds.........maybe 4 is not such a big number, nonetheless, their success is noteworthy and offers a glimpse of the Holy Grail  and a ray of hope for the rest of us.
The bottom line in my estimation is to try everything that is legal and feels good and remain optimistic. Maybe its one trip or maybe its a dozen, keep on keeping on.

[dennislevy]

My very first foray into international romance was in May 2005 and it was a WOVO, write one, visit one. I went from Salem, Oregon to St. Petersburg Russia to meet ONE woman and she traveled 24 hours on the railroad from her home city of Voronezh to meet me in St. Petersburg.

I decided to visit Russia because she was the best friend of a Russian woman that lived in Salem and had married an American ande the woman in Salem had made the introduction and built each of us up to the other. At the tme I was 52 and  and the woman in Russia (Marina) was 37.

Before we had met, she and I had written almost every day for five months and she wrote and spoke very decent English, I had no Russian.  I rented a 2 bedorom apartment in St. petersburg for a week...so if there was no chemistry, we had our own spaces, and it was a mutual understanding. Chemistry was something that we talked about constrantly before we met.

I need not have worried.  After I cleared customs, she launched herself like an ICBM into my arms...and 90 minutes later we had hit the sheets, I never even saw the inside of the second bedroom. Other then quck forays to the kitchen and bathoom breaks, we did not leave the bed for 29 hours! It was a magical week, I saw great art, I saw where the Communist revolution of 1917 started and I had a wonderful lover.

I was lucky, incredibly lucky...she was the real deal....sincere, honest smart and she needed to be loved. I couldn t pull the trigger...because I wasnt ready for the committment of a foreign novia and bride in the US..it was only 9 months after my divorce and she was the first relationship...and living in Russia wasn t an option for me. But I think  if I had had the guts, she could have survived  easily in the US. She loved me and I know that I disappointed her.

With respect, I don t think this experience is typical of WOVOs. The woman in Salem was a superb matchmaker, Marina (the woman in Russia) spoke English, she was extremely intelligent and cultured and we had wonderful sexual chemistry.

Yes, there are some men on the board who have been successful with the WOVO, but I also think that they had experiences before...and sub conscioulsy they felt or KNEW that the woman was right for them. 

I think Zon s comments are typical of the man who is visually oriented and likes the thrill of picking up a woman. Nothing wrong with it, but it doesnt work for me, I much prefer the Internet to qualify a woman before I meet her. And after three years here and I ve soaked up Colombian culture and then some.....I still prefer to see a woman put some skin into getting to know me...before we meet face to face.   

 

[fathertime]

 

I need not have worried.  After I cleared customs, she launched herself like an ICBM into my arms...and 90 minutes later we had hit the sheets, I never even saw the inside of the second bedroom. Other then quck forays to the kitchen and bathoom breaks, we did not leave the bed for 29 hours! It was a magical week, I saw great art, I saw where the Communist revolution of 1917 started and I had a wonderful lover.

I was lucky, incredibly lucky...she was the real deal....sincere, honest smart and she needed to be loved. I couldn t pull the trigger...because I wasnt ready for the committment of a foreign novia and bride in the US..it was only 9 months after my divorce and she was the first relationship...and living in Russia wasn t an option for me. But I think  if I had had the guts, she could have survived  easily in the US. She loved me and I know that I disappointed her.

With respect, I don t think this experience is typical of WOVOs. The woman in Salem was a superb matchmaker, Marina (the woman in Russia) spoke English, she was extremely intelligent and cultured and we had wonderful sexual chemistry.

taht is a great story dennislevy!  i had a similar experience in Cali with another woman, before  i met my wife...i think these WOVO's work out quite a bit...but i also believe having the ability to change into backup plan mode is a good idea.

Fathertime!

[euforia51]

...
although I personally don't think 4 happily married guys is a 'big' number, given the thousands and thousands of us who have tried it that way.
...
There are like maybe 4,000 people registered on this forum and 4 of them were successful 'exceptions to the rule' that isn't really a rule other than a figment in our minds.........maybe 4 is not such a big number, nonetheless, their success is noteworthy and offers a glimpse of the Holy Grail  and a ray of hope for the rest of us.

Unfortunately, I am not married just yet. So you can reduce that number from 4 to 3 if you're strictly talking about happily married guys.

And still I wonder, for the 3 left who are happily married, looked as if getting married was a Holy Grail, of sorts. Perhaps for those who are having some difficulty, even in a foreign land where the quarry is supposed to be so much easier, this is where the root of the problem really lies.

[Capstone]

With respect, I don t think this experience is typical of WOVOs. The woman in Salem was a superb matchmaker, Marina (the woman in Russia) spoke English, she was extremely intelligent and cultured and we had wonderful sexual chemistry.

Yes, there are some men on the board who have been successful with the WOVO, but I also think that they had experiences before...and sub conscioulsy they felt or KNEW that the woman was right for them. 

It all depends upon which country that a guy is focusing on as to whether or not your experience is typical of WOVOs. Pretty much all of the guys on the Asian board who are in successful marriages/relationships only visited one woman. In Asia, WOVO is very much the rule rather than the exception.

I don't know enough about the Latin American countries to conjecture whether or not WOVO would be more or less successful in some LA countries than in others. Any thought on this?

[Researcher]

The bottom line in my estimation is to try everything that is legal and feels good and remain optimistic. Maybe its one trip or maybe its a dozen, keep on keeping on.

       Very true AndyLee.As far as a WOVO situation,well, what's that saying about a blind squirrel?There is alot of luck involved in that, IMHO.Meeting several women is the best approach even if the first one you meet turns out to be the one.I think you have to take things as they come and not put all your eggs in one basket.
 Researcher

[dennislevy]

The point is well taken I know nothing about Asian romance, so a WOVO might be the proper approach . In Colombia, I think...and its only my opinion....that meeting a bunch of women iws preferrable.

This is a previos quote I think..............from euforia

Perhaps for those who are having some difficulty, even in a foreign land where the quarry is supposed to be so much easier, this is where the root of the problem really lies.


Im going to  try and make this point ...yes I live in Colombia and yes I have met many women and yes, I have had a great time.

But many Colombian women are committment shy, they have had disappointmentrs before....and for a mature woman to make a concrete committment to a gringo in THIS culture...and remember I m not buying relationships with young chicas wth my walllet...I treat women very well but I don t immediately throw money at them

Its  not that easy. To meet women, yes, to make love with them, yes, but to have the staying power for a relationship...that is different.

Remember if a Colombian woman wants to come to the US, and she doesnt have  or cant get a tourist visa to be with her man...she has two legal choices and two only if they havent married in Colombia.
1. Get married on or before 90 days
2. Leave before or on the 90th day.

And then relationship is defined in American society......it may or not succeed, but its defined, its a a marriage.

The man risks his time, the trips to Colombia, his money, all the BS with INS aqnd the Embassy in Bogota...yes....and of course his heart......but she is making an extraordinary change in her life with the risks of failure, and possible disgrace in the eyes of her family.

Relationships in Colombia are much more ambiguous and there are a raft of reasons why a woman may bail on a relationship HERE. At times, it has had to do with me, at times its the profound difference in cultures but quite often its the baggage of HER past. And I ve learned after three years here  if she has too much baggage, its better to say next.....i m not into rescuing women because almost always it doen t work.

I m not complaining and I am sure as hell not carrying a cross.....but here in Colombia, I assume quite a bit of the the risks in a relationship...my time, my money, my heart...and the woman risks her time and her heart, but she isn t getting on a plane and leaving her family!  
I m the one in a foreign society and Im trying to fit into her life and  her family and doing it with a second language

OK?

[Researcher]

          The WOVO  method just wasn't for me. And even the guys that do it,I'm sure; pick from more than one woman.Whether they are looking at online profiles or not.I liked one on one meetings with several women in a short period of time.Some women always stood out among that group until one would usually stand out above all of them.I then pursued a relationship from there.When there are several available women for meeting, this proved to be the best way for me.Sometimes this process went quick other times it took longer but I always felt like I ended up with a woman that I wanted to fly a long distance to see.

      Researcher

[euforia51]

This is a previos quote I think..............from euforia

Perhaps for those who are having some difficulty, even in a foreign land where the quarry is supposed to be so much easier, this is where the root of the problem really lies.

Dennis ... with all due repsect ... please include the entire passage. The line above was meant to include the previous sentence ... like this:

And still I wonder, for the 3 left who are happily married, looked as if getting married was a Holy Grail, of sorts. Perhaps for those who are having some difficulty, even in a foreign land where the quarry is supposed to be so much easier, this is where the root of the problem really lies.

And was meant to insinuate, ask, and/or ponder upon, that those who are thinking of marriage to a foreign woman as being a Holy Grail, could be having difficulty for this very reason.

OK?

[Alabamaboy!]

I'm going to go ahead and dispel this notion ... take it or leave it ... and replace with: meeting one woman can and has worked out; if you know what you're doing, you have a very good idea of what you're getting yourself into before you ever board an airplane, and there is a mutual understanding between you and the woman should the chemistry be non-existent for whatever reason.

I say this with the experience of my first and only trip to Medellin, thus far, to meet one woman. And this experience worked out much better than we both could hope for. Is this an exception to the rule as stated here on the forum? Probably. But again, this is subject to the individual, what they are looking for, and what they are willing to accept and tolerate.

I know a guy who went to BAQ to meet one and only one girl that he met through Jamie's agency when he used to sell individual contact info. He met her, and everything was 100% cool. They ended up getting married after a couple visits and now live in the States. She was a gorgeous registered nurse. And he is a pretty good looking guy with a good job....about 30 years old or so as I recall. So it can happen. But the odds are not really that great. I have not heard of a lot of guys having that kind of luck.

[Zon]

I would like to be more balanced ...  I wrote: "Using an agency, or internet, as a substitute for time, trail & error, is like throwing a dart into a dartboard from 30 yards.  The more time you spend, the more culture you soak in, the closer you get to the board.  But, it is very difficult to imagine online or agency connections working in the long term."

And, after being here for several weeks, getting to know the owners and managers of some agencies, watching a group of clients stroll into town, and leave; then another group stroll in, and leave; and to imagine this playing out all year long ...   Add to that with my similar observations in Cali for 8 months ...  My observations are really more true than less true.  However, success does happen.  It's sort of like a high school quarterback aspiring to the NFL ... ALL NFL quarterbacks played high school football.

BUT, IT OCCURRED TO ME, I have never used an agency to meet a woman.  In fact, after quite a bit of time, I have only recently had my first internet date generated from Colombian Cupid (her name was Laide, and she was not).

So, despite the fact that I have a lot of time with my boots on the ground, take my thoughts and observations for what they are.  I do think it is easy to make acquaintances with almost any women in the city, exchanging cell phone numbers.  It is just so easy to go a little off the beaten track and meet groups of men and women dancing and socializing.  There is not mystery to it. 

Interent relationship making in Latin America really has not worked out so well for me.  I am interested in attractive / very attractive women in their late 20's.  Obviously, these women have more to do than to spend time on their computer - I guess. (having said that I have been talking to three women that seem to be excellent, but it was slow and took weeks to develop even a modestly consistent relationship).  So, the jury is still out.   

And, my only point about the Italianos is that many people from all over the world are coming here for romance, fun, and to find a wife.  It does not put a dent in the percentage terms, but it is interesting to note.