Feedback Requested

[Dan]

I know that many of you, like me, were quite accustomed to the old style of board used by Patrick in Planet-Love. That style of board is called a "Threaded" board - and this new style is called a "Flat" or "Linear" style.

Some of the people, like me, who have been posting on internet boards for a very long time, prefer the Threaded style.

However, the evolution of internet discussion forums has moved away from the Threaded style - and almost every board software now uses the Linear style.

I am thinking of making some changes to the board - and I'd like your input.

I *wish* it were possible to provide the option of switching back and forth between Threaded style and Linear style, but I do not think it is viable.

My guess is that the mention of further changes will make many people feel unsettled - but before you have the natural negative reaction - please check out a site I am currently managing and which offers the same features I would like to implement here.

Take a visit to http://www.RussianWomenDiscussion.com - and you will get an idea of what I'd like to make available here.

So what do you think?

Would you like to see Blogs and Galleries and a Wiki?

Let me know. Post responses here in this thread.

Thanks,

- Dan

[Tim]

Dan, I rarely visit here anymore but I got your email so here is my .02

I was also one of the PL Oldtimers who felt comfortable with the threaded forums. However, I've weened myself away to the newer style forums like your RussianWomen site. If I can do it, others can.

Do what you think is best for Goodwife, amigo.

Regards, Tim

[Dan]

Dan, I rarely visit here anymore but I got your email so here is my .02

I was also one of the PL Oldtimers who felt comfortable with the threaded forums. However, I've weened myself away to the newer style forums like your RussianWomen site. If I can do it, others can.

Do what you think is best for Goodwife, amigo.

Regards, Tim

Thanks Tim,

Please drop back around from time to time. Hopefully, you'll find the place re-invigorated and the PREMIER source of information once again.

Regards,

- Dan

[Montrealer]

There's alot of stuff going on at the new site.  It looks more like an information site with a forum feature, instead of a forum with information.  I don't know if that's what you were going for.

Personally, I like the current format the most, also liked the treeview.  Both were easy to keep up to date.  The new format basically follows the current format, with just a slightly different appearance.  So for me it works.

The only suggestion I might make is to have the home page a little less cluttered and easier to navigate.  And maybe a different color scheme because the pastel blue hurts my eyes after a while.

[Montrealer]

And I also like the "10 commandments".  That should be sticky'd on each general discussion page for newbies.

And the chat feature is really cool.  It will keep Ray and Soltero busy arguing through the middle of the night :lol:

[Dan]

There's alot of stuff going on at the new site.  It looks more like an information site with a forum feature, instead of a forum with information.  I don't know if that's what you were going for.

Personally, I like the current format the most, also liked the treeview.  Both were easy to keep up to date.  The new format basically follows the current format, with just a slightly different appearance.  So for me it works.

The only suggestion I might make is to have the home page a little less cluttered and easier to navigate.  And maybe a different color scheme because the pastel blue hurts my eyes after a while.

I think a lot of the people who frequent the site, just bookmark the Forums page and effectively bypass the portal (front) page.

Yes, the RWD site definitley does have a lot of ROOM for information - and it is becoming more populated.

It seems like some people prefer Forums and only the Forums - and that is OK, they just stick to that section of the site. Others really like to comment on the Blogs or the Reviews section - and they have that option as well. I guess it just gives some who desire it, the room to expand and interact in different ways.

Thanks for the input.

- Dan

[tnolan1]

While I enjoyed your forum at PL, I found that your forum is more towards getting businees to Your sites and not really an open forum.  As the former owner of My Latin Rose, I tried for over 2 years to get a link from your site and had for a long time a link to your site with not even an answer for 2 YEARS from any of your staff as to why you would not give me a listing there.  I emailed you and all possible email addresses, info@, webmaster@, etc..  You NEVER returned ANY requests so as far as I am concerned take ME of your email list.  You'll eventually dwindle like the rest.

[Dan]

While I enjoyed your forum at PL, I found that your forum is more towards getting businees to Your sites and not really an open forum.  As the former owner of My Latin Rose, I tried for over 2 years to get a link from your site and had for a long time a link to your site with not even an answer for 2 YEARS from any of your staff as to why you would not give me a listing there.  I emailed you and all possible email addresses, info@, webmaster@, etc..  You NEVER returned ANY requests so as far as I am concerned take ME of your email list.  You'll eventually dwindle like the rest.

No, we won't "dwindle like the rest" - far from it.

I cannot speak to the reasons that Patrick (former owner) chose to not list your site - but I *do* know that he had strict standards and refused to list any sites which did not conform to those standards. We are now in the process of re-instituting the link program which Patrick started and cultivated for many years. If you wish to be a part of the GoodWife/Planet-Love recommended network of sites, please use the URL on the Home Page to submit your link. If your site meets the standard, we will be happy to include it among the list of PREMIER sites.

Regards,

- Dan

[Pete E]

2 sayings come to mind.Keep it simple stupid and if it works don't fix it.
The change in format has pretty much killed this site.I used to visit and post on the old site alot.I rarely come here anymore.Your survey here will be missing the imput of the 60-80% of the guys that never come here anymore,so it might be a little scewed to the newer format.
I think what was so interesting with the treaded view format was at a glance you could see what was going on.
MAYBE in some site dealing with far more specific issues it might be helpfull to break the format down to a number of catagories,where a guy might not be at all interested in what is going on in some of them.
Ever hear of the "I" drive?Its mandatory on all new BMW's 5 series and up,despite BEING UNIVERSALLY HATED BY MOST OWNERS OF CARS WITH IT.A little lever controls everything from shifting the car to tuning the radio.Looking at a screen to tune he radio while you are supposed to be watching the road has to be the DUMBEST thing any auto  manufacturer ever came up with.It is listed as a negative in all independent reviews of the car.BUT,because there are millions of loyal BMW drivers who love the car in general they MOSTLY continue to buy them IN SPITE  of the I drive.One review called the new 5 series 90% brilliant and 10% OVERAMBITIOUS.
Don't f--k things up by being overly ambitious.Actually let me restate that.You,collectively,I think Patrick made the decision, ALREADY f--ked
up the site.I would suggest fixing it before ALL contact with  former posters is gone.
Fortunately we have wlc.com which Steve started.He has the original thread view format as well as the abilty to be more specific.

Pete

[NW Jim]

Pete has a valid point that over on WLC.com they have both the threaded and linear version. Not sure how much more work this would create for you; for smaller boards the threaded version seems to work fine.

Having seen your fine work over on RWD, am not sure why you don't just directly link the Russian section here (Goodwife) directly to RWD as that site is alive active and vibrant.

You might also want to ask the other section moderators to initiate some postings to get the other boards back on track, I think there is a real possibility that these boards could wither away and die. After the change there was a surge in new registrations, but participation has fallen off pretty rapidly.

[Dan]

2 sayings come to mind.Keep it simple stupid and if it works don't fix it.
The change in format has pretty much killed this site.I used to visit and post on the old site alot.I rarely come here anymore.Your survey here will be missing the imput of the 60-80% of the guys that never come here anymore,so it might be a little scewed to the newer format.
I think what was so interesting with the treaded view format was at a glance you could see what was going on.
MAYBE in some site dealing with far more specific issues it might be helpfull to break the format down to a number of catagories,where a guy might not be at all interested in what is going on in some of them.
Ever hear of the "I" drive?Its mandatory on all new BMW's 5 series and up,despite BEING UNIVERSALLY HATED BY MOST OWNERS OF CARS WITH IT.A little lever controls everything from shifting the car to tuning the radio.Looking at a screen to tune he radio while you are supposed to be watching the road has to be the DUMBEST thing any auto  manufacturer ever came up with.It is listed as a negative in all independent reviews of the car.BUT,because there are millions of loyal BMW drivers who love the car in general they MOSTLY continue to buy them IN SPITE  of the I drive.One review called the new 5 series 90% brilliant and 10% OVERAMBITIOUS.
Don't f--k things up by being overly ambitious.Actually let me restate that.You,collectively,I think Patrick made the decision, ALREADY f--ked
up the site.I would suggest fixing it before ALL contact with  former posters is gone.
Fortunately we have WLC.com which Steve started.He has the original thread view format as well as the abilty to be more specific.

Pete

Yes, things are definitely different since Patrick switched the formats - and yes, there are some who just cannot make the shift.

I am still considering options regarding future changes - and one of those is a change to revert BACK to a Threaded form of discussion.

Keep the comments coming - I am listening.

- Dan

[Montrealer]

Since so many people are complaining about the new layout of the forum here on GW as compared to the old PL format, why not simply revert back and make everyone happy.  It might be a bit of a pain, but if you are interested in providing a free and valuable service, then why not go ahead and make people happy.

Speaking of free and valuable, I think people should be more grateful of the forums that are available.  I for one say "Thank You!"

[Ray]

Dan,

Like Tim, I missed the old tree format for a while, but haven’t had any big problem adjusting to the new style. I think anyone who can’t handle the switch is hopelessly lost in the past and is probably one of those who still use DOS because Windows is too intimidating… :lol:
 
I think Patrick already gave a good explanation of why he went to the new format and it makes logical sense to me. The new forum format does have some big advantages with the BBCode features (posting images, URL links, lists, fonts), polls, better search feature, private messaging, etc., over the old format.

I think that overall the new format is more powerful and to go back to the old software now would be a big mistake. Besides, I don’t buy into this argument that most of the guys who left here did so because their brain can’t handle the new format.  :lol:

I don’t think I would use the other added features on your other forum much, if at all. But I do think it’s important to have access to the old Planet-Love archives for research purposes.

Ray

[Dan]

Dan,

Like Tim, I missed the old tree format for a while, but haven’t had any big problem adjusting to the new style. I think anyone who can’t handle the switch is hopelessly lost in the past and is probably one of those who still use DOS because Windows is too intimidating… :lol:
 
I think Patrick already gave a good explanation of why he went to the new format and it makes logical sense to me. The new forum format does have some big advantages with the BBCode features (posting images, URL links, lists, fonts), polls, better search feature, private messaging, etc., over the old format.

I think that overall the new format is more powerful and to go back to the old software now would be a big mistake. Besides, I don’t buy into this argument that most of the guys who left here did so because their brain can’t handle the new format.  :lol:

I don’t think I would use the other added features on your other forum much, if at all. But I do think it’s important to have access to the old Planet-Love archives for research purposes.

Ray

Ray,

It is probably impossible (or at least, impractical) to revert back to the old software which Patrick used. He was one-of-a-kind and had heavily modifed some old code so that no-one other than Patrick could really decipher, let alone manage, that code.

When I refer to a reversion back to a Threaded format - it would be using a new software which accommodates that style of posting.

I am concerned that yet another change would cause further dissatisfaction by the board members, so am unsure if this would be a good move or not. Still evaluating.

Also, a couple of the more popular features of modern software such as that at RWD is the Image Galleries - something which people at P-L requested for years - and also the Blog capability for Trip Reports. As you know, Patrick would occasionally take a series of posts from the board, and re-cast them as a Trip Report. With a Blog tool such as the one at RWD, Trip Reports are easy and within the control of the author from the first day.

Anyway - I hope to collect more comments - keep 'em coming.

- Dan

[doombug]

2 sayings come to mind.Keep it simple stupid and if it works don't fix it.

So apply that logic to everything, then.  Let's return to commuting to work on horseback.

The change in format has pretty much killed this site.I used to visit and post on the old site alot.I rarely come here anymore.

Your only evidence that the site is dead is that you rarely visit it anymore?  Just as the only reason for your lack of fluency in Spanish all these years is that you don't study it.  Everything has to be dumbed down for you; progress at your pace.

By the way Pete, here's some stats. you might find surprising:

Your average posts/day at WLC:  1.64 (since you began there in 10/19/04)
Your average posts/day at GW:  2.04 (since you began re-posting here after the changeover on 1/25/06)

If things were so bad here, if WLC were so much better, don't ya think your preference for/loyalty to the old-school way would be reflected in the numbers? :roll:

I think what was so interesting with the treaded view format was at a glance you could see what was going on.

To keep apprised of what's been going on recently in the forum, all one has to do is click among these three options:



What's so hard about that?

MAYBE in some site dealing with far more specific issues it might be helpfull to break the format down to a number of catagories,where a guy might not be at all interested in what is going on in some of them.

Right on, yo!  

Don't f--k things up by being overly ambitious.Actually let me restate that.You,collectively,I think Patrick made the decision, ALREADY f--ked
up the site.I would suggest fixing it before ALL contact with  former posters is gone.
Fortunately we have WLC.com which Steve started.He has the original thread view format as well as the abilty to be more specific.

DS didn't create his forum as an innovative alternative; he created it is as an expression of rebellion.  If anyone pines for the good 'ol PL days, all they have to do is time travel on over (or back) to WLC.  Many of the same old-forum "hallmarks" still remain over there.  Their site was--is--meant to lampoon PL/GW and draw from its membership, therefore DS stuck with with the same, familiar forum style that everyone was already accustomed to at PL.  No adjustment period was needed for new members as the forum software and style was essentially the same.  

Like Tim, I missed the old tree format for a while, but haven’t had any big problem adjusting to the new style. I think anyone who can’t handle the switch is hopelessly lost in the past and is probably one of those who still use DOS because Windows is too intimidating… :lol:

I never missed it much.  Way too archaic.  Some peops. are just too lazy to adapt to many of the functions available in the newer forum formats (much as they're too lazy to learn Spanish while resident of a Spanish-speaking country :lol: ).

I think Patrick already gave a good explanation of why he went to the new format and it makes logical sense to me. The new forum format does have some big advantages with the BBCode features (posting images, URL links, lists, fonts), polls, better search feature, private messaging, etc., over the old format.

Precise-a-mundo!  Pre-GW, I could never have posted such gems as this:



By the way, Danmin (that's short for, Admin. Dan), you've gained a total of 83 new members between May 20th, 2006 and May 21st, 2006.

They're either a slew of new members eager to participate in this informal survey, or, more likely, a flurry of spammer accounts who've breached the flood gates.

Damn the torpedoes!

[Dan]

By the way, Danmin (that's short for, Admin. Dan), you've gained a total of 83 new members between May 20th, 2006 and May 21st, 2006.

They're either a slew of new members eager to participate in this informal survey, or, more likely, a flurry of spammer accounts who've breached the flood gates.

Damn the torpedoes!

Could be a variety of reasons for the surge in new members. If you see ANY evidence of "spammer accounts" - please let me know ASAP. Send me a PM and I will attend to it promptly.

BTW - can someone provide me the abridged version of what led "Steve" or "DS" or ?? to start WLC?

Thanks,

- Dan

[YEP]

NO filter / freedom of expression

[Dan]

NO filter / freedom of expression

Thank you, I guess. That certainly meets the definition of "abridged." Now if someone might offer me just a little more information so that I might understand what happened - that would also be appreciated.

- Dan

[Stephen]

Do what needs to be done.

I liked the old format.  But Frankly, I thought the new was great.  I can't imagine people dropping off the board simply because of the changes we've made so far.

You make the decision.  I'll be there.

Stephen

[Ray]

can someone provide me the abridged version of what led "Steve" or "DS" or ?? to start WLC?

I think Dallas Steve is still registered here, so he would be the best one to answer your question. Otherwise, according to my recollection, here is the gist of what happened, with visual aids:

Steve's good buddy Burbuja was going out of his way to stir up trouble on P-L...

Burbuja baited a guy named Troy into posting on the Asian Forum after Patrick had threatened to ban him if he posted over there again...

This got Troy banned... and Patrick also gave Burbuja the boot...

After a short period, Patrick reinstated him but Burbuja repeatedly went out of his way to insult Patrick, trying to goad him into a fight...

Because Burbuja had so skillfully baited Troy into getting banned, I had nicknamed him "The Master Baiter". I guess he liked the name, because Burbuja requested that his registered name be changed to "The Master Baiter". Patrick obliged him by changing his handle to "Masterbator"... . Burbuja wouldn't post anymore under his new handle, so Steve started a new forum where Burbuja could post without reprisals from the forum owner.

The moral of this story:

If my memory is faulty on this subject, I'm sure someone will correct me.

[Patrick]

Damn Ray, You remember more about it than I do!  The only other part was that they wanted the freedom to discuss whore-mongering, which was grounds for banning at PL.  Not surprizing given that Burbuja used to own a brothel somewhere in Latin America.

[Montrealer]

Although the overall posts have slowed down since the switch, I do have to say that the content has improved.  There is alot more information on the process for newbies starting off in this adventure (at least compared to last October when I started).

Also, by adding the flame room, it did filter out the needless rants that can sometimes go on for weeks by some users.  And those that don't have the time or the patience can just avoid the flame room altogether.

And here are some other stats comparing WLC and GW:

Total new topics on forums May 17 to now:      
                           WLC             GW

Gossip                     1                0
Wife/Fiancee/trips     2                3
Mongering                1                0
Agency                    2                2
World stats/facts       6                2
Boots                       1                0
Travel tips/Q's          2                1
Mexican Border         2                2
Jokes                        1               6
Newbie Q's                0                2
Immigration Q's        0                3

Total Posts                18              21

So looking at the number of new topics, GW is actually more popular than WLC.  We do have alot more jokes than WLC, but then WLC has alot more off topics other than questions about foreign wives.  And isn't that what these forum are all about.  These stats show that not only is GW more popular, but also more informative.

Another idea if you want to increase the number of posts, is have all new members post a short introduction to themselves.  It will help them in breaking the ice on these forums as well as create new topics and determine spam accounts.

Don't cave into mongering requests by allowing people to detail there sex trips on this site.  It only gives more fuel for the fem-nazis to hate our little club.

Also, maybe encourage agencies to post a link to your site on there websites.  This will increase traffic and membership, as well as provide a valuable service to newbies.  In turn, you can post there website links up, which I believe you already do.

Just a few more suggestions, take them as you like, but I'll be sticking around regardless.

[Dan]

Although the overall posts have slowed down since the switch, I do have to say that the content has improved.  There is alot more information on the process for newbies starting off in this adventure (at least compared to last October when I started).

Also, by adding the flame room, it did filter out the needless rants that can sometimes go on for weeks by some users.  And those that don't have the time or the patience can just avoid the flame room altogether.

And here are some other stats comparing WLC and GW:

Total new topics on forums May 17 to now:      
                           WLC             GW

Gossip                     1                0
Wife/Fiancee/trips     2                3
Mongering                1                0
Agency                    2                2
World stats/facts       6                2
Boots                       1                0
Travel tips/Q's          2                1
Mexican Border         2                2
Jokes                        1               6
Newbie Q's                0                2
Immigration Q's        0                3

Total Posts                18              21

So looking at the number of new topics, GW is actually more popular than WLC.  We do have alot more jokes than WLC, but then WLC has alot more off topics other than questions about foreign wives.  And isn't that what these forum are all about.  These stats show that not only is GW more popular, but also more informative.

Another idea if you want to increase the number of posts, is have all new members post a short introduction to themselves.  It will help them in breaking the ice on these forums as well as create new topics and determine spam accounts.

Don't cave into mongering requests by allowing people to detail there sex trips on this site.  It only gives more fuel for the fem-nazis to hate our little club.

Also, maybe encourage agencies to post a link to your site on there websites.  This will increase traffic and membership, as well as provide a valuable service to newbies.  In turn, you can post there website links up, which I believe you already do.

Just a few more suggestions, take them as you like, but I'll be sticking around regardless.

Monty,

All good suggestions - and I am pleased you will be sticking around.

I have the same policy on discussion of prostitution as Patrick. There is zero tolerance for such behavior.

We are also working diligently to restore the link program which has existed here for a very long time - and to insure the 'quality' of the links and the companies to whom those links are directed. In the past couple of weeks, we have cleaned out numerous dead links and links which went to sites that had transitioned to something outside the standards we have set.

As you will notice in reading this post - we are now using a different software which allows both Threaded and Linear display forms. While not exactly the same as the previous fully-threaded layout - it should prove to be more familiar to many of the old-timers.

And this is only a start. You will soon see the Goodwife and Planet-Love sites become - as they always were - the very BEST resource for Foreign Bride information available anywhere.

- Dan

[pablo]

tnolan1 Wrote:
While I enjoyed your forum at PL, I found that your forum is more towards getting businees to Your sites and not really an open forum. As the former owner of My Latin Rose, I tried for over 2 years to get a link from your site and had for a long time a link to your site with not even an answer for 2 YEARS from any of your staff as to why you would not give me a listing there. I emailed you and all possible email addresses, info@, webmaster@, etc.. You NEVER returned ANY requests so as far as I am concerned take ME of your email list. You'll eventually dwindle like the rest.


No, we won't "dwindle like the rest" - far from it.

I cannot speak to the reasons that Patrick (former owner) chose to not list your site - but I *do* know that he had strict standards and refused to list any sites which did not conform to those standards. We are now in the process of re-instituting the link program which Patrick started and cultivated for many years. If you wish to be a part of the GoodWife/Planet-Love recommended network of sites, please use the URL on the Home Page to submit your link. If your site meets the standard, we will be happy to include it among the list of PREMIER sites.

Regards,

- Dan

Terry,

Take it easy man.  Patrick admitted many times the last year or two that he had little time to update the old P-L forum and that is probably why there was never a reciprocal link.  Patrick even admitted on more than one occasion that he did not answer emails and that spending time with his family was more important than working on the forum.  I think you can relate somewhat.  My few emails to you fell on deaf ears as well.

Dan,

As far as the new format I think it is much better than the old style format.  Sure it might take getting accustomed to especially if you have been a long time poster like Pete but even old dogs can learn a few new tricks.  I think if Pete continues to post on GW he will get the hang of it and it you are reading this Don Pedro, hang in there.

[zapata]

tnolan1 Wrote:
While I enjoyed your forum at PL, I found that your forum is more towards getting businees to Your sites and not really an open forum. As the former owner of My Latin Rose, I tried for over 2 years to get a link from your site and had for a long time a link to your site with not even an answer for 2 YEARS from any of your staff as to why you would not give me a listing there. I emailed you and all possible email addresses, info@, webmaster@, etc.. You NEVER returned ANY requests so as far as I am concerned take ME of your email list. You'll eventually dwindle like the rest.


No, we won't "dwindle like the rest" - far from it.

I cannot speak to the reasons that Patrick (former owner) chose to not list your site - but I *do* know that he had strict standards and refused to list any sites which did not conform to those standards. We are now in the process of re-instituting the link program which Patrick started and cultivated for many years. If you wish to be a part of the GoodWife/Planet-Love recommended network of sites, please use the URL on the Home Page to submit your link. If your site meets the standard, we will be happy to include it among the list of PREMIER sites.

Regards,

- Dan

Terry,

Take it easy man.  Patrick admitted many times the last year or two that he had little time to update the old P-L forum and that is probably why there was never a reciprocal link.  Patrick even admitted on more than one occasion that he did not answer emails and that spending time with his family was more important than working on the forum.  I think you can relate somewhat.  My few emails to you fell on deaf ears as well.

Dan,

As far as the new format I think it is much better than the old style format.  Sure it might take getting accustomed to especially if you have been a long time poster like Pete but even old dogs can learn a few new tricks.  I think if Pete continues to post on GW he will get the hang of it and it you are reading this Don Pedro, hang in there.

Nice post PABLO!!!   you definitely ARE a psycho!!!